Can anyone speak about CCM’s or Indiana’s piano program and teachers? I have narrowed my choices down to these two now. As far as cost, CCM is more affordable than Indiana by about 10K. Just not sure if it’s worth spending that extra money for studying at Indiana. By the way, I do know that Indiana is a better school.
???
Indiana is a bigger school than CCM, and in general IU is a more competitive admit from what I know. As in all these discussions, it really depends on yourself and what you need. For example, the level at Indiana among piano students is likely, on average, to be better than CCM, there will be a wider range of students at CCM than IU. The real question here is about teachers (which I cannot answer, I don’t know piano), what studios did you get into at CCM? And how do those teachers stack up to IU’s faculty that you could study with…have you decided what teachers you want to try and study with at IU (from what I remember, you don’t go for a studio assigned until you get into IU)…that is going to be the critical decision. If the Piano teacher you would be able to study with at IU looks to be a much better fit for you, that you think would drive yourself forward, than the extra 10k may be worth it, if you have teacher choices as CCM that appear to be just okay, and there is a dynamic teacher or teachers you can study with at IU, then yes, it may be worth it.
It also comes down to environment, CCM is much smaller than IU, and you might be happier at a small program than at a big one like Indiana.I couldn’t tell from CCM’s website if they allow dual degree programs, if you wanted to do a dual degree and CCM doesn’t offer it (I suspect they do, just not 100% certain), then IU might be worth it. Also, what kind of performance opportunities are there at both schools? With IU being larger, maybe it is harder to get performing opportunities than at CCM, because they have so many more students to schedule (and that is a hypothetical, I don’t have the answer to that).
40k is not a small amount of money, and it should weigh into the decision, but only if you truly feel that you could move forward with a teacher at CCM, feel comfortable with the studios you got into. If you are doing this blind, where you didn’t do sample lessons and such, then it is going to come down to looking at the reputation of the teachers. That is hard, because there are gem teachers who may be young and reputation is often based on performer’s performance careers, which may have nothing to do with how good a teacher they are, but if all you have is looking at the teacher’s reputations, then try and figure out pianists who have studied with the teacher and see what they have done. That 10k will only be worth it if IU for piano for you (and I emphasize the you) seems to be so much better than CCM, CCM is a respected music program, so whatever you choose it is likely not going to be a negative, as long as the teaching is there…you don’t mention what studios you got into, I suspect people aren’t answering because without knowing the studios, even if they know piano they cannot really answer (and even then, it is tough, because one person’s gold with a teacher is another’s lead). I would say that unless somehow you feel you are being stuck with the bottom of the CCM staff, and if that 10k will put a stretch on your financial situation (especially if that means going into debt), there would be reason to go to CCM, you don’t want to go into debt for UG music if you can help it.
another way of looking at this…
go to CCM and save the extra $40,000
then find a top piano teacher… how many
lessons will she/he give for $40,000? 
prior to quitting piano and switching to a
string instrument, my SSD’s piano teacher
“only” charged $250 per 90-minute lesson.
the teacher was very good and placed
3rd in the Tchaikovsky competition when
he was young… then moved to the US.
at least 17 of his former students went
on to attend Julliard and Curtis. my SSD
was not able to cope with the pressure
of being his student and ended up quitting
piano.(but that wasn’t necessarily a bad
thing… when one door closes, another one
opens. )
my point is that $40,000 could have paid
for his lessons for 3 or 4 years. (assuming
1 90-minute lesson per week x 52 weeks x $250)
IMHO, if CCM is offering you a stimulating environment for $40K less…why wouldn’t you do that? It has a very good reputation too. A teacher would really need to be something to be worth $40K. That can buy you a whole lot of freedom to continue to work on your skills after UG.
I have already been accepted into a studio at IU. This prof. normally don’t accept undergrads, so I will be in a high powered studio. Based on the generous offer from CCM, I may be the best, if not one of the top 2 students there. Not sure if it’s a good thing to be the biggest fish in any school.
Apso555, I agree!
Apso555,
If you have the extra $40,000, go for school that your really want!
Also, there is no harm in asking if IU might match your CCM award. They can always say no, but might move in your direction.
IU does consider requests for re-evaluation of financial aid. Also, $40,000 tuition spread over 4 years may seem like a lot, but you should not rule out the potential lifetime benefits of studying at the superior institution.
Didn’t know about the teacher. We in the end paid slightly more for IU (compared with some schools not all) due in part to the teacher (my D also got a studio offer). We also paid more for the whole “package” that IU offered. Most of her other schools were small LACs. She started feeling hesitant about such small environments.
Do ask for more money. My D was just at IU working with her old coach and meeting with her teacher. They continue to watch her progress. She did audition at CCM for grad school and really liked the environment and knows a teacher there. So I do think the schools are both good (unfortunately I don’t know piano). But the teacher part is tough. Good luck.
Also you don’t bring up the issue of debt. And since I work in finance I just can’t leave this unsaid.
If debt is not an issue or would be manageable at IU, then you are fortunate and can pay a premium for the teacher. Go for it!
If the $40K will be debt and you are planning on grad school, this does become more problematic. You absolutely should sit down with your parents and do a financial calculator to see what your payments will be monthly after graduation - and for how many years. If the $40K is debt, I would go to CCM and work extra hard under your own initiative (and there has to be a teacher and few grad students there that can challenge a Freshman - or at least ask the teacher if you are unsure). However it is your call and should include your parents.
In the end a teacher and school name can matter BUT they do not provide a guarantee of financial success. Whereas big debt (not small) is always a ball and chain on your future…guaranteed.
Absolutely, ask IU for more money. All they can do is say no. You will need to get on this ASAP. Call them and tell them you would like to appeal your award and they will send you a form you need to complete and get submitted. You can also appeal your award once you are in the program (with a reason and a letter from your teacher). DS appealed his initial offer and after freshman year and was successful with both.
Hello all ~ Doesn’t CCM have a very good reputation as a music school??
Symphonyart, Yes, CCM is a great music school, but I believe Indiana is better (according to all the rankings).
CCM is a very good music school and comparing music schools is difficult, because there are so many factors involved. For example, IU has a huge music program, they admit a lot more students then most or all of the other ‘top tier programs’, and as a result the range of student at IU is going to be broader than it will be at let’s say a Juilliard/Curtis and other of the very selective schools, that is simply supply and demand, you admit more students, the range is going to be higher. That doesn’t mean IU isn’t a great music school or a top tier one, you still need to be at the top of your game to get in there…also perceptions play into this, Juilliard for example has a name, a brand, all over the world, and they get so many kids wanting to go there that they can pick among the best of those and easily have enough kids to fill their entrance, and Juilliard has about a 95% rate of kids admitted to going there last I checked…whereas a school like CCM has a lot less kids applying there, and because they don’t necessarily have the brand, they aren’t flooded necessarily with the ‘top students’…
It means that CCM may not be considered as competitive overall, but there are other factors. Faculty in the area you are in is important, a great teacher can have a studio that rivals the best music school out there (let’s say for example, Juilliard or Curtis" and attract the very best students who want to study with them…and may get them because CCM very well may offer an attractive aid package, whereas the same student at Juilliard may be faced with a huge bill…
Rankings don’t take that into account, they tend to look at things like admission rates (so Juilliard, that takes like 6%, is gonna be up there), they look at things like prestige of faculty (which may or may not mean they are great teachers), and often like USNWR, the rankings are an outright joke, where they basically apply the same standards they do to academic schools to come up with some mashed together mess.
It is why people on here enumerate the various factors of a school, and that going to a Juilliard may not be the best path for a certain student, depending on financials and yes, the teacher. In the end it comes down to rankings, weighted rankings a student does that factors in things like how good a studio they are getting into, how much they can afford/school is going to cost them, and to another level if they need to be driven forward by being around kids who are much better than them or if they are self driven and a good teacher will do it…My son faced something like that, cost wasn’t a factor for us (we were very very fortunate with that), and his choice came down to a ‘better’ school with an unknown studio, or a teacher he really wanted to study with whose studio is as good or better than the studios at the ‘better’ school, but where the overall school is less competitive…
So yes, CCM is a good school, but its overall level of students is not going to be as high as IU (even with their large admissions size), and it likely will boil down to the studio you would be in, how good the CCM teacher is versus the IU one, and the cost factors and overall fit with the school.Think of a number of factors about the school, and assign a weighted value to them (hypothetically, 1-4 in importance), then give a number in each area. So if where the school is located is somewhat important, give that a weighting factor of 2. Teacher should be high, so studio would be a 4. If money is tight, then affordabiity might be a 3, level of student playing on average if you need to be driven forward might be a 3, if self motivated, a 2 or 1. Performing opportunities might be a 2 for you…and so forth.
Then, for each program , give a grade on 1-10 scale, and multiply by the weight. So for example
Teacher School A is an 8, B is a 6, multiply by 4 (so 32 and 24)
Student Level A is a 6, B is a 9, so with weight of let’s say 2, that is 12 and 18.
Location: A is a 7, B is a 5, for you that was a 1, so it would be 7 and 5
Affordability: A is 3, B is 8, so 9 and 24.
And so forth. You don’t get a magic number out of this, in the end it might come down to gut feel, but it forces you to think of parameters and put a number on them, weigh them. It is kind of like Jung thought of Tarot cards, that they didn’t predict the future, rather what they did was make people get in touch with what they were already feeling about something, these are kind of like that. It could be A turns out to be a higher ranking, but something about B grabbed you, where even if A is more affordable, B just seemed to do it for you…but by enumerating it, you are kind of forcing yourself to make the argument to go with or against the numbers:)