<p>Can anyone (Bthompson, I hear you are the man ) recommend a possible Fall semester schedule for a Kelley frosh direct admit ??? My S wants to get off to a good start in starting his college career and learning how to handle the adjustment to "life in the Big Ten" as well. He is a hardworker, but he realizes that the first semester for many is really about making adjustments ( friends, activities, parties, being away from home, etc.)</p>
<p>Take two of K201/A100/E201/M118 fall semester but no more than two. Take the other two in the Spring.</p>
<p>I think post number 6 in this thread by bthomp will be helpful to you. If you search through his posts, he has given a ton of scheduling advice. maxellis is another poster you should look through if you want advice from someone who seems to have had a successful career at Kelley. </p>
<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/indiana-university-bloomington/1105300-what-should-da-do-over-summer.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/indiana-university-bloomington/1105300-what-should-da-do-over-summer.html</a></p>
<p>There are a few things you need to consider when coming up with a 1st semester Kelley DA schedule. Here is the link to the Kelley degree requirements:
[General</a> Education Component (62 credit hours) : Academic Bulletin](<a href=“Indiana University Bloomington”>Indiana University Bloomington) </p>
<ul>
<li><p>As a DA, your son will be focusing his attention on getting some I-core prerequisites completed, followed by the other Kelley requirements.</p></li>
<li><p>If your S is a DA, it’s possible he scored high enough on his SAT/ACT in English that he won’t have to take ENG W131.</p></li>
<li><p>With regard to his 27 hour Gen Ed requirement, he needs to think about whether or not he wants to choose the field specialization or distribution option. One tip, if he wants to minor in a foreign language, he will fulfill the field specialization requirements that way. He will also complete the 6 hour international dimension requirement by completing the minor. Depending on how well he does on the language placement exam, after completing his first course, he could get up to 10 more hours of language credit. [Undergraduate</a> Studies: Department of Spanish and Portuguese](<a href=“Indiana University Bloomington”>Indiana University Bloomington)</p></li>
</ul>
<p>-How much AP credit does he have and in what subjects? How does that credit fit in to the Kelley requirements? Do they fulfill any of the Gen Ed distribution option requirements?
[View</a> AP By Institution](<a href=“http://www.transferin.net/AP/View-AP-By-Institution.aspx]View”>http://www.transferin.net/AP/View-AP-By-Institution.aspx) </p>
<p>-Is your son interested in applying for the Business Honors program? He would apply during second semester of his freshman year, and how well he does in his freshman year classes is important. [Business</a> Honors Program: Academics: Undergraduate Program: Kelley School of Business: Indiana University Bloomington](<a href=“Undergraduate | Bachelor's Degree in Business | Indiana Kelley”>Undergraduate | Bachelor's Degree in Business | Indiana Kelley)</p>
<p>-Taking honors sections of Kelley classes is usually a good idea. Smaller class sizes, easier grading according to most, and IMO, the best profs, are all benefits of taking these sections.</p>
<p>-When coming up with a draft schedule, use the IU Course Browser to see what classes/sections are available. Sections that are only open to DAs will be clearly marked.
[Indiana</a> University Course Browser](<a href=“http://registrar.indiana.edu/scheduleoclasses/prl/soc4118/index.html]Indiana”>http://registrar.indiana.edu/scheduleoclasses/prl/soc4118/index.html)</p>
<p>-When deciding between sections, use the Grade Distribution reports to determine how individual teachers grade.
[Grade</a> Distribution Database: Office of the Registrar: Indiana University Bloomington](<a href=“http://gradedistribution.registrar.indiana.edu/]Grade”>http://gradedistribution.registrar.indiana.edu/)</p>
<p>With all that said, my S’s freshman year schedule looked like this (choosing the field specialization option):</p>
<p>1st semester- (14 credits)
BUS-X106 Business Presentations
MATH-M118 Finite
BUS-A100 Basic ACCT Skills
HISP-S275 Hispanic Culture
MUS-Z201 History of Rock & Roll
MUS-Z1 All Campus Ensemble</p>
<p>2nd semester (15 credits)
BUS-K204
ECON-E201 Microeconomics
MATH-M119 Calculus
HISP-S310 Grammar & Composition
POLS-Y109 Intro to Int’l Relations</p>
<p>Summer before sophomore year, S took ECON-E202 Macroecon at our local CC.</p>
<p>Since your son is already admitted into Kelley, he doesn’t have the worry & pressure of structuring his schedule to enhance his chances of getting in. That is a huge blessing!</p>
<p>I appreciate all the advice that you have provided. Thanks for all your help !!!</p>
<p>Just heard from the boys about the S&H and N&M distribution requirements:</p>
<p>1) E201 and E202 satisfy the S&H req.</p>
<p>2) M118, M119, P101 satisfy the N&M req.</p>
<p>It appears that there is a new language/culture course requirement. I did not see that coming? Would someone please fill me in on this?</p>
<p>Thanks</p>
<p>Ace, there is no way that those will count toward the 27-credit hour core, which is probably what you mean when you say “distribution.” It says as much in the Kelley bulletin dated March 21, 2011, beginning at the bottom of page 4. </p>
<p>“I-core prerequisite courses and Economics courses may not be used to fulfill the 27-hour core.”</p>
<p>Those courses fulfill S&H and N&M requirements for students in COAS; for Kelley students, they help with I-core prerequisites and the 62 credit gen ed requirement, but not the 27 credit hour core. Once you take the 27 credit hour core and the Icore courses that count toward the gen ed requirement and some other courses Kelley requires for graduation, you will be within a few credits of getting the 62 credit gen ed requirement done, or have already surpassed it by taking a taking a foreign language class or having AP credit for something that can’t be applied elsewhere. </p>
<p><a href=“Redirect Notice”>Redirect Notice;
<p>bthomp1,</p>
<p>Thanks. I recall seeing it somewhere. Therefore, M118 and M119 would not satisfy the N&M requirements either. I have asked S2 to confirm with his advisor about the 21Mar2011 Kelley Bulletin. </p>
<p>S2 plans to take the following courses:</p>
<p>A100(1 cr)
X104(3)
SOC-S100(3) or AMST A100
K201(3)
G-202(2) or SOC-S110(3) or Frit M202,
HPSC X200(3)</p>
<p>How bad is taking X104 and G202 at the same time?</p>
<p>Thanks</p>
<p>Is your son a direct admit?</p>
<p>RE K201, I like the sequence Fall take CSCI A110, then take K201 in the Spring. Suggested it to Indycarkid last year, and he got an A+ in A110 and did well enough in K201 in the Spring to get into Kelley. A110 is easy N&M credit (as is SOC S110), and is a good prep for K201. One of my son’s friends took S110 this Spring as a junior; of course he breezed through it after having had finite, calc, E370, etc. – so it was laughably easy for him. But still by far one of the easiest N&M courses.</p>
<p>I don’t think G202 is that difficult, especially if your son did well in E201. He might not feel comfortable taking it with older students, as most everyone in the Fall semester will be a sophomore.</p>
<p>Ace, there is no way they would make those classes count for the 27 credit hour core. They count as gen ed for Kelley students; but Kelley/IU has to give students the token liberal arts exposure that the 27 credit hour core gives Kelley students, so no Icore prerequisites count toward it.</p>
<p>I might stay away from the HPSC X200, and take an easier N&M class, such as PSY P101 (Sklar is good) or CSCI A110 or SOC S110.</p>
<p>Is there a difference between the 27 hour core and the breadth of inquiry requirements? The Kelley advisers at orientation were pretty adamant that Kelley students did not have to worry about the S&H breadth of inquiry because the two Econ classes would cover that. And M118 would cover the math part of N&M. That just leaves a required natural science.</p>
<p>The “Breadth of Inquiry” classes list looks exactly like the old Appendix II from which Kelley students drew their 27 credit core classes. I think any class on the new Appendix II will be applicable to the 27 credit core classes. Here are the two lists if you want to compare them. </p>
<p>Distribution Courses:
[Appendix</a> II: Distribution Courses : Academic Bulletin](<a href=“Indiana University Bloomington”>Indiana University Bloomington)</p>
<p>Breadth of Inquiry courses:
[Appendix</a> II: Breadth of Inquiry Courses : Academic Bulletin](<a href=“Indiana University”>Indiana University)</p>
<p>Really just different terminology for similar requirements in place prior to the 2011-2012 COAS bulletin, but given more emphasis now in the College of Arts and Sciences with the new terminology that is probably meant to make the liberal arts degrees seem more difficult to earn than in the past, which they may be. </p>
<p>There is no 2011-2012 Kelley bulletin on the web yet. But probably the 27 credit hour core classes will come now from the “Breadth of Inquiry” appendix. So, you will still have to take at least two S&H breadth of inquiry classes other than E201 and E202 to apply to the 27 credit hour core, as well as two more N&M classes besides M118, M119, and ECON E370-- all of which are listed on the “new” breadth of inquiry list as well as the old distribution courses lists.</p>
<p>Also, AMST A110 is on both the old and new lists, as it should be.</p>
<p>Here are the 31 credit hours of Kelley requirements, most of which are Icore prerequisites, that count toward the requirement for 62 general education credits.</p>
<p>ENG-W 131 (3 cr.)
BUS-X 104 (3 cr.)
BUS-X 204 (3 cr.)
MATH-M 118 (3 cr.)
MATH-M 119 (3 cr.)
ECON-E 201 (3 cr.)
BUS-G 202 (2 cr.)
ECON-E 370 (3 cr.)
BUS-L 201 (3 cr.)
BUS-X 220 (2 cr.)
ECON-E 202 (3 cr.) [not an Icore prerequisite; but required to graduate from Kelley]</p>
<p>The remaining 31 credits will come from the 27 credit hour core, which I assume now can be filled from the courses found on the breadth of inquiry list, and the last four from any other courses taken in any school at IU (SPEA, journalism, School of Education, COAS, etc.), or AP credit not used for other requirements, or undistributed credit, etc.</p>
<p>Will it be diffucult for a direct admit to take 201 the first semester of frosh year? Right now S is scheduled to take M118 with K201 the first semester. Thinking about M119 the second semester with Econ ( c0,urse # ???) and A110. S is concerned that he is not too overloaded from the start, but wants to make enough progresss as he may double major in Acctg/Finance.</p>
<p>If you take CSCI A110, you must take it before you take K201 in order for A110 to count as a N&M class. So, it would be a waste to take A110 after you take K201. Take A110 in the Fall for N&M credit, easy grading, and to introduce you to material that will be covered in K201 the following spring.</p>
<p>If you want to make life at Bloomington much less stressful, you might take finite or calculus at a cc over the summer.</p>
<p>It is a good idea to have all the gen ed classes, 27 credit hour core, international dimension out of the way by the time your son is a junior, if he is double majoring in accounting and finance, so that his last four semesters at IU he will be taking upper-level business classes only. These classes are difficult and it is possible to take only four three-credit classes at least two of the last three semesters and get the double major if all the gen ed, etc. classes are out of the way. I think it is worth taking some summer classes at cc in summers to accomplish this goal.</p>
<p>This is my son’s schedule jr-sr year, after completing all gen ed’s, etc. by end of sophomore year.</p>
<p>Fall 2010
Icore</p>
<p>Spring 2011
A311
A325
F303
Z302
X420 - 2 credits, easy</p>
<p>Fall 2011
F305
F307
A337
A312
X301 - 1 credit</p>
<p>Spring 2012
F402
FXXX last finance elective
A424
A437</p>
<p>A327 tax he will take in the 2 1/2 intensive summer session next summer, since we live close to Bloomington. Also, many students just stay three extra weeks to take A329 in the intensive summer session, which ends before Memorial Day.</p>
<p>This gives him accounting and finance (corporate emphasis) majors with relatively small courseloads the last two years, but only because all of the gen eds were out of the way.</p>
<p>Also, if your son decides on the 3/2 mba program, all the gen ed, etc., Icore, and some upper-level accounting classes must be complete by end of junior year; so you would be keeping that option open by completing gen eds, etc. in the first two years.</p>
<p>Does a student get automatic credit for M119 based upon their AP score from a high school AB calculus class. The state of Indiana AP website ( linked into IU) pertaining to public universities within the state that went up recently is somewhat confusing. It looks like credit may be provided for a 3 or a 4 AP score ( this was also the case with other AP subjects like psych, history, etc… Also, if you are given credit and test out of this class, are you required to then take a higher level calculus class beyond M119 ?</p>
<p>At orientation, the Kelley School advisors and at sessions with non-Kelley students were very vague and would not directly address AP questions with the parents. Many parents found the IU staff to be evasive on the AP credit subject. I found this to strange as most universities are very direct about this so students and parents have a clear understanding about how many credits they can apply to graduation.</p>
<p>IU adopts the AP policy per the following link:</p>
<p>[View</a> AP By Institution](<a href=“http://www.transferin.net/AP/View-AP-By-Institution.aspx]View”>http://www.transferin.net/AP/View-AP-By-Institution.aspx)</p>
<p>1)Calculus AB 3 MATH UNDI 3 Undistributed credit counting toward total degree requirements and/or other requirements depends on degree program. Consult your academic advisor. </p>
<p>This one probably won’t earn credits for M211. </p>
<p>2) Calculus AB 4,5 MATH-M 211 4 credits</p>
<p>This one should be sufficient to waive M119. </p>
<p>I think that IU is making too many changes for Class 2015.</p>
<p>A lot of Kelley students have tested into-- and regretted taking-- M211 instead of M119. </p>
<p>Last Fall semester, 80% of the students that took M211 were freshmen per the enrollment statistics-- probably their first semester at IU, since it was the Fall semester; almost certainly overwhelmingly encouraged by advisors at orientation to skip M119 and take M211. </p>
<p>You need a solid C for M211 to be used as an Icore calculus prerequisite. Well, only 473 of the 941 students who took M211 in Fall 2010 got a solid C or higher. In this course where four of five students were probably first semester freshmen, I don’t know how many of the 50 per cent who did not get the C were in Kelley or Kelley aspirants who wasted there time and money, took a hit to their academic record, and probably wound up taking M119 in the Spring.</p>
<p>I don’t know of anyone who thinks it is acceptable for one half of a class to fail, if there are less rigourous options (namely, M119) available which also meet Kelley requirements.</p>
<p>Clearly, the 25 question test used to place students in calculus is a horrible tool on which to base calculus placement. But try convincing the UD, Hutton and Kelley advisors of that.</p>
<p>bthomp1 you are a wealth of knowledge… can you tell me what AP score currently would exempt someone from taking M119. Also, if someone receives credit for the AP score on AB Calculus, are they required to take more Calculus or is the requirement fulfilled ?</p>