Chances to tweak college list

Applying to College
21

<p>i have to be honest. i think its going to be difficult for you to get into a majority of the colleges on your list.</p>

<p>University of Chicago - reach
University of Illinois-Urbana Champaign - Safety
Northwestern University - Slight reach
Wellesley College - slight reach
Swarthmore College - reach
Amherst College - Far Reach
Barnard College - Match
Stanford University - Far Reach
Princeton University- Far Reach
Yale University- Far Reach</p>

<p>nothing in your ecs really stick out. your stats aren't spectacular so i dont think it's likely u will be admitted to yale stanford princeton amherst swathmore. remember that ppl with 1600/1600 get denied at these places. </p>

<p>sorry to be harsh but you'll be sorry if you get waitlisted denied.
you need to add more matches. consider schools like tufts, bc, havorford, colgate, gwu</p>

22

<p>sarahhhh, I already know that. Thank you for the suggestions, I'll consider tweaking my list slightly, removing some far reaches and perhaps adding some that you suggested.</p>

23

<p>agree with the above^. the colleges she suggested are fabulous, and you will have a much higher chance of acceptances there.</p>

24

<p>
[quote]
you are people on a messageboard, not the admission committee themselves

[/quote]
</p>

<p>What do you expect? You're on the same message board asking for opinions. You're going to get them. If you only want to know what the admissions committee thinks, don't post on CC and wait until next year when you apply.</p>

<p>
[quote]
My problem was that he hadn't read my original post and made some incorrect claims

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</p>

<p>I did read the original post. I only missed that one detail on the ACT retake. I obviously couldnt have referred to whether your class was 30 kids or 300 kids without reading it.</p>

<p>I know what it's like to be told chances. I had my own threads. People told me I wouldn't get into a few schools that I did. So don't let me discourage you if I am. I'm really not trying to. I'm just trying to put everything into perspective.</p>

<p>I agree with the above suggested schools but they are no sure thing, for anyone, not just you. That would be more like adding match/slight reach schools, and unfortunately, you could end up getting rejected from a whole lot of them. Not saying you will, but that you could. I'm mainly referring to Tufts, Haverford, and Colgate. BC and GWU you should get into. My friend, the salutatorian, has very similar statistics, and was rejected from 8 of the 9 schools she applied to, many of which you are applying to, getting only into her safety. Make sure you have that safety, because right now I don't see one. consider your instate public if you haven't already. also consider early action so that you are ensured a spot at some college.</p>

<p>This is only for your protection. I know you can get into any of the aforementioned schools, and I think you will, but you never know, as there are people who have results like my friend.</p>

25

<p>UChicago recruits quite aggressively from the city itself, especially from the CPS and often awards scholarships to students who live in Chicago, regardless of their race. So I'm going to go on a bit of a limb and say that as long as you're interested in the school, you're into Chicago. Your SAT is higher than the midrange, and given that you have home field advantage, plus the low-income background, plus the QuestBridge stuff, I'd say Chicago is going to love you.</p>

<p>That isn't based on anything official, mind you, but rather what I've heard from other students and what I know.</p>

26

<p>Xeneise, I read your opinion carefully and I decided that I do value what you said. I have even stated that I might be interested in cutting out some of the more difficult schools and replacing them with some of the suggested ones. But now you are saying that it will be difficult to get into even the ones that were suggested; quite frankly, there is an element of probability in every decision, and it is possible that I could get rejected from everywhere. Should I just not apply to college, then? Think about what you are saying -- I understand my capabilities; I've been put down a lot. I understand what schools I might have a chance at and which ones are far reaches. I asked for suggestions and you didn't provide any. If you are not going to help, why are you posting? Otherwise, I value your honest opinion. Thank you.</p>

<p>And I know no schools are "no sure thing". I'm not interested in safety schools. I already have one. That's all I really need -- that's why it's a safety school. </p>

<p>This is for my protection? You are not my parent, my counselor, or friend. You are an individual posting on a messageboard who does not have any investment in me. Sometimes you have to go out and take a risk -- you can't live your life in a bubble, going with what is "safe". I know that I don't have a strong chance at many of these schools; I'd be happy at my safety. But I'd rather aim high happily than aim low unhappily. I'm sorry about your friend's admission results, but one personal anecdote is not going to change my mind.</p>

<p>I've already considered UIUC -- which is my in-state public. Did you read the list of the schools that I mentioned? Because I did mention UIUC; it was the first school on the list.</p>

<p>Lastly, I will most probably be applying to University of Chicago EA. unalove is right - they do aggressively recruit from the city and favor CPS graduates (which I am). From my school alone, 17 students were accepted into UChicago, many with grades/SAT/ACT scores lower than mine.</p>

<p>I have a good chance at UChicago EA, and I would be happy to attend. However, no amount of discouragement is going to prevent me from applying to the schools that I've talked about. I am considering switching some for others, but not all of them. Sometimes you have to meet rejection head-on; no amount of hiding or choosing a "lesser" school, that you might not want to attend (but easier to get into) will make you happy.</p>

<p>Thank you for your opinions. Perhaps next fall I will be surprised.</p>

27

<p>
[quote]
But now you are saying that it will be difficult to get into even the ones that were suggested; quite frankly, there is an element of probability in every decision, and it is possible that I could get rejected from everywhere. Should I just not apply to college, then?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Of course you should apply to all of the schools that you are interested in attending. The suggested schools are more likely and I encourage you to apply to some of those as well as SYP, since you love those as well. I find it ironic that I'm actually sitting on this side of the arguement because I'm always arguing the other side - to reach for the stars to see what you get. Any top 25 school is going to be hard for almost any applicant. Can't you understand what I mean by this? I'm not insulting you or your credentials. I'm just stating that these schools are really not a sure thing for ANYONE. I still think you should apply and I hope you get into some/all of them.</p>

<p>What I AM saying is that you should leave your options open in case you are as unlucky as my friend, and many other people. You have stated that you would be happy to attend Illinois. That's fine, but consider it may be your only choice. (I know you acknowledged this in your thread already, but I want to re-emphasize) This is why I think you should have 2-3 additional schools where you'd very likely be admitted to, so you are ensured at least a few options come next april. I made another mistake in suggesting your instate public as you already have it, and I am sorry. What I meant to say is you should consider some instate public schools (not only Illinois) that you should almost definitely be accepted at. Or perhaps some surrounding public schools in nearby states, or privates. How about Depaul? Loyola? Ohio State? I'm not that familiar with private schools in the area, but some of those could be good, too.</p>

<p>All I am saying is it is best to keep your options open in April. You could very well be choosing between Princeton and Stanford (and perhaps you'd rather just be into one, as it'd be an impossible decision to have to make ;)) but also could have much fewer options.</p>

<p>I applied to 5 match/safety schools and 5 reach schools. I was accepted to all 5 match/safety schools with $, but only to 1 of the reaches. (Later 2, 1 off the waitlist) If I had only applied to my instate school, and reaches, I would have been choosing between two/three schools. If I had not gotten into those reaches I would have had to attend my state school.</p>

<p>Another reason to apply to schools you'd likely be admitted to is the greater chances of being offered merit money. That way, you'd have a larger variety of financial aid packages to consider.</p>

<p>I know I am not your school counselor, friend, or parent. But you are posting here looking for advice. I do my best to make sure all of the advice I present on this message board is truely beneficial to people I give it to. I do have some moral investment in making sure I offer the best input I can.</p>

<p>
[quote]
I have a good chance at UChicago EA, and I would be happy to attend. However, no amount of discouragement is going to prevent me from applying to the schools that I've talked about. I am considering switching some for others, but not all of them.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Yes, you do, and I hope you get in. I don't want to discourage you from applying to any of your schools. I'm not suggesting you take any of them off if you want to attend. But the point of you thread is just categorize them into safety/matches/reaches, and I am trying to make sure you have a good amount of each. If you would truely be happy at UIUC, then by all means keep your current list with any of the incorporated suggestions. </p>

<p>
[quote]
Sometimes you have to meet rejection head-on; no amount of hiding or choosing a "lesser" school, that you might not want to attend (but easier to get into) will make you happy.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>I agree completely. I always believe we should strive for the best. I was one of two students to apply to top 25 universities in my entire school. Many others were qualified, but chose not to do so.</p>

<p>Again, I am sorry for a few careless mistakes on my part, and I sincerely wish you the best of luck in admissions next year. You are a great applicant and I think all of your accomplishments are spectacular. Hopefully you'll be in at UChicago early and much of the stress will be lifted.</p>

28

<p>Xeneise,</p>

<p>All of the schools on my list have excellent financial aid for low income students. I chose these schools particularly because they have a commitment to socioeconomic diversity. Nearly all the schools also have strong English departments (I think most of the top 25 schools have strong English departments).</p>

<p>I want you to consider - what is the point of having options if you already know what the desired outcome is? Why would I apply to Ohio State university and UIUC, knowing that UIUC would be a better financial option and would be, by and large, the school I would attend anyways? There is no need for options if the outcome is already known; that's what I want you to understand. Out-of-state publics usually provide weak financial aid. At first, I considered some of the lower UCs and University of Michigan. However, both slam out of state applicants with extra tuition (+20k). This is not a financially reasonable option for me, which is why I stuck with private universities, which generally offer more financial aid. There is also no reason to attend out of state private universities that do not provide more financial aid than UIUC -- again, this is unreasonable. </p>

<p>Please understand that I am not any applicant that can apply to whatever OOS private university that "matches" me. I have to attend schools that offer to meet 100% of financial need (preferably with the least amount of loans possible). My stats are not good enough for merit scholarships, not even at schools like University of Chicago.</p>

<p>I understand that you want me to have a balanced list, but many low income students cannot afford many "safety schools" (OOS publics, lower-tier private universities that do not offer much financial aid). The schools with the best financial aid ARE the Top 25. I am not doing this simply for prestige reasons; I have to think about my family as well.</p>

<p>My counselor at first discouraged me from applying to the schools that I wanted, mentioning schools like Carnegie Mellon and WashU. But nearly all of the schools he mentioned, as I ended up finding out, had huge average debts per student. I was not impressed with the lack of interest in socioeconomic diversity at these schools. Sometimes we do have to reach for the stars, because that's the only possible route. </p>

<p>Thank you for taking the time to respond to me.</p>

29

<p>
[quote]
Out-of-state publics usually provide weak financial aid

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</p>

<p>Not always the case. Maryland and Delaware were virtually the same cost for me as the College of New Jersey, and Maryland is 33K out of state, Delaware 29K out of state, TCNJ 21K instate. But in general, you're right. This is with scholarship $$ from all three, and I have similar stats as you.</p>

<p>
[quote]
I want you to consider - what is the point of having options if you already know what the desired outcome is?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Because it may not be what you expect. See above case for me with two OOS state schools.</p>

<p>
[quote]
My stats are not good enough for merit scholarships, not even at schools like University of Chicago.

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</p>

<p>There are plenty of universities not in the top 25 that will give you considerable $$ for you stats. What do you mean by "not even at schools like U Chicago" The entering class at U Chicago is extremely talented, and it is not easy to get merit scholarships. I am talking about schools where you would be towards the top of the entering class, and therefore more likely to received substantial financial assistance. <em>This only on the possibility that you would be left to pick between UIUC, and any other schools not on your list currently</em> This could also be because of two reasons. 1. you don't get in anywhere else (not likely, but possible) or 2. you get into one of your top 25 and it does not offer you adequate aid to attend. I don't know your exact situation, and it's much more likely if admitted they'd offer you enough aid, but it is certainly possible they do not. (The higher up you go, the less likely, generally) So to recap, I am aware that the top 25 schools provide the best financial aid, but I think there are many other schools that would be the same price if not lower, given your great creditials. I wish I could do some research on which schools, but right now I don't have the time. There are threads on which colleges give great merit scholarships, though.</p>

<p>The gravity of your financial concern is much more apparent in your latest post. I am sure there are other publics in Illinois besides UIUC where you could get substantial aid, but you are probably right in assessing them on your own accord, as I am not very familiar with them, except for perhaps UI-Chicago.</p>

<p>It seems as though you would be perfectly fine to attend UIUC, so I think everything has pretty much been said. I apologize if I have frustrated you, but in my opinion, conversations such as this one help the original poster and the responder fully understand each other, and I think/hope we have.</p>

<p>Again I wish you the best of luck. There are many impressive posts of stats on this board, but less common are posters who words can back their own statistics up. You are certainly one of them.</p>

30

<p>Xeneise, thank you very much for responding and being helpful to me.</p>

<p>I understand that there are many universities outside of the top 25 that give merit aid. However this merit aid is: 1) difficult to receive (very selective), 2) very specific (minorities, in-state residents), 3) is not enough ($10k, not even $20k a year is enough).</p>

<p>I have checked schools where I would be at the top of the applicant pool; these schools do not offer good need-based aid, sometimes do not offer to meet 100% of need, are not need-blind or do provide money but not better than UIUC. The colleges I listed will all offer me enough to attend, so I don't have to worry about being accepted and not being able to attend.</p>

<p>"I wish I could do some research on which schools, but right now I don't have the time. There are threads on which colleges give great merit scholarships, though."</p>

<p>Most everyone who says that there are <em>good</em> colleges out there with great need-based/merit aid often say this. I even spoke to my counselor about great colleges that would offer aid for a student like me, and he told me he would do some research. I've checked the threads.</p>

<p>There is UIC and UIUC, the only two schools that would offer significant financial aid. My sister went to Loyola and was given the worst financial aid for someone of a very low-income bracket (<25k for a 5-person family). </p>

<p>If you can find any colleges that you think would match me or would be good safety schools, please feel free to post them.</p>

<p>Thank you.</p>

31

<p>You really do need a few more safety schools. My D applied to all lacs and was accepted to Wesleyan, Colgate, Lafayette (with great merit award), and Bucknell. She was waitlisted at Middlebury and rejected at Amherst and Williams. I do not think that your current " resume package" will get you into at least 50% of the schools you are applying to. They are super reaches for you. I do not believe your ethnicity will be a hook. You have a solid resume but nothing extraordinary.
My D had a 3.95GPA UW,4th in her class of 415 ,
Nat'l Merit Finalist,2200 SATS,wrote a play that was professionally directed and performed at a university theater, was a four year varsity athelete etc etc and she did not get into some of her schools. This next year will be even more challenging than for class of 2007.</p>

<p>I suggest you apply to Wesleyan, Colgate, Lafayette, Bowdoin,Bryn Mawr. Wes is a top 10 lac, and the others are all fantastic schools. I don't know enough about universities to give advice. I urge you to be more realistic and choose more schools that aren't such reaches.</p>

<p>Dana's Dad</p>

32

<p>impressive grades given your courseload...sat's, ec's, and awards are very solid...but i don't think solid translates into acceptances at the nation's top schools, which is basically all you're applying to. if i were you, i would apply early to one of the less selective schools on your list, like uchicago or northwestern, and scrap some huge reaches. you very well could be looking at 1 acceptance from your current list, though i would hope that uc, barnard, or wellesley say yes in addition to UI. </p>

<p>good luck...you really should add some second tier elites to your list, like hopkins, cornell, and haverford to your list as reaches, and scrap the current ones.</p>

33

<p>hell, you might be laughing at cc on the yale campus after you get in, but it really isn't likely, so just add some more realistic reaches that fit your interests...if you don't, you could end up at your safety school.</p>

34

<p>Danalynne, I did not say my ethnicity would be a hook. In fact, it will work against me, because I am Asian-American. Your daughter is very accomplished, but I am, too. For the socioeconomic strata that I've come from, I've done quite a lot. </p>

<p>My GPA is in fact much higher (3.91UW, 4.96W). I am going to hit a weighted 5.0 GPA by next year. While I think these colleges will be very challenging, almost no one from my school ever applies to LACs. As nearly all of the LACs have a preference for QB students, I have a slight advantage. Second, I am near the top of my class (we do not rank). People with WAY worse stats have been accepted to Wellesley and other schools on my list. Your daughter was probably outed at the top LACs because of in-house competition. There is no competition for LACs at my school, so the few people that do apply usually get in (and I am more qualified than most who have applied in the past).</p>

<p>While I think that looking at national averages is very handy, scattergrams from my school are much more helpful. I have a good shot at Wellesley, Barnard, University of Chicago, Northwestern, UIUC and even Amherst according to my school's scattergrams (people with worse or equal stats have been accepted).</p>

<p>I value your advice, but I am not changing my mind.</p>

<p>Brownplease, thanks. My grades are very solid and I've taken the most difficult courseload that's possible given my school's requirements. I will graduate with 35 credits as opposed to the 28 credit requirement. And I've already stated that I will be applying to UChicago EA; I have a very good shot there. However, I am not interested in any of the "second-tier" elites that you've suggested.</p>

<p>Thank you everyone!</p>

35

<p>You probably know better than I do admissions at UIUC-- if you don't get in, are you guaranteed a spot at another school?</p>

<p>And I'm actually inclined to agree with your opinion than the other posters, if just for my own list was a composite of lots of reach-y schools and one safety, my state school, because I really liked my state school and I knew that if I didn't get into the flagship state school, I was bounced down to another school in the system.</p>

<p>I also think Naviance, etc. are the strongest determinants there are in terms of knowing what schools you are capable of getting into. The difference between an admissions officer and those of us here is that the admissions officer knows your high school, knows what sorts of opportunities are available, and knows what to expect from students coming from your area. If you're in CPS especially, which is a doomed school district to begin with, strong grades and scores will indicate more work on your part than they will in a wealthy enivronment, where education and performance is more in the limelight and parents can afford tutoring services and encourage their students to get involved with activities.</p>

<p>From what I've seen from my sampling of friends getting into top colleges (both in high- and low- income schools) is that students were considered not by objective and universal criteria like SAT, but by subjective criteria and considering the student in the context of his surroundings. I've had friends who never did anything more exciting than be a lifeguard who are now at Yale and Amherst.</p>

36

<p>unalove, how were your admission results? Did you end up being accepted to one of your reaches? I think it's better to reach high if you're going to be fine at the state public. There's really no need to apply to lower-tier schools that will not offer better financial aid than the state flagship. That's how I feel about it, anyways.</p>

<p>If I am rejected from UIUC, I will not be bumped down to another school. However, it would take a miracle of God for me to not get accepted. The scattergrams from my school show that people with worse stats and even better stats (no Tuft's syndrome here) get accepted. I am right in the middle of lots of acceptances -- I'll be fine.</p>

37

<p>you might have a problem putting "AP Multivariable Calculus" on your application, considering such a class does not exist.</p>

38

<p>DH980, I believe you're wrong. Why?
<a href="http://www.nscollegeprep.cps.k12.il.us/ncphs/news/registration/programOfStudies.pdf%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.nscollegeprep.cps.k12.il.us/ncphs/news/registration/programOfStudies.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>And yes, there is no AP Multivariable test. I assure you, however, that we have a Multivariable course that is weighted as an AP. Considering that my school was chosen by Newsweek as one of the 25 Public Elites, I think we're doing something right.</p>

<p>You might want to lose the snark; it's not attractive.</p>

39

<p>I was accepted to my first choice school, UChicago. Thank god I did not find this site until I became a student there. I imagine UChi was a reach for me, but it was a reach I expected to get into, because I badly wanted to go and I felt like I fit the school well (and I was right!)</p>

<p>My other schools included Northwestern, Tufts, Johns Hopkins, Cornell, HYP, and SUNY Binghamton (state school). I loved Bing, and I wasn't that excited about any of the other schools on my list, but they had the opportunities I wanted and I would have only had myself to blame if I wasn't enjoying myself at any of those schools.</p>

<p>The acceptance patterns to Chicago from my school have been bizarre, to say the least, but fitting in their ways. I don't know everybody who applied or everybody who got in or got rejected, but from the people I know, I was selected when two of my friends, who had better scores and similar grades were rejected. This year, non-hook students were chosen even though one didn't rank in the top quartile, and others didn't take as challenging courseloads as they could have. Despite these "stains" on their transcripts, they're amazing, intelligent people who want to go to the school and are able to do the work. </p>

<p>That's why I think if you want Chicago (I don't know if you do, but it certainly fits the personality of the other schools you're looking at), I think you'll get it.</p>

<p>Keep in mind though that I'm not a genie and I have no authority in these matters. I do think you'll be an attractive applicant for UChicago. I'm entitled to my own opinions. :-)</p>

40

<p>Murky, the college board is enforcing new regulations regarding what HS's can or cannot call AP classes, effective next year, because there have been so many abuses in giving an AP designation to a class that doesn't have an AP test. The colleges are aware of this also, and will also not be giving AP credit to classes for which there is no AP test. So you may want to lose the attitude.</p>