No idea I do know my son’s job requires a specific skill set, and that one of his profs texted a screenshot of his final exam in a very specific course to a connection at the bank, which implies specificity. He would never have gotten the job focusing only real estate; finance maybe, but unlikely as he’s in the bank’s real estate division.
This thread has got me thinking – how did we convey our views about post graduation employment, and about majors? Our second son is very different from the first and doesn’t have a clear direction. We spent at least 10 hours together this summer (between his freshman and sophomore year in college) doing the exercises in “What Color Is Your Parachute?”. It was really useful and has got my son thinking of a few directions he can go. If I had to take a guess, I would say he might major in psychology, a very general major! But with that, one could attend medical school, become a sports psychologist, or teach at a prep school, which right now are the top 3 contenders for a career. In this example, a psychology major with no clue about what you would do with it is a bad idea. But with a general plan (that could be completely changed!) I think it’s a good major. It’s not so much the major as the plan.
Even though we are not poor, my kids don’t have the option/luxury of figuring it out later. (Understanding that sometimes there are good reasons for that etc)
What is my point? I guess this: that I would focus on post graduation career – in a gentle way – even before starting college, and certainly in the first year or two of college, vs focusing only on one kind of major.
I think cptofthehouse is being a little overbroad when she focuses on getting a STEM-type major, but right on with her message to plan for post-college employment all the time, and to make certain you are acquiring credentials that will help you get the kind of job you need. That varies with the kinds of jobs you are looking at, and also, frankly, with how much of a star you are. Be realistic.
Also, it helps to think outside the box a little. My son – a Sociology major, pretty much the quintessential unemployable/generalist social science category – started way too late looking for his first post-college job, and didn’t get an offer he could accept until late July. That offer, when it came, fit his skill set and interests well, but it didn’t pay enough to live on or pay college loans. What it did, however, was make it possible to accept also a part-time job he had been offered in theater management (a big extra-curricular focus). With the two jobs, he could make ends meet, and position himself for better, more sustainable jobs in the future.
I graduated from architecture school the year hundreds were being laid off from architecture school. In 2008 I doubt too many people were hiring real estate finance majors. I think the most important thing for kids in humanities and social sciences is to have summer work that gives them skills. My son had experience in scheduling people , running conferences, using Excel spreadsheets and managing people before he graduated. It still took a couple of internships to get a real job offer and by then he decided that NGO work wasn’t really the direction he wanted to go. He went on the Officer Candidate School for the Navy where they didn’t care what he’d majored in as long as he did well on their entry exam. (He got his first choice branch.)
But, doesn’t everybody get the same advice, “If you’re going to major in [fill in useless liberal arts subject here], then, are you prepared to become a teacher?” Nothing so concentrated my mind as a young 18 y/o than the possibility of having to become a NYC public school teacher!
Of course, many new entrants to the work force have little familiarity with how hiring works. If their parents and other associates are not in similar kinds of work, that may be even more of a disadvantage, akin to first-generation-to-college students. But hiring for jobs is much more opaque and holistic than even the most opaque and holistic college admissions (and job hiring has much stronger and widely accepted networking/nepotism preferences than college admissions legacy preferences).
My engineering major completed an engineering undergrad degree with a double major in something else. She will never be an engineer. She stuck with it because her nature is to complete things she starts. But that engineering degree is just a piece of paper for her. It’s not what she loves…and she won’t be doing it.
Just because a kid sticks with a major…engineering or whatever…doesn’t mean that this is the career path they will follow.
Many…many kids have jobs after college that aren’t related to their majors at all.
We didn’t have LInkedin. Finding alums from our college involved cajoling someone in the alumni office to let you use the directory for an hour, and frantically xerox the names of anyone who sounded like they were in a job that was even vaguely interesting.
We didn’t have Glassdoor. If you wanted to get a job at a boutique hotel company with operations on the West Coast, you had to invest hours in figuring out who/what/when/where. Now it’s a click of a button.
We didn’t have online job boards. You wanted to work with animals? You had to subscribe to the 5 magazines and 10 newsletters which carried want ads for stables, animal hospitals, racetracks, farms, etc. You wanted to move to Chicago but lived in Atlanta? You got yourself a thirty day subscription to the Chicago papers and checked those want ads… which were obsolete by the time the paper got mailed to you.
You heard about a cool job and wanted to apply? You mailed in your resume and waited. And waited. And waited. I was already in recruiting the day we installed our first fax machine-- it was a game changer!!! I remember the job fairs of yore- there was no such thing as hand sanitizer, so we took turns going to the restroom to wash our hands every half hour-- we figured our immune systems could handle that many strangers. Now job fairs are virtual, and the interviews are on Skype or other. And there is hand sanitizer which you no longer need.
College’s Career offices consisted of a receptionist and a big black binder which had various job openings-- xeroxed pages, none of the information was verified, most of it wrong. There was no such thing as a video interview critique by an experienced career services professional, because the video and the career services professional hadn’t been born yet.
I feel for kids who don’t have parents who can guide them. But this techno/always online generation can’t claim that the process is opaque- it has NEVER been more transparent. Or easier to navigate, if you ask for help which for some reason, kids are reluctant to do.
In a world that’s constantly changing at ever faster pace, too much specialization isn’t necessarily a good thing, especially for a young college graduate with long career ahead. Automation and AI will replace many jobs, even the ones that’re still considered safe from automation today. A “generalist” with the right skill set and an ability to adapt, to specialize on short notice, and to reinvent himself/herself will more likely survive the world of tomorrow.
^That’s a lot of cynicism about job hiring. In STEM related fields the hiring is usually pretty meritocratic.
I agree with OP’s message that parents would be wise to remind their kids of job prospects of their college studies rather than just encourage them to follow their passion.
Engineering/CS/math jobs are great equalizers for college graduates regardless of the programs or schools—a Princeton CS grad and San Jose State grad would have about the same chance at a Google engineering position. But the same cannot be said about an English major. If a Princeton English major cannot find a job in related field he can always try a decent paying gig in consulting, I-banking or etc.
The reality is that for most non-elite college students without connections, a STEM major will go a long way to insure good job prospect after college.
The purpose behind college is to get yourself on solid footing to build a career. You have a whole lifetime to pursue further interests and passions. but while you’re at it, you have something worthwhile to pay the bills. I made that mistake with my bachelors degree and I ended-up pigeon-holed in low paying jobs for several years. I finally went back to school and started a new career.
The job market is more forgiving than you think. Few people who start careers stay there after graduating. Many change jobs, others change industries, it’s very common for people to change careers. The key is to have something to fall back on until passions can be fulfilled. Some people can make a career out of their passions, but it’s not that way with everyone.
Well that’s one opinion certainly. Others would argue that the purpose behind a university education is to produce well informed upstanding citizens capable of rational and analytical thought. Once that is achieved then more vocational skills can be laid on top. If the goal is to get yourself on solid footing to build a career you might be better off acquiring a skilled trade straight out of high school.
Doesn’t that cut both ways? Why on earth would anyone spend tens of thousands of dollars on an education that only prepares them for the worst job one will ever have?
I graduated with a degree in RE investments from a program rated as one of the top in that area. It was one of the few majors at the school that several IBs recruited directly for analyst jobs in NYC. So did many other top RE firms. Internships were plentiful and specific to the field. If you knew what you wanted it was a great place to be.
Hiring is quite opaque. The tools you listed, @Blossom, are all for applying, and indeed, thanks to technology, exponentially more candidates now apply for some jobs than in the past. Once the applications are in, however, the process for narrowing down the applicants is utterly opaque, and can depend upon artificial intelligence algorithms, key word screening, nepotism, old test scores- almost anything, with no feedback as to why one wasn’t chosen or even what was sought.
Of course, that assumes that they have decent cards – parental circumstances and choices are probably the dominant factor in what choices one has for post-high-school education.
Some of the arguments in the opening essay are simplistic or nonsensical. Take the diatribe against majoring in social science. Which disciplines might this include? In addition to core disciplines such as political science, psychology, geography, sociology, and economics, there may be applied majors in urban planning or other areas.
Most of these disciplines have a strong math/statistics core. My son majored in econ, and he was very interested in applied math and statistics. Those skills and methods are the basis of a very successful career. Graduates in geography or urban planning who have skills in the use of “geographic information systems” (GIS), may have marketable technical skills. Those skills, perhaps combined with advanced training, will open some doors.
A student who majors in just about anything as an undergrad but who has core analytical skills including writing and applied math and statistics can make a career in business (perhaps after earning an MBA), or a career in applied policy analysis, urban planning and administration, or other areas.
I agree that “choice of major does impact jobs,” as the OP titled this thread. BUT, I don’t believe being in STEM guarantees success/financial security/whatever, nor does studying a more traditionally liberal arts major (I majored in psychology with a lot of biology courses) sentence a young person to an low paying or unfulling career. It is so much more complex than that and always boils down to the individual who has said degrees.
I do know as a parent, that I rest well at night knowing that my daughter loves what she does and is making progress toward what she says/thinks her goals are at this moment in time (and these goals have less to do with income and more to do with contributing to health care in our society). She happens to be in a STEM field that she absolutely loves, but if she were miserable doing that I’m not sure that would be a good or healthy situation.
I do know my son’s job requires a specific skill set, and that one of his profs texted a screenshot of his final exam in a very specific course to a connection at the bank, which implies specificity. He would never have gotten the job focusing only real estate; finance maybe, but unlikely as he’s in the bank’s real estate division.