<p>Hello, first post!</p>
<p>Is there a minimum standard for each fitness test that must be met in order to pass (as in at least 50 pushups or 6:00 mile etc)? I know that West Point posts the results that you would need to get an optimum score, but what exactly would be a passing score? Also, when does the CFA usually take place?</p>
<p>I have never seen minimum scores posted. They want candidates to do their very best not just get the minimum. In the 2006-2007 catalog that was sent to my son there is a chart to show averages (you want to do better than average). Here they are:</p>
<p>BB throw - male = 67 ft., female = 41 ft.
Pullups - male = 9, female = 3
Shuttle run - male = 9.1 sec., female = 10 sec.
situps - male = 72, female = 68
pushups - male = 54, female = 33
1 mile run - male = 6:43, female = 8:06</p>
<p>Candidates can take the CFA at Summer Leadership Seminar or one of your school's gym teachers can administer it. It needs to be done before the application deadline (remember - with admissions "early is on time and on time is late"). I would say most take it during the fall of their senior year. They send instructions in the admissions packet that goes out in August or September of your senior year.</p>
<p>There are no minimums. I was explicitly told this by one admissions officer. It's a competition and they check how far you are away from the bell-curve overall, which explains how one guy in my class did 15 pushups on the APFT but had still managed to get in. He had other credentials.</p>
<p>"There are no minimums"
Not true - There are minimum requirements for each CFA event as well as an overall passing score requirement. These minimum scores are not published. USMA is the only academy that holds candidates to this standard.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>About 99.999999999% sure that USNA is similiar.</p>
<p>The original intent of the CFA was that it would be a common standard. However, my understanding is that the other academies will make exceptions, but USMA will not. So yes, similar but not the same.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Since you don't know the standards, I assume this is either pure speculation on your part or perhaps hearsay from questionable sources..</p>
<p>No, not speculation, or from questionable sources. The minimum standards are set by the USMA admissions board and are not published for a reason - unfortunately one of them is to stop cheating. I have no idea what the USNA minimum standards are, but if you do please publish them.</p>
<p>Well, if you don't know the USMA standards and I don't know the USNA standards, sounds as if we are both speculating. Ever since the CFA's inception, USNA candidates have been asked to repeat the test, often with the caveat to concentrate on one or more of the areas. Initially, they only published the maximum goals, and a year or so later published averages. I speculate that USNA and USMA pretty much do the same thing for the same reasons, and you claim you don't speculate, but provide no backup, that they are different.</p>
<p>USNA69: The standards are different in that no exceptions to the minimum or overall required score are made for any candidate applying to WP. Other academies have dropped that standard and do make exceptions. If you would like to discuss further please PM me.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>I assume by this statement you mean USNA. Upon what information do you base it? Simple question.</p>
<p>^^^^^
USNA69 is correct regarding the CFA. Both West Point and USNA do not publish the minimum standards; however, they do publish the maximums and the averages for each event. Those maximums happen to be the same for USMA, USNA, and USAFA.</p>
<p>For both USMA and USNA, the CFA is a pass/fail test. There are no waivers and there are no exceptions.</p>
<p>The CFA was standardized so that candidates to the service academies would not have to take three different tests. One test covers all three academies.</p>
<p>To obtain an appointment, candidates to USNA must be qualified academically, medically, and physically (and have a nomination). I can assure you that there are many candidates who do not pass the CFA and are therefore ineligible for an appointment.</p>
<p>Yes, one test covers all 3 academies.
If you can guarantee that USNA or USAFA make no exceptions to the minimum standards of individual events then your information differs from mine.
After finding a strong correlation between upper body strength and injury rates during Beast, USMA has decided to hold their minimum standards - no exceptions.</p>
<p>I have no doubt what you say about USMA is true. I am just questioning the source of your information on USNA. Your statement is tacitly giving a USNA candidate cause to evaluate his own CFA results. Example: A candidate maxed a couple, scored above average on a couple, slightly below average on one, and totally bombing the run for example, and deciding on their own that since Ann stated that there was no standard, that they are good to go. In my opinion, a disasterous decision. But you tell us otherwise. I am just trying to weigh the validity of your remark. </p>
<p>USNA continues to keep it a closely guarded secret and I am very curious as to the source of your information. All I have is circumstantial evidence that indicates otherwise. USNA does still TRIPLE Qual candidates, with one of the triples being the CFA. If there were no standard, it would not be a qual.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>I always thought that there were FIVE academies, and the CFA covers FOUR of them (the USCGA uses a different test).</p>
<p>At no point have I said that USNA has no standards or given permission to USNA candidates to make their own evaluations about whether or not they have passed the CFA. How could they possibly do that without knowing what the minimums are. Advice is always "do the best you can". Nowhere is it ever stated that a candidate should aim for the minimum - that is why minimums are not published. Yes, candidates have to be triple qualified, but who decides when they are qualified? The individual academies do. Every admissions decision is based on a risk analysis. The different academies have different physical fitness risks. This is not an attack on any academy, it is common knowledge that the emphasis is slightly different at different academies.</p>
<p>"For both USMA and USNA, the CFA is a pass/fail test"</p>
<p>Not true. While candidates at USMA have to pass the CFA, it is also graded on a scale and counts for 10% of the whole candidate score (max CFA score = 10%). Therefore it is in the candidates interest to do as well as they can, and not just aim to pass (every point one can get on the WCS helps). USNA, USAFA and USMMA all have a pass/fail standard only.</p>
<p>^^^^^
If a candidate doesn't pass the CFA, 10 percent of nothing is still nothing. Plus the candidate isn't qualified to receive an appointment.</p>
<p>Yes, if you read my post the difference is clearly in passing not failing the CFA.</p>
<p>
[quote]
While candidates at USMA have to pass the CFA, it is also graded on a scale and counts for 10% of the whole candidate score (max CFA score = 10%). Therefore it is in the candidates interest to do as well as they can, and not just aim to pass (every point one can get on the WCS helps). USNA, USAFA and USMMA all have a pass/fail standard only.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>I am curious to know how you know this - do you have inside information? My daughter applied to both institutions last year.<br>
We could not find anywhere an explantion of how the CFA was graded by either institution. I think the maximums are the same. I do remember finding the averages on both admissions web sites and the averages for USMA was higher.</p>
<p>So for the sake of argument let's say that the CFA is converted to 100 points and 70 points is considered passing.<br>
Are you saying that at USNA if you get 70 points then you get the full 10% awarded to your WCS and at USMA if you get 70 points you will only get 70% of the available points for the CFA awarded to your WCS and that you need to max (get 100%) in the test to get the full 10% of the CFA points awarded to your WCS?</p>
<p>As an aside, my daughter took it on a very cold day with a cold. She didn't think she did very well and at a meeting at USMA with an admissions rep she asked if she could take it again. He looked at it and said "No, It it too late (in the admissions process) and you did fine anyway". That was the only comment we got out of admissions.</p>
<p>I do know that during the admissions process USMA will sometimes ask candidates if they would retake the test.</p>