<p>My Jr is at the chaos stage of school selection. After hearing that this kid was interested in Alaska, Maine and MI State (based on a visit with a bro going to their law school), she returned from a college fair really excited about Clemson. Apparently Clemson has lots of science majors to choose from, and is in a very friendly town. I don't know anything about Clemson, except that their college fair must be really great.</p>
<p>Can anyone tell me about Clemson?</p>
<p>Rated #1 in the country for "Quality of Life" this year; always near the top for "Happiest Students" rating. It has the most passionate alumni base I've ever seen. Just about everyone there loves it and buys a whole wardrobe full of orange. Personally, I've been there and never understood what the fuss was all about, but the lake country in the NW corner of South Carolina is a beautiful part of the state. Being from PA, you'll want to know that it's a pretty conservative campus and area. It's also a place that one goes for science and engineering, not so much the humanities. But among the options you listed, it should probably be high on your D's list to check out.</p>
<p>Have you visited Clemson's website? It has lots of good info.
Clemson Univ. is in the small town of Clemson approx. halfway between Charlotte NC and Atlanta (roughly two hours to each). The nearest sizable place is Greenville SC (about 45 minutes). Clemson has a very pretty campus in the foothills of SC. It is right off I-85 so travel access is good. It has about 17,000 students. It is relatively small for a "big state u."</p>
<p>Clemson is known for engineering and sciences. I know people who grad. fr. Clemson with degrees in education, engineering, nursing, business. All those I know who went there are loved it. </p>
<p>Clemson in the the ACC athletic conference. Football season is HUGE at Clemson. The stadium seats something like 80,000 and every seat is full. Tailgating is a major social event. Basketball is coming on strong in recent years too. Their baseball team is usually nationally ranked.</p>
<p>OOS cost of attendence is $31,00 +. Clemson offers competitive freshman scholarships (renewable) for oos'ers that lowers the cost.</p>
<p>Clemson is higher rated by USNWR and it is USNWR's #2 up-and-coming.</p>
<p>Many southern schools are greatly improving and Clemson is one of them.</p>
<p>Michigan's state economy overall is one of the worst in the country, while, up until this recession that we're now going through, South Carolina's was one of the strongest. In fairness, though, South Carolina isn't faring all that well in this recession.</p>
<p>Clemson isn't that far from Atlanta or Charlotte, North Carolina (although this is a double-edged sword because Clemson grads compete with Georgia and North Carolina university grads), and is very close to the Asheville/Spartanburg/Greenville metro area. Although Clemson is far from the Atlantic, the Appalachian Mountains are quite near. Its academic year weather is much better than that in East Lansing.</p>
<p>Clemson doesn't rank with nearby Athens and Gainesville as college towns, but it's not that far behind them.</p>
<p>In my humble opinion, ACC basketball (clearly) and football (arguably) surpass that of the Big Ten, and Clemson has competitive sports programs within the ACC.</p>
<p>From the perspectives of quality-of-education, quality-of-life, and quality-of-college-experience, Clemson should be given serious consideration verses Michigan State.</p>
<p>Also, OOS tuition is likely also much less at Clemson than OOS tuition at Michigan State, and may even be less than Michigan State's IS tuition.</p>
<p>Thank you so much. It definitely sounds like it's worth a college visit!</p>
<p>Michigan State University</p>
<p>MSU by FAR. Clemson is still a redneck school in a small southern town. Unless you like that in a school you will be out of your element.</p>
<p>While Clemson has making strive in terms of overall institutional quality of late, MSU is definitely the better of the two imho. </p>
<p>Not only MSU the nation's premier Land Grant Institution, its residential colleges were modeled after Oxbridge (Oxford-Cambridge U.) from the beginning. Besides the outstanding Honors College that accepts top students that would rival the best of the nearby UM, James Madison College for public affairs & international Relations, Lyman Briggs College for Natural Science (Pre-med, Pre-Den, Pre-Vet), and RCAH (The Residential College in the Arts and Humanities) all offer top-notch liberal arts college style of education. </p>
<p>Further, MSU has one of the best College of Education in the nation, especially in the primary and secondary education which have been consistently ranked as #1 by USNWR annually. In terms of Business School, MSU's Eli Board is highly regarded in the nation, programs such as finance, supply chain management, accounting, hospitality..etc are all ranked ~top 10. also, Computer Science/Engineering departments offer quality education on par to most of its peer institutions in the Big Ten (Search IBM@MSU). </p>
<p>Last but not least, if your D is into learning physics, MSU's NSCL offers numerous undergraduate research opportunities, it's Nuclear Physics Program has just recently been awarded $550 Million by DOE to construct the most powerful next-generation FRIB. (Facility for Rare Isotope Beam). Oh, before I forget, its School of Packaging is the first in the nation, and ranks #1 in the country.</p>
<p>Being the only university in the nation with three Medical Colleges on one single campus (Vet, MD, DO) as well as a Law School in one of the prettiest Big Ten campus in terms of landscaping, it would be difficult if not impossible for Clemson U. to match what MSU has to offer imho!! :)</p>
<p>Alum
LBS Physiology '98 </p>
<p>P.S. MSU's new over-the-top Art Museum: Broad</a> Art Museum | Special Reports | Michigan State University</p>
<p>Sparkeye7 good post, though I'm not too sure if I would comment on their medical school. After all Michigan State University did decide to build it's new medical school ( including moving it's headquarters ) out of the Lansing metro area ( metro contains Michigan State University). So that shows a large detachment, as least in my view.</p>
<p>Coolbrezze, thanks for the propz! :)
There is a difference between 'expansion' and 'permanent relocation." As far as MSU's College of Medicine (M.D. Program) is concerned, moving 'some' of the students/faculties/administrations (resources in order to expand!!) to GR in the future is for expansion purposes due to the fact that there is ~15% shortage of Doctors in the state of Michigan accordingly to the survey. In fact, MSU was planning on building another medical school in downtown Detroit due to the need of physicians for Detroit metro a few years back; however, the plan was heavily rejected by the nearby WSU & UM if I recall correctly. There is definitely a shortage of doctors in&around GR/Kalamazoo area, hence the 'expansion!' Honestly, I believe that as long as the Sparrow Hospital (MSU's primary teaching hospital) is located in Lansing, MSU's College of Human Medicine is going nowhere imho!</p>
<p>Well I don't favor Michigan State University to Grand Rapids at all, I felt it was a detachment from Michigan State University as a whole. I don't see how it was the need of doctors in the Grand Rapids/ Kazoo area while there are so many other medical facilities. Plus Lansing is located right in the middle of the state, for more than just geography reasons.... I don't see how Michigan State University wouldn't have been better put right in the Lansing metro.</p>
<p>Though I can't disagree too much with where Michigan State University has it's medical school, with me having Michigan State University my top choice for undergraduate... I'm now clueless on where I would like to attend for medical school.</p>
<p>Here are reviews of the college from The Princeton Review which surveyed students at each college and compiled a written review:</p>
<p>Clemson University</p>
<p>"Clemson University, a tradition-rich Southern school “that focuses on engineering, agriculture, science, and football,” draws students who want to experience “a true community where everyone shares the same passion for education, friendship, kindness, and cheering on the Tigers.” Students here speak lovingly of “the spirit of ‘the Clemson family,’” and “bleeding orange” (if you don’t understand what that means, perhaps Clemson isn’t the right school for you). They’re almost as enthusiastic about their school’s academics, lauding their beloved president’s efforts “to transform Clemson into a top 20 university.” Clemson is already an engineering powerhouse, with “a great program for civil engineering” and “a well-organized and challenging industrial engineering program.” The school’s nursing program, education department, and hard sciences also earn raves from undergrads. The legendary family spirit here pervades student-faculty relations: professors “are very approachable and truly care about their students. If a faculty member is working on a research project and you stop by with a question from class, they will stop what they’re doing and work with you as long as it takes until you understand the subject matter.” Administrators are also “surprisingly helpful and available,” and they make an effort to show that they are people, too: “Even the school president has been seen at the late night ‘Cookie Break’ sponsored by the dining hall, talking with students and getting their opinions on the school,” says one undergrad. For those “who enjoy a cozy life in a rural area,” Clemson offers “a big-university feel on a slightly smaller scale, and a solid education.
"While “the typical student is White, from South Carolina, somewhat religious, and preppy” at Clemson, “there are plenty of students who do not fit that profile” among the school’s nearly 14,000 undergraduates. Students tell us that “Clemson has become more diverse as its reputation has grown. Even in the 2 years since I got here,” says one, “I would say that there are more students of different cultures, ethnicities, and especially religions other than Christianity; many, many more students not from the South; and also plenty of students who are not conservative.” Even so, the student body tends to be “very conservative.” Of course, regardless of students’ political views, football is a unifying force: Almost all undergrads here are “smart but laid-back, and huge football fans.”
"“Clemson football and tailgating are the most amazing experiences of college,” most Clemson undergrads agree, noting that “Saturdays in the fall there is no question where everyone is, and that’s Death Valley [the nickname of the stadium, so dubbed because it’s such a hostile environment for the opposing team]. We don’t just show up, either; everyone is tailgating at least 3 to 4 hours before the game, and I mean everyone.” The city of Clemson, “a town completely devoted to the school,” “comes to a complete stop for games, which is great.” Aside from their intensity for football, “Clemson students approach life ‘Southern style’: We’re pretty laid-back, we like to have a good time, we work hard, and we have pride.” The surrounding area offers plenty in the way of outdoor activity, as “Lake Hartwell borders the campus. We’re about a half hour from great hiking and mountain biking, and the weather is great most of the time, so we spend a lot of time outdoors.” Undergrads tell us that “Clemson is a typical college in that there is definitely a party scene” that often centers on Greek life, “which is very big.” They also point out that “there are abundant activities for those who aren’t into partying. There are movies, sporting events and intramural sports, and plenty of places to eat.” Hometown Clemson is small, but “With Greenville, Anderson, and Atlanta reasonably close by, you can do all of the shopping you need within driving distance.”</p>
<p>Michigan State University</p>
<p>"Michigan State University’s large size is both its greatest asset and its greatest potential downside. The benefits of size include near-unlimited choice: “MSU is extremely varied, and there are opportunities for anyone who wishes to take advantage of them,” including “over 200 majors to choose from.” Those majors include “good engineering and science programs,” an “amazing communications program,” “the best political science program in Michigan,” “the only agriculture school in the state,” and “an absolutely amazing School of Hospitality Business.” Economies of scale also allow MSU to offer “great study abroad programs,” “a lot of helpful free tutoring in math and other subjects,” and “great web programs that make it very easy to download class materials and view assignments. You can also e-mail the whole class questions or just your professor, through our Angel system.” As far as possible downsides to the school’s size, MSU students find that they have to “fend for [themselves].” One student noted, “Initially I came from a smaller college where there was more guidance and interaction with professors. At MSU, this is just not the case, although MSU’s residential colleges do make the university seem smaller for students in related majors.” That means potential peril for students who aren’t self-motivated. One undergrad explains, “There are two roads you can follow when at MSU. You can study hard and earn a degree in a reputable, challenging setting; or you can soak your brain cells with alcohol instead of academia.”
"MSU’s size ensures that “This is a fairly diverse campus, especially considering that it is located in the northern Midwest.” Because “Study abroad is emphasized at MSU,” there are “a lot of foreign students, and they seem to fit right into the general population.” One undergrad observes, “For the most part, everyone seems to do their own thing, and no one seems to have problems with that.” The predominant attitude seems to be “live and let live,” as “A lot of people tend to associate mostly with members from the same racial or ethnic background, although that’s not always the case.” What unites students—besides their love of MSU sports—is that most “are extremely friendly. Random people in classes ask you if you need a ride home, and, even better, random people offer you a seat on the bus. It’s comforting to know that these are the people soon entering the workforce and ‘the real world.’”
"Life on the MSU campus “generally revolves around the weekend and the basketball or football team. You get through the week looking forward to one of the two.” Indeed, “Sports are huge here, and nothing beats football Saturdays or basketball nights. Tailgating is a religion.” The school has a well-known party scene; one undergrad concedes, “We’re known as somewhat of a party school, and MSU lives up to the title. Although during the winter there is less to do around campus, being here in the fall more than makes up for it! If you attend MSU, you’re bound to have a great time.” Even teetotalers can have fun here, since “Between free on-campus movies and club meetings and concerts, there is never a dull moment on campus.” East Lansing has its own allures: a student explains, “Walking downtown on Grand River is awesome when it gets warmer out”; there are “decent stores and restaurants. Also, in the warm weather you are bound to see people sitting out on their porches. Many of them are having parties or just hanging out, and a lot of times they’ll invite you to come on up!” Or you can just enjoy the “breathtaking beauty of the campus,” with its “old buildings and beautiful trees and plants that make every walk to class a great one.”</p>
<p>Coolbrezze,</p>
<p>First thing first, you must perform well on all your Pre-med requirements & courses. Majors such as Human Biology, Biochemistry, Physiology under LBC should give you an edge for admission consideration to either the M.D. / D.O. program at MSU. As far as 'which' medical schools to attend, that should be your concern in your Junior/Senior year if you still maintain an ~A- GPA and interested in medicine (since most of the Pre-Meds change majors later on!). If you are extremely concern in getting into Med. School at this stage, I would instead suggest you to either spend big $ to attend Kalamazoo's Pre-Med Program or if you are intelligent enough, apply for the Pre-Med Interflex Program at UM. At least that's what I recall were the best options in my days! Hope this helps! :) Go State! lol</p>
<p>There is no way PoliSci is better at State than at Michigan. Also I'm not sure if Michigan still has its interflex program.</p>
<p>That's true rjkofnovi since Michigan is generally top 5 in poli-sci, but plenty of MSU people would say that the James Madison College's program offers everything that Michigan offers to undergrads in polisci/IR (UMich doesn't offer IR and I believe they're mostly known for American political science) Of course I'm biased since I'm going there next year lol, but I think many MSU grads (especially from madison, but not exclusively) are competitive from Michigan. You can't argue with the recognition that comes from going to a school with as well known grad programs as Michigan of course. </p>
<p>As for MSU vs. Clemson, the atmospheres are so different at those schools - visit both and see if you like a southern school or a midwestern school better, and keep in mind how prominent frats are at Clemson compared to MSU. From what I've heard, the people are friendly at both schools and neither one is a bad choice, but they are certainly different environments. Keep in mind location matters, don't go to MSU or any northern school if you don't like the cold, and don't go to Clemson if you want to see snow.</p>
<p>I don't know much about the JMC at MSU since I was a natural science major; however, I did recall a friend (An Evan Scholar) who was offered internship opportunity through the college his Junior/senior year working with a legislator at the nearby Lasing State Capital, he ended up gotten accepted to UM's Law School which was extremely difficult to get into even for Michigan grads. Still, I believe Michigan does have more renown faculties and resources when it comes to the overall national recognition of the PoliSci Program based on the rankings.</p>
<p>You mentioned visiting. While I would agree Clemson is a great school, their standard visit options do not do the school justice and are infact VERY poor. Probably the worst session and tour compared to how great the school is, and I haven't really heard otherwise. (then again it was one of the few non LAC I visited, but still the worst) It's kind of odd considering the legacies that likely take the tour and session. I would suggest if you were interested to seek more than the standard if they offer it. For me, I felt like I knew the campus despite the tour/session, because of games, current students who were friends, and alumni relations.</p>
<p>Clemson wasn't intially on my D's radar as she was selecting schools. But the name kept popping up as happiest students, #2 up-and-coming, friendliest college town, great weather, great school spirit and sports, etc so she has been accepted and is trying to decide between it, Penn State and a few others. Sure seems like Clemson has some momentum going right now. Also, I think 37% of the kids are from out-of-state so it's not all South Carolinians. Sounds like it should be on your D's list to take a look....</p>
<p>No snow at Clemson?</p>
<p>Actually, you could expect about one snow a year.</p>
<p>Like Atlanta, a light snow shuts everything down and a party atmosphere develops.</p>
<p>Enough snow to make things interesting. Not too much as in East Lansing.</p>
<p>MSU is nowhere near "the nation's premier Land Grant Institution."</p>
<p>It trails behind other land grants:</p>
<p>Cornell</p>
<p>U-Cal- Davis</p>
<p>Penn State</p>
<p>Florida</p>
<p>Maryland</p>
<p>Ohio State</p>
<p>Georgia</p>
<p>Clemson</p>
<p>Minnesota</p>
<p>Rutgers</p>
<p>Texas A & M</p>
<p>Purdue</p>
<p>Connecticut</p>
<p>and only then,</p>
<p>Michigan State University</p>