<p>I believe if college admins truly wanted to stop campus drinking they could. Every summer D has attended a ballet summer intensive program. Each program requires students and parents to sign a statement acknowledging the program’s zero tolerance for alcohol and drug use. </p>
<p>The program D attended last summer had an incident the previous summer where the program directors did not enforce their no drug/alcohol policy – and several dancers who returned to the dorm.... drunk, after attending an off campus party were initially only reprimanded, but not required to leave the program. The parents of other dancers found out about the incident and starting calling the program’s directors wanting to know why the rules weren’t being enforced, and several parents posted about the incident on the BT4D board. Last summer a similar incident occurred at this same program - but this time the offending dancers were packed and out of the dorm within 24 hours, even a dancer who was from Europe. </p>
<p>Colleges need to develop a zero tolerance drug/alcohol policy, have students and parents sign it, and strenuously enforce it. Will the drinking parties move off campus….yes. But off campus drinking should not reflect negatively on the college admins and should be handled by local law enforcement. Hopefully, those kids who start drinking in h/s and want to continue in college will self select schools with a more lenient drinking policy.</p>
<p>At many rural colleges, off campus means get in your car and drive. You would really prefer kids driving 5 miles to a party, getting drunk, and driving home late at night as opposed to drinking responsibly on campus (not behind closed doors)?</p>
<p>"You would really prefer kids driving 5 miles to a party, getting drunk, and driving home late at night as opposed to drinking responsibly on campus (not behind closed doors)?"</p>
<p>I might, if I were that student's roommate and it meant him/her not puking or trashing my room, the bathrooms or other areas in the dorms. Actually, I'd much rather see that student's license yanked while he/she is still in high school - and driving 5 miles to a party, getting drunk, and driving home late at night. If this theoretical student is capable of drinking responsibly then he/she is equally capable of driving responsibly (as in, not drunk).</p>
<p>I'm from a country where the drinking age is 18, but I've lived in the US since I was 12.</p>
<p>I went to a party a few weeks ago. I sipped ONE drink for the first hour or so, then switched to water. I did not fall down, vomit, or pass out. I did not have casual sex (I was hugged twice; does that count?). In fact, I didn't commit any drunken indiscretions besides eating six or seven plum tomatoes. I woke up at 6 AM the next morning and felt fine. That was my second time drinking; my first time, several months earlier, was similar.</p>
<p>If colleges asked me if I'd ever consumed alcohol, I would have to say yes. I'm not a liar. I have to wonder, though--do you honestly consider me equivalent to the girl who had more shots than her system could handle, yelled at her friends for taking the cup out of her hands, and spent the rest of the night puking into a trashcan? I guess I don't understand why it has to be all or nothing--either you're a teetotaler or you're a filthy drunk. </p>
<p>I stopped after one drink because I'm female, don't weigh very much, and try my hardest to stay out of hospitals and incriminating situations. Oh, wait, I forgot--I'm a teenager; I'm obviously incapable of either moderation or mature, responsible behavior. :rolleyes:</p>
<p>Look at Holland
Drinking age : 16 for beer and wine , 18 for hard liquor
Smoking age : 16
Cannabis/Hasj age : 18
Prostitution age : 18</p>
<p>Holland is one of the safest and most fun places to live in, you don't have alot of alcohol abuse because kids have already been binging since they were 16(most kids start out with alcohol at the age of 14/15). Drinking responsibly comes without saying. I am 16 and I have been going out with friends for the past year or two. If we sense one of us isn't doing to well or had way too much... one or two of us take him home, make him a smoothie, make him drink 10 glasses of water, 2 shakes of salt and some noodles and throw him in his bed if we know there isn't anything serious... AND GO BACK TO THE PARTY !
This might sound pretty radical.. but it works. Kids here grow up responsibly, looking out for each other goes without saying and is almost always put into practice.
I just recently turned 16 and therefor am legal to drink and smoke. I do not smoke as it is stupid and expensive in my opinion. You might think I would go straight to the pub and get drunk but no. Alcohol isn't something that's cool anymore... I still drink but i do it with my friends while having fun, and I know my limits.
In America on the other hand people from what I hear drink very irresponsively during their college years, and sometimes slack off. A Dutchman on the otherhand would already have had his fun with alcohol and can spend time on more important things... like studying.
This was not meant to bash the American drinking-age or the College Drinking Lifestyle, but just to show other people how they do things in Holland.
Btw. Almost no one does weed in Holland.. only the tourists do.
Cheers</p>
<p>It would be nice if things were that easy...but...</p>
<p>Holland has much more youth binge drinking, and youth intoxication, than the U.S., higher per capita emergency room admits as a result, and a much higher adult alcoholism rate, and higher alcohol-related mortality rates.</p>
<p>Nonetheless, I'm not sure it is all that helpful to compare crossculturally. Part of the reason U.S. youth have lower rates is racial/cultural - we have many more folks of African-American, Hispanic, and Asian descent, and they have lower (and in some cases, much lower) drinking/alcoholism rates than those descended from northern European stock.</p>
<p>I don't have to consider you equivalent - it isn't my place. A college can use your answer any way it wants, or not at all. It is ASKING that that would send a message.</p>
<p>I think the purpose of the question would be to make it clear they are interested in establishing the kind of student body they want on campus. They don't have to tell you whether they use the information or not. There are schools that ask for SAT scores that virtually don't use them, except to check that the grades attained in high school mean something. This wouldn't have to be any different.</p>
<p>You say it's not your place to judge, yet you continue to generalize. It's "that kind of student" and "the kind of student body they want on campus", because everyone knows that every high school student who has ever had a sip of alcohol is tainted for life and can't possibly contribute anything to a college community. The fact that you consider it legitimate for colleges to judge my application based on a yes-or-no answer without any further clarification suggests that you do consider me--the girl who got slightly tipsy just twice, several months apart--as despicable as the girl who drank herself unconscious for the third weekend in a row, since you make no attempt to differentiate between us. </p>
<p>This discussion reminds me of religious extremists who view premarital sex and murder as equal sins--the degree of the crime doesn't matter, because either way, YOU'RE STILL GOING TO HELL. :rolleyes: I honestly don't think that consuming one mixed drink at a party makes me an undesirable student; actually, based on my experience at my high school, I think it makes me more responsible than most.</p>
<p>Edited to add: I didn't mean to sound so confrontational; I'm just genuinely perplexed.</p>
<p>They could well decide that they want a lot of students who hope to "work hard/play hard", and are honest about it. (Actually, more than a few colleges have decided just that.) It's called "holistic admissions" - they include your grades, degree of difficulty, SATs, ECs, legacy status, sports, musical instrument, letters of recommendation, breed of dog, zip code, geography, citizenship, income, parental education, importance of GC, criminal background, religion (in some places), skin color, ethnicity, # of hours worked per week, summer vacations. Just one more piece of information they can add to the hopper - IF THEY CHOOSE TO. If not, they just send a message that they are interested.</p>
<p>What paranoia would lead you to believe that your two drinks would result in your being blackballed? Alternatively, if before you took the two drinks, you knew that colleges were going to ask, would it have changed your behavior? (Answer honestly, if you choose.)</p>
<p>Mini,
If I were to be asked the same question...
"Have you ever consumed alcohol"
Would they think lesser of me if I answered yes ? It was perfectly legal and had no nasty repercussions or anything.</p>
<p>There are lots of laws in the U.S. I don't like. For the most part I don't go about breaking them. Now, if I wished, I could choose to get myself arrested for doing so, and try to have the law overturned. But I pick my spots. </p>
<p>"Would they think lesser of me if I answered yes."</p>
<p>Who's "they"? The question is followed by, "Please explain." Sounds like you have a reasonable explanation. In any case, I make no assumption that there is any college out there (though there might be) looking for a student body of total abstainers. On the other hand, I suspect there are MANY colleges that believe their campus environment would be enhanced (for both drinkers and non-drinkers alike) if there weren't so many binge and heavy drinkers, and might decide that looking at whom they admit is one reasonable way (among several) to move in that direction. Or (as I've previously noted), they could decide not even to look at the answers, believing that by just asking the question they can get their message across. Or they might become more focused on picking out the liars than the drinkers. </p>
<p>Paranoia isn't necessary. In many cases, engendering some might be a plus.</p>
<p>My guess is that colleges would look more closely at your explanation than at your admission. And that explanation could say volumes about your attitudes towards drinking and whether you could be considered more at risk than someone else... </p>
<p>Perhaps they could just include a mandatory "theoretical" essay question in order to derive something on applicants' attitudes without any actual admission - since obviously students would be more likely to lie if they thought their admission hinged on their admission. But then again, if you thought they were really serious about enforcing non-drinking policies, why would you want to go there anyway - if you wanted someplace where you knew you could "get away with it" and they would look the other way?</p>
They could well decide that they want a lot of students who hope to "work hard/play hard", and are honest about it.
"Two drinks in four years" does NOT equate to a "work hard/play hard" attitude ("binge drinking"). The question, as stated above, proves absolutely nothing. If its purpose is to identify potential binge drinkers, the methodology is deeply flawed, IMHO.
I mean, I'm just saying.</p>
<p>So maybe they'd REJECT you because you don't fit the desired pattern. </p>
<p>You still didn't answer my question:</p>
<p>"Alternatively, if before you took the two drinks, you knew that colleges were going to ask, would it have changed your behavior? (Answer honestly, if you choose.)"</p>
<p>Paranoia isn't necessary; but it can in some circumstances be useful. ;)</p>
<p>ok.. I think you for the most part understood it but incase you didn't I was reffering to US Universities.
If I said it was just a few drinks while socialising with friends etc they wouldn't think so wrong of me as if I were to say " I get high and drink a 4 bottles of tequilla every week while i am out clubbing in the nearest metropolis "
Ok that was way too exaggerated but I would probobly answer along the lines of the first thing I said followed by a description of Dutch Drinking Policy.</p>
<p>I agree with what you said about them rather having people in their school that have drunk before then people they know are lying about it. Then again the brutal answer "Yeah i drink all the time" isn't what institutions look for either...</p>
But based on my answer ("yes", no details provided), there would be no way to tell.
[QUOTE=mini]
Alternatively, if before you took the two drinks, you knew that colleges were going to ask, would it have changed your behavior? (Answer honestly, if you choose.)
Yes, it probably would've. I did it because I was curious and because all my friends were there, neither of which is a very compelling reason. I enjoyed it, but I'm more than capable of having fun without it; I don't brag about it, nor is it something I'm particularly ashamed of... it's just something I've done, and I could just as easily not have. I guess that means I see your point. :)</p>