Case Western Computer Science Reputation

<p>Wow, this is way late . . . I’m sorry I didn’t see this post months ago. Our son is leaving for CWRU tomorrow for his freshman year - the van is packed. He will be studying computer engineering, but with a lot of interest in CS. He was accepted at University of Rochester, Rensselaer, Rose-Hulman and WPI as well. But, he chose CWRU based upon an excellent visit, great merit money (he received some merit money everywhere, but CWRU was $10k cheaper than any other school), Division III sport team that he bonded with and that CWRU was the most urban school that he visited (he grew up near an urban area).</p>

<p>I think, ultimately, his decision was based upon a sense of “fit” that he experienced while at Case. As professional parents, we tried to guide him in a way that was partially influenced by “rankings” but most importantly by finding an institution that most fit his personality and learning. We were somewhat unsure about Case, but do believe that it is under-appreciated for a variety of reasons.</p>

<p>Our son was impressed by Case’s choice of freshman reading - “Quiet” a NY Times best seller that speaks to the power of an introvert in an extrovert society. I think he sees himself there and has already made connections online.</p>

<p>We think (hope) that this decision was correct and that he will thrive in this environment. Regardless of the rankings, all of our kids have the opportunity to make the best of whatever college decision they make.</p>

<p>Best wishes to your son! I think he made a great choice. I agree that it is overlooked and underrated, but I know that it is well respected in the engineering world.
My son also was really impressed by Case even though he eventually chose WPI. We all really enjoyed our visit to the campus - everyone was extremely helpful and friendly, the facilities excellent and the nearby Italian neighborhood was an extra bonus ;)</p>

<p>I was also impressed with Case, and the scholarship they offered, but my son ultimately chose RPI, another on your short list. He will be a sophomore next week.</p>

<p>Just wanted to add some additional insights to what has been posted here. I have an undergrad BS in computer engineering from CWRU so all of the classes are in the EECS department for computer science, computer engineering, and electrical engineering. If you consider this, you may see some of the issue with the program. It is not particularly well-defined in terms of what exactly a graduate from this program knows. Also, some faculty members are old and out of date, and others are annoying know-it-alls who only care for their publications. It is not particularly kind to undergraduates in the sense that the professors do not make themselves available but the TA’s try really hard to make up for this, there are not a lot of extra resources provided even as far as something like “additional reading” on a class syllabus which I learned to appreciate much later in my graduate degree in CS at George Mason. I think GQ Zhang was one of the most defining characters in all of my education and had a profound effect on my skill level and awareness of the fact that there is always more to know. So there are gems there. </p>

<p>The reality is though that the students are very overworked. Some professors are very old-school in a weird way that is not very kind, and I don’t think they notice how this ultimately affects the community’s perception of the school. The administration really doesn’t care or pay attention to the inner workings of this department. We had one professor who literally stole the entire class from Stanford, giving no credit and not nearly the support to the students that Stanford does, and when we all signed a petition about it they got this person removed from teaching that class for I believe only one semester, then right back to it. </p>

<p>I am not sad that I went to CWRU. Many older people in the field are well aware that Donald Knuth came from there, and that in general it is a rigorous atmosphere. I got accepted at Rose-Hulman (kill me with a spoon, all work and no play makes jack a dull boy and weird utopian atmosphere), RIT (underground tunnels seemed oppressive even for a Cleveland native just to avoid some snow), Purdue (blech, dirtiest school I visited I don’t care about their reputation), and U of Mich, too huge for me to handle. </p>

<p>I LOVE the Cleveland art museum and I treasure my memories of the lagoon at night during my undergrad years, Cleveland in general is beautiful and underappreciated. There is plenty to do on campus. But it’s an odd place. Computer science students also are not apt to help each other to grow for fear of I guess competition. I think that CWRU did a bad job of representing itself as some hugely awesome tech school in the late '90’s with that whole most-wired campus thing and honestly that kind of thing plays out over many years to make other people just scoff at it and say what did they really know? But I really wonder, I mean CMU is supposed to be CWRU’s sister school but I do not see them sharing the wealth. The opportunities provided to CMU students for careers and support are much broader. I don’t understand this.</p>

<p>To be frank, I have heard from other colleagues that schools like Cornell and Harvard pander to their students, making it easier for them and grading very leniently just because they made it there, even one of my professors at George Mason who studied under Aho (one of the authors of the Dragon Book) said that he gave almost everyone an A because “he did not want to discourage anyone”. So take it as you will. Rankings are mostly useless, it’s just a payoff scheme and popularity contest. But CWRU graduates are strong, I have a very strong career as a developer and manager and had no problem with my graduate program. It is an insidious cancer the poverty and wealth disparity, politicking of the Rust Belt, the focus on landscaping and the medical program that ultimately detract from what could be a super powerhouse of amazing students.</p>

<p>I don’t want to sidetrack the thread, but I found this article about MSFT interesting</p>

<p>[Stack</a> ranking: Steve Ballmer’s employee-evaluation system and Microsoft’s decline.](<a href=“http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2013/08/23/stack_ranking_steve_ballmer_s_employee_evaluation_system_and_microsoft_s.html]Stack”>Stack ranking: Steve Ballmer's employee-evaluation system and Microsoft's decline.)</p>

<p>For the OP: CS is an area where students have many opportunities to show what they can do outside of the classroom. A CS student with some visible work out there, say on github, will be way ahead of a student who has only done class projects. Working on an open source project is a way to show off both programming skills and passion/enthusiasm, etc.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>This reminded me of a famous prank fiction story someone wrote at my CS alma mater (University of Louisiana at Lafayette) 30 years ago, since we had the same issue. That was before the internet so it was not preserved. </p>

<p>The story was titled “The Search for Dr. Hassan” whereas Dr. Hassan, a valued member of the CS faculty, was always traveling or lecturing away from campus and had his TA’s fill in (or lecture via videotape). The story follows the protagonist, a hapless undergraduate, inquiring his way thru various levels of advisors, administrators, and the like, only to find out that Dr. Hassan had passed away a year earlier and nobody told the students… The characters, all caricatures of real people, were instantly recognizable and quite believable…</p>

<p>Bottom line, things haven’t changed much for some people in decades :). I also attended Purdue for another major where we did have more brand name profs; a lot were great, but some often reminded us how lucky we were to be there, and so on. Grading wise, I thought Purdue (grad) was a lot easier than I expected it to be (A = 85 and heavy curving) but that was in the mid 90’s, things have changed as I talked to one of my co-ops from Purdue today. Today, Purdue undergrad is very rigorous, as expected in a school of its kind. Not impossible but rigorous. </p>

<p>I’m keeping an eye for CWRU as it is on DD2’s short list in a couple years…</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>That’s how it is, no matter the school. 30 years ago we were the ones in the computer center 24/7 answering homework questions because it was fun and good for our image. Not any more I guess :)</p>

I wonder how your son likes cwru after more than 3 years. The reason is that my son get accepted to CWRU for cs also. It is high in his list. It will be helpful to get you or your son’s perspective after his 3 years in cwru. Thanks in advance!

@dadofsfboyz Sent you a PM

@2sunny - my son is considering CWRU for CS as well. Can you give some perspective in a PM to me?

@LurkerDad2 OK, also FYI http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/case-western-reserve-university/1729119-a-definitive-objective-description-of-case-western-by-a-current-student-p6.html

https://students.case.edu/career/resources/survey/doc/2016fds.pdf

seems like a lot of important computer scientists once studied at Case, Don Knuth ,Craig Newark, and many prominent Silicon Valley types

It’s annoying when you check a thread to get an update and general, relevant information is sent by PM.
@2sunny: without revealing anything personal, can you recap some elements about you son’s experience? Would he/you recommend it to a prospective student interested in cs?
@LurkerDad2 @dadofsfboyz : can you speak about your sons’ choices, if they visited cwru what they thought, etc…
Thank you!! :slight_smile:

@MYOS1634 he did not choose Case Western. In my opinion, the negative (plan on extra snow). The positive: good scholarships and great CS. Also, it is good for someone who wants to be near museums, and to embrace the city vibes & culture. I believe that it’s a great option, but I also think that public colleges can also gave a great opportunity! The campus visit is how we chose our final place! The student just “knows” when they visit!