<p>aglages, Loveispeac3 didn’t bring up AA in her original post so as to start an argument about it. She wants people to stop the discussion of AA, especially in threads that have NOTHING to do with AA (NuclearPenguins, I’m looking at you). Plain and simple.</p>
<p>If you want to rant about AA, then do so on another thread (“Race”) or even another board. Keep it off this one, we’re tired of it.</p>
<p>@davidthefat, If you feel that there is a need for a specialty board dedicated to Asians, whites, and all the others that you mentioned, take it up with the creators of the site. If you want it, go for it. No one is stopping you.</p>
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<p>Nor did I imply that it was up to me. I don’t tolerate gadflies: if I had my way, certain posts would have been deleted immediately. However, a good deal of the threads have been taken far off track as of late, and I think that we should return to our original purpose - giving admissions advice - in lieu of lobbing thinly veiled barbs at each other. It wouldn’t do for people with important questions to feel hesitant about posting in this forum because they were afraid of being attacked.</p>
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Sure…
It will be VERY interesting to see not only who brings up AA in this forum but also whether the poster who first uses the term will actually pay a price for that or whether there will only be selected repercussions to those that respond. I’m sure we won’t have to wait long for someone to ask how much better of a chance s/he has because of AA.
Sure hope you can take your own advice and not post about AA on this forum. We’ll see…</p>
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Agreed…unless of course it concerns AA. We wouldn’t want “those” type of important questions debated/asked in this forum.</p>
<p>You might not have “said this or that,” aglages, but you know where you’re posting. You may not be factually wrong in what you say but, here specifically, just be aware of those around you who might find your comments distasteful. Like the mod said in the other thread, courtesy.</p>
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<p>So aglages, you take it as your responsibility to personally attack anyone that brings up the subject of Affirmative action?Interesting. </p>
<p>Well, okay. Instead of senior member, lets call you the "affirmative action police"because you obviously DARE people to even mention about AA. You DARE them to be for it. IF a person even tries to be for AA YOU will certainly put them in there place.</p>
<p>I am officially ending this conversation of AA, and all to do with Affirmative action. Please do not comment any more to them. This is pointless and a waste of our time. Instead of inviting their conversation, I am simply going to ignore it. Misery loves company so I am sure not going to be the entertainer for it.There are far more important issues to talk about.</p>
<p>Key word is qualified and how you decide who is qualified? In some cases if you look at a top student in an inner city school with low SAT scores, without AA they would never have a shot. My mom went to a poor inner city HS in the 70s. She ranked 10 out of 1000 kids and was an A student. She scored 650 in math and 600 in cr reading. She graduated from an IVY league school with a 3.7 GPA. My point is that without AA she would never have had a shot of getting into any IVY league school. This is true of a lot of kids that attend schools that are not up to snuff. Should those students not be viewed differently given the resources that are available to them? In my mom’s school there was one college counselor for the entire senior class. When she performed poorly the first time she took the SAT, she was told that there was no point in her taking it again because she would not be able to raise her scores. Thank God she ignored this advice and actual improved her scores up 150 on math and up 100 in cr reading. Just because a score might be lower does not mean that someone is unqualified. Believe me there was no AA help to assist my mother with getting through the 4 years. She had to work very hard the first semester just to stay on top of everything. </p>
<p>As far as my comment on AA benefitting foreign blacks I have read this in more than one place but this is discussed by Dr. Michel A. Hernandez in her book A Is for Admission: The Insider’s Guide to Getting into the Ivy League and Other Top Colleges. There is a whole section dedicated to minority admissions. Very interesting. I attend a highly selective private school, and it is a running joke, that in my class, I am the only black american that I know. </p>
<p>Regarding the complete fallacy, I am not talking about Whites who fought against racism. I will say it again, because you missed the point, most people who complain about AA are not as passionate about fighting racism that they benefit from at the expense of someone else. You can’t change what you are not even willing to admit. I notice that you did not rant about the athlete who gets in with lower scores? Is that fair? Did you rant about the poor with kid from Maine who got in with lower scores? Is that fair? Did you rant about the rich wite legacy kid who got in with lower scores? Is that fair? Is it fair that in the richest country in the world that there exists gross educational disparities accross the US. I live in one of the poorest cities in the nation, the public school system stinks. I was fortunate enough to be able to attend highly selective private schools my whole life. Big difference between 12 kids to a class, state of the art facilities, teachers that are available to you almost 24/7 and 30 kids to a class, run down facilities, and teachers who are almost never available to you. Knowing who I am, I would venture to say that I would still be a top student in a public school, but I bet my SAT and ACT scores would not nearly be as high, and yet without AA, I would not be given a shot if I had not had the good fortune to attend a private school. Would I be less qualified? From an SAT score perspective maybe, but whether I attended a public or private school was totally out of my control. Why should a student, no matter what their ethnicity, gender, or class status be judged by the same standards as another student who has had every advantage. Makes no sense to me. Two white males, One is upper middle class, educated parents, attends a public school in upper middle class neigborhood, A student, top 10%, High SAT scores. Should this kid be compared the same as a White male from rural area in appalachia, A student, top 10% of his class, Slightly lower SAT scores, first generation college. Should these applicants be looked at apples to apples. I don’t think so?</p>
<p>I find it amusing that I have never heard anyone say, that they are so ****ed that Athletes get in with lower scores, and that is because in this country athleticism is still more valued than diversity. It is a fallacy that AA means that you accept unqualified candidates. It has never meant that. I want any school that I attend to be diverse. I want to get to know peope for different social economic, geographic, ethnic, gender, and racial backgrounds. I want to know the athlete, the geek, and the artist. Without AA most of our colleges and unviversity would be what they where in the 40s and 50s, mostly rich white males, but no worries, athletes would still get in.</p>
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I didn’t say that I would “attack” anyone. Reading comprehension is a skill that you may want to work on before attempting college level work. We wouldn’t want you to end up being another stereotyped negative statistic.
Grow up. The “let me just say this and then I’m not talking about it anymore” is childish. If you’re done then just quit discussing it on this forum. As I said previously: It will be VERY interesting to see not only who brings up AA in this forum but also whether the poster who first uses the term will actually pay a price for that or whether there will only be selected repercussions to those that respond.</p>
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<li><p>The original poster definitely mentioned Affirmative action, so to claim that nobody else is allowed to do so sounds a bit childish to me. </p></li>
<li><p>Andphilmont, your post is very thoughtful. However, many of the disparities that you mention in your post are economic. For example, what is it, intrinsically, that separates a hard working student like your mother, in a failing public school, from another white or asian hard working student in the same public school? Shouldn’t colleges consider applicants in the context of their situation? Because it was not the fact that your mother was black that made her an attractive applicant. In theory, it was the fact that she was hard working and accomplished much in light of her circumstances. So why shouldn’t affirmative action be based on socioeconomic status as opposed to race? </p></li>
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<p>Also, bringing up athletics does not work when comparing the edge that athletes get in admissions compared to that of minorities. What’s the difference, then, between a minority with a boost in admissions and an athlete who got a similar boost? Athletes worked their entire lives to be some of the best in all of America and the world at their sport. A black person was born black. A Colombian was born Colombian. I hope that you can see the difference. </p>
<p>The most severe harm, in my personal opinion, of Affirmative Action is the message that it sends to minority students. That constant paternalistic whisper, shrieking, “you aren’t good enough.” As a person who’s always worked to achieve the best grades and highest test scores that I could, and balance those feats along with sports and other extracurricular activities, these comments would come as a personal affront. And this is the whisper heard by thousands of qualified minority students each year. </p>
<p>Oh, I forgot to mention. I am actually in favor of Affirmative Action.</p>
<p>aglages, if you’re going to quote me, quote my entire sentence.
@aglages and newsperrys, reread my post. Nowhere in my post did I say the original poster did NOT mention AA. She made her intentions clears: she wants people to stop talking about it on this board.
The moderator has already said that if anyone wants to discuss AA, there’s a thread for it.</p>
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Please…LOL. The title of the thread is “Can I rant please?” What her intentions were for mentioning AA and her feelings about those that discuss it are relevant points for discussion. Perhaps you should re-read the OP in this thread.</p>
<p>It will be VERY interesting to see not only who brings up AA in this forum but also whether the poster who first uses the term will actually pay a price for that or whether there will only be selected repercussions to those that respond…including those that just want to “rant”.</p>
<p>okay look aglages. We get it, you really find it interesting on who brings AA up on the forum okay. I got you, your interested. </p>
<p>But really, I’m ranting about you and nuclear penguins, not the discussion of AA in a whole. All I am mad about is you two always finding your self to be in a position of entitlement where you feel you should say something about it. No one asked your opinion, and no one is asking for an argument with you either. </p>
<p>You deem it on YOUR self to attack people. And dont even try to say you dont because you would be a damn liar. You are just so close-minded. Its ridiculous. Even if you did give advice on this board, I wouldn’t even accept it because of your history of harassment. </p>
<p>No one is trying to argue about AA. Obviously, we have argued about it in the past. And we expressed how we feel.
But now that time is over. It does not matter if you are for AA or against it. That conversation needs to be done. Point blank period. </p>
<p>No where in my post did I say, “okay lets talk about AA”. I said can we end this conversation of AA because no one wants to talk about it. If you want to talk about AA, then do it in a civilized manner. Not trying to attack others ideas and pick apart their opinion. </p>
<p>If you are going to say I brought up the conversation of AA, have concrete facts and in the right context. Don’t just bring it up and think you can start discussing your opinion. Thats not what the subject is about. Thats not the original post at all. </p>
<p>If you want to talk about AA, and do it in the right context, then do it. But so far, you have tried attack me and belittle me. And that is all you can do, IS TRY. </p>
<p>Newsperry, </p>
<p>Mentioning Affirmative action and asking to discuss it are two different context. I love how your trying to be neutral, but you also need to get some facts straight too. </p>
<p>Reread the first post, where do I mention I want to argue about it, be attacked, or invite meaningless criticism. </p>
<p>I did know there was going to be opposition, and some people who attacked me, but I was certainly not inviting it or the type of comments aglages said.</p>
<p>Loveispeac3, if anything in my conversations with you, you are the one attacking me. How am I in a position of entitlement? You often jump to conclusions like this, trying to put words into my mouth. The way I see it we are all equals here, and I definitely have not been harassing anyone here. </p>
<p>IMO you are the harasser and the one who is not debating in a civilized manner. You ignore my points, call me out, slam and insult me. You even post about me in other threads, which I never do about you.</p>
<p>Meanwhile I provide facts, even giving you links which you magically ignore. I continue posting because you never provide a response to the points I am making; you instantly jump to attacking me.</p>
<p>Despite my differences in opinions with other posters like Marine and newsperry (who you attack as well for some reason I don’t know about, it’s just all very hostile), they at least provide their own counterarguments and try to discuss this in a civilized manner.</p>
<p>I wasn’t even going to post in this thread until you called me out.</p>
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Obviously Loveispeac3 makes this stuff up as s/he goes.
Absolutely correct. Again Loveispeac3 makes this stuff up as s/he goes.
You’re not alone. Loveispeac3 makes this stuff up as s/he goes.
Amen brother.</p>
<p>Nuclear Penguins, I do not attack you. EVER! You attacked me. Which really really got me angry. I haven’t attacked newsperry nor MArine. Don’t try to make me seem like the bad person here. I don’t “magically” ignore your little link examples. I see them, but don’t reply back Because my position is not trying to argue about AA at that time. I’m done with arguing for AA against you two.That conversation has been over. I’m trying to stop you two from talking about it because I find it very offensive and obviously others on here do too. </p>
<p>What are you two getting defensive about? Me the harasser? HA! your funny.
Debating in a civilized manner?I have stopped debating with you about this issue a longg time ago. I just really want you to go away.</p>
<p>I’m jumping to conclusions? How? What am I jumping to? What exactly are you talking about?</p>
<p>I have no problem with anyone on this board except for you, aglages, and davidthefat. </p>
<p>I’m not calling you out! This is not a battle. </p>
<p>So anyway. I am done with this conversation too. You guys can go ahead and talk about me on this thread. I don’t care. I’m going to something that is more important and worth time. </p>
<p>Good Riddance and have a great life you two.</p>
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God…I certainly hope this isn’t considered swearing, profanity or a violation of CC rules.</p>
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Unfortunately for you, there is something called post history here allowing me to see every one of your past posts. If this is not attacking somebody, I don’t know what is. </p>
<p>“So, Nuclear, you can just grow the hell up and stop trying to criticize what I am saying. You, just sound stupid arguing for no sake of arguing.”</p>
<p>“you guys are just dissecting what a person says and then just try(key word TRY) to destroy them when your just unhappy with your pathetic life.”</p>
<p>“***! You insecure little…ugh”</p>
<p>“And if you want to be a pompous A sshole. than go head. Knock yourself out. Literally.”</p>
<p>“OMGOSH! Nuclear Penguins is the worst! I had a back and forth with him for the longest and he is just such an a hole!”</p>
<p>“The conversation is turning back to those idiots.”</p>
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What happens is you make your point/statement, then I respond to that point/statement. I’m pretty sure the first time I brought up those links, we were discussing AA. Tell me, why do you find talking about AA offensive?</p>
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See above quotes where you insult and attack me. I don’t try to insult and attack you back. I am presenting my points, which are accompanied by facts and links, which you just ignore.</p>
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<p>You said that I do this: “Hey lets go on the AA board and argue about how unfair it is for them to get into these top schools because they don’t deserve it”</p>
<p>-Definitely not true.</p>
<p>“But just because you see another minority, who happens be…black maybe, doesnt mean you need to hate on them and the concept of Affirmative Action.”</p>
<p>-You’re saying I hate on minorities. Which I don’t.</p>
<p>You also said this: “A black person doesn’t only need to get into a school because of AA. They are just intelligent, hard-working, and determined just as you were to get into that school. The only difference is one thing, they got in and you didn’t”</p>
<p>-My response to that was: “I never said that a black person can’t get into a school unless they have AA… When did I say they are less intelligent, don’t work as hard, or are less determined to get into ____ school?”</p>
<p>“stop trying to ■■■■■ and down other African Americans, or any other ethnic group, on the board.”</p>
<p>-Again, I am not putting down any ethnic group.</p>
<p>“Because Nuclear, you are obviously one of those Asians that think when a black person gets into a great school that “its only because of AA””</p>
<p>-No…</p>
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Yeah you are, by posting my name in conversations I’m not even in, like this one: <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/12525205-post18.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/12525205-post18.html</a> and this one: <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/12595925-post33.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/12595925-post33.html</a></p>
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Lol, that’s what you said a few weeks ago. Bye.</p>
<p>Oh, now what problem do you have with me?</p>
<p>Many points have been made. Debate on Affirmative Action belongs here: <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-admissions/927219-race-college-admission-faq-discussion-8-a.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-admissions/927219-race-college-admission-faq-discussion-8-a.html</a></p>