@Twoin18 @Tigerle Thank you so much for your helpful feedback! I think I’d still try to get in for PPE, however, not law, because although law is extremely interesting to me, I feel that going the PPE route gives me the chance to come back to the US, or continue working in UK for something more business related. @Tigerle I see exactly where you’re coming from in regards of Brexit, and so feel safer in applying for PPE rather than law, and if need be, taking a conversion course afterwards if I decide to pursue law in the UK. Perhaps I can get a work permit, but I don’t feel the need to concern myself over that currently.
In terms of PPE, is there any way I can significantly boost my chances outside of getting a good SAT score (my teachers expect that I’ll get a 5 on the AP World test, and I’ve already taken the Math level 2 subject test, in which I got a 750, might be trying again for a 500, not sure) Based on my PSAT score (I took one this year), my counselor expects that I get no less than a 1560. I know that extracurricular activities don’t matter, but outside of taking more AP classes, something I don’t want to do too much of and get bad scores on the AP test, I’m at a loss for what to do.
In addition, I’ve taken college level courses in philosophy, business, design, HTML, and I’m taking a college level course in law this summer.
You need to love the subject. So do you read philosophy for fun? Have you contributed articles to a website/journal on philosophical issues? Joined political organizations? Looked for an internship with a local politician? Done a college course in economics? Found a professor of economics at a local college that needs help with field research?
There are many different things to do, whether as ECs (also helpful in US applications) or just for the sake of learning. Closer to the time you’d need to study for the TSA, then you’d need to read up to prepare for an interview if you got one.
Sounds like what you really want is BESS at Trinity Dublin.
If you want to prepare: You need to read a lot about each of the topics. Being self directed will help - make the list yourself, the planning, stick to it. You have six months to read and annotate a minimum of 12 books.
All your activities must be somehow related to the subjects you’ll study.
Unconditional offers are very rare - you’d likely need straight As in 2 philosophy classes, 2-3 Political Science classes, and 3 economics classes taken at a community college, plus math through Calculus 2 and calc-based statistics at a minimum (higher preferable). Or 2 philosophy classes +1 post AP class each in math, econ, and gov, all with straight A’s.
@Twoin18 Those are really good recommendations, and I’ll look into them. What is the TSA? It’s been mentioned before, but every time I look it up it just says ‘transportation security admin.’ so I’m at a loss. I haven’t done a college course in econ, so I’ll be looking to do that soon.
Also, I do read philosophy for fun, this past weekend I just bought myself a ton of new books. Honestly, I’m not that involved with anything as much politically, so, I’ll try to read the news more, that’s what the Oxford website recommends in it’s rec. reading list. The internship with a local politician sounds really cool-is that an opportunity commonly available to high schoolers? If so, I’ll try to figure out if I can do that. (My main concern is that I only turn 16 in September, and I won’t be able to do much over the summer because of age requirements to work.)
@MYOS1634 Unfortunately, although the program sounds nice, I would feel really uncomfortable in Ireland-I’ve never been there before, and I feel that the extremely unfamiliar culture that I’ve never experienced before might overwhelm me at a time where I really want to study and focus on academics. It seems like a really good program.
In addition, I’m a little nervous about the rest of your message-there is a philosophy class at my high school, but it’s unweighted, and an easy A. Should I still take it? I’m not sure, because I stocked up on APs next year and might not be able to fit it on my schedule. Perhaps I can take it over summer or at my local community college. I don’t know of any place with political science courses, so I’m at a loss for what to do on that. I’m taking an econ class senior year, but I haven’t done anything else. Perhaps I’ll see if I can do at the community college or from an online class. Your recommendations are really helpful-thank you!
I meant classes at a local college. Oxford or Cambridge consider that first year courses (and even second year courses) are what you’re supposed to know before you start there.
You’d need to start this summer and add as you go so that by Ocotver of senior year you’ve taken and gotten As in all the classes listed.
Dublin and Cambridge will both be a big cultural shock. Living in the UK as a young adult will be very different from living there as a child so if you don’t feel you can live in Dublin What makes you think you’ll be able to handle Oxford or Cambridge better?
ROFL
Seriously. If you can manage the US & the UK, you can manage Ireland- it is not an “extremely unfamiliar culture”. You only want Oxford, fine- own it. You only want the UK, fine- own it. But unless you have a profound hostility to something about Ireland, it is a nonsense to say that the reason you won’t think of applying there is b/c you are afraid of being ‘overwhelmed’ by the culture. (n.b., I have been involved with multiple universities in all 3 countries, including both Trinity* and Oxford).
The TSA is the Thinking Skills Assessment, and you can’t have even looked at the “How To Apply” tab on the PPE website (https://www.ox.ac.uk/admissions/undergraduate/courses-listing/philosophy-politics-and-economics?wssl=1) if you couldn’t figure out what it is.
If you are a serious candidate for PPE at Oxford you should be reading The Economist every week, nearly cover-to-cover.
*Trinity was set up in 1592 as an analogue to Oxford and Cambridge, and has a cross-relationship with Oxford
Look. I made this thread to see what my chances were at Oxford, with my grades in mind. I truly appreciate the help from those of you who have helped. As a reminder I made this thread about Oxford and to say that I’m close-minded about going to other places is unfair-because all I’m really asking is about Oxford. I didn’t come to ask my shot at Cambridge, or Imperial College. And yes, Oxford is undoubtedly my dream school, and that’s why I’m asking for this information.
@MYOS1634 While I respect your opinion, I frequently visit the UK and feel pretty at home there. Honestly, I don’t know much about Dublin-if anything, so I figure that I would probably adapt worse.
@collegemom3717 You’re correct in saying I don’t know how well I would adapt to Dublin or any other place, but I also have to keep in mind that my parents will not allow me to go to a country they’ve never even been to or know much about for my college. And yeah, I like the UK. I grew up there, I have fond memories of the place. I have never beem to Ireland before. I do not have any idea of what it’s like. If I told you to visit a random place you’ve heard of, but know NOTHING about, I’d figure you’d feel pretty uncomfortable going there, with no idea of what it’s like.
Also, I know college-goers who have had home sickness, even while staying in the same country.It’s a possibility I’d feel like that, but then you add on the fact that I can’t go back home very often because of airfare, and that becomes worse. You could point out that the UK would be the same, but it wouldn’t. Because I do feel at home there, and have friends there too, who are practically like my extended family.
OK, that makes sense, but the BESS program does sound like what you want educationally and Trinity Dublin is very prestigious. So, it’d meet your and your parents’ requirements. (And if your parents are used to the UK, they’d be fine with Dublin - ask them.) Dublin is closer to the UK than San Francisco to Los Angeles. The cultural difference between the UK and Ireland is similar to NoCal SoCal. There are definite differences but you know you’re part of a broad, similar cultural group with many commonalities. I understand, it’s as if someone who grew up in France were told to go to Belgium. But it’s still very close even if it’s different. Keep it in mind for later.
However, the way you describe the UK, you don’t mean “the UK”. You mean the place where you grew up. That’s okay. Kids travel “back” all the time and if you’re trying to “get back”, “near” won’t do.
Note that while you started the thread about Oxford, most posters are going to mention other opportunities, especially since pretty much no one applies just to Oxford. In a year, you’ll start making a list and you’ll need 5 UCAS choices in addition to your US safeties (2, affordable, that you like and where you’re above the to 25% threshold), matches (3-5, affordable, that you like and where you’re near the 25% threshold), and as many reaches as you want or can afford.
Trinity is CAO BTW. So you have 4 more UCAS choices to find. You have plenty of time.
@MYOS1634 You’re right about other schools to apply to. With my grades, do you know what schools would be reaches and target schools for me in the UK? I don’t see the point in applying to safety schools in the UK because then I might as well attend a college here. Thanks-your advice has been really useful.
I think you may be looking at it the wrong way.
If you get a bunch of 5’s in relevant AP’s, a bunch of good schools are near safeties.
If you don’t get 5’s, then they are reaches.
St. A’s is moving towards American-style admissions, but for other unis, admissions is much more cut-and dried (other than Oxbridge, LSE, Imperial, and maybe UCL, where getting 5’s just gives you a chance).
I second TCD and BESS.
@PurpleTitan If getting tons of 5s gives you a chance, does it mean I have to perform at the interview, or is there something else I should be doing? I’m currently doing a lot of reading/research into relevant areas (I’m starting off with philosophy and econ) but other than that, is there a way to up my chances?
Only Oxbridge have required interviews, I believe.
But getting 5’s in relevant AP’s is the main hurdle.
Your personal statement and teacher recs are important as well.
to clarify: for PPE at Oxford, 5s (achieved / predicted) on APs, a good PS & LOR, and a strong TSA score are the pre-requisites for getting an invitation to interview. The interview itself is make or break for getting an offer (conditional or unconditional) of a place (it can also affect the terms of the offer).
And the interview is an oral examination about the subject and your ability to use what you know about it to reason on a problem they pose. it is NOT like a US college interview.
Be careful with your AP choices. As far as I can recall (and this information will be available somewhere on Oxford University’s website) they only consider ‘preferred’ AP courses - for example off the top of my head AP Psychology is not considered ‘preferred’ and therefore is not accepted as one of your AP’s for admission.
The reason that some UK universities do this is that an AP course is considered a ‘lightweight’ A level and so those supposedly ‘easier’ AP courses are dropped at the more prestigous universities. I think AP Stats is another one - considered to be an ‘easier’ AP Math course…
The ‘preferred’ or “A” / “B” AP distinction is officially gone (except for LSE, which still specifies a list of preferred ones)- but the tutors still see a distinction. Interestingly, the PPE tutors that I know are pretty sniffy about Micro/Macro, but they do count.
AP Micro/Macro = AS Economics, so one more Economics course would be the minimum expected to do well on interview.