<p>So... my daughter got accepted into her dream school, Carnegie Mellon, BFA program in fine arts. She would like to double major in English...not strictly and "art" kid. Also accepted into Hamilton and Bard, definitely not as strong art programs, but great in English. SUNY New Paltz looks like a great art program, BFA, not sure about the academics, she is eligible for the honors program. We can pay for New Paltz out right, and she would need to go into debt probably about 50K-60K for CMU, maybe 30K for the Hamilton/Bard. Any thoughts? Advice? Any one know anything more about these schools, espcecially New Paltz? Have visited all 4 and love the campuses. This decision is sooo hard!!! Will a degree from CMU be worth it as far as grad school/job?</p>
<p>For art, I would NOT incur a heavy debt. Period!</p>
<p>Are you speaking from experience?!</p>
<p>I am speaking from the limited data set of those artists and designers that I have had contact with.However, just search data for average salaries/earnings for artists and designers. Average earnings after 3 years for computer science folks is a lot higher than for artists and designers, yet the tuition at schools like CMU is the same regardless of major</p>
<p>I do not know much about the schools specifically... although New Patz has a good rep, and the town/ area is beautiful.</p>
<p>It can be very difficult to enter an arts profession with 50/ 60K in undergraduate debt. I know many students who have gone down that path, and then are unable to take wonderful growth and enrichment opportunities in their field, because they have to work full time office jobs (sometimes combined with a waiting tables job) to support themselves AND make their student loan payments. </p>
<p>Also, many MFA programs in the arts require you to pay most or all of your way through the program... so now a student with 50/ 60K of undergraduate debt is going to incur more debt... and still maybe have a difficult time earning a particularly high salary right out of graduate school. It really depends on which area of the arts... graphic design is probably going to translate better into a job than ceramics... this does not mean that on an undergraduate level that a student shouldn't study and work in the mediums in which (s)he is passionate as an artist. I have friends that studied illustration and painting, and make a living (and support themselves and their children) as freelance artist/ designers. You never know what doors are going to open, or what paths you will go down. </p>
<p>For graduate school, I assume that the art schools are going to look at your Ds portfolio... and that is going to carry more weight than where she happened to create her portfolio... if she can get good training and develop a strong portfolio at New Paltz, the lack of debt coming out the other end is really going to free her up to follow her dreams.</p>
<p>However, if she thinks the CMU is worth the debt, and will be unhappy anywhere else it is probably worth the money... :) </p>
<p>It is such a shame the money becomes such a huge deciding factor for kids in terms of where they go to school. I guess it is an early taste of the real world... but unfortunate just the same.</p>
<p>Be advised: CMU themselves noted that total cost of tuition, room, board, fees and books will exceed $50,000 per year. This also doesn't count transportation home, medical insurance of $900 per year etc. The admission's officer that I spoke with mentioned that the actual cost is $52,000 per year if everything is filtered in. This also doesn't take into consideration future cost increases!</p>
<p>Sadly, whether you major in computer science, engineering or business, which can command some high paying jobs or art,which usually doesn't pay as well, the tuition, fees and room and board is the same.</p>
<p>Kakle, here is what it takes to amortize $150,000 of debt over 15 years:</p>
<hr>
<p>Principal borrowed: $150000.00
Annual Payments: 12 Total Payments: 180
Annual interest rate: 8.00% Periodic interest rate: 0.6667%
Regular Payment amount: $1433.48 Final Balloon Payment: $0.00</p>
<p>The following results are estimates which do not account for values being rounded to the nearest cent. See the amortization schedule for more accurate values.
Total Repaid: $258026.40
Total Interest Paid: $108026.40
Interest as percentage of Principal: 72.018%</p>
<p>Thus, they would need to pay $1,433 per month just to pay off their college debt! This is in addition to taxes,which takes up about one-third of their salary, mortgage or rent payments, car payments, food, insurance, gifts, travel, entertainment.etc. I think you get the message.</p>
<p>Thus, unless you get some substantial scholarship money, tell me how a person who majors in art, education or other low paying major will be able to afford paying off this debt?</p>
<p>IF CMU is her dream school and she got in....She should go. She can transfer out more easily than transfer in later...Debts get paid. Dreams die. I respect others' opinions since it's hard to have the debt - but still...hard to let go of the dream, too.</p>
<p>Thanks so much for all of the input!!! D has been reading posts with me and is learning from all of your opinions! We will be doing the final "college tour" this week. Hopefully FA from CMU will be here tomorrow. Looks like her debt from Hamilton or Bard would be 25K...she's willing to be an R.A. to save on the board. That may work. All of your opinions really help keep perspective. </p>
<p>Taxguy: is your D in art school? Remember reading some posts last year. Where did she end up...and is she happy there?</p>
<p>Vahevala, my daughter is currently at the University of Cincinnati School of Design, Art, Architecture and Planning. She is a Digital Design major.</p>
<p>This is my first post...just wondering if you are still interested in info on New Paltz? D is a freshman there, in business, but I could give info on the school in general.</p>
<p>gardenmom: YES would love info on New Paltz!! Just got back from our final visit tour. We have it narrowed down to New Paltz(if she gets into the honors prog...pretty good chance) and Hamilton, CMU gave us ridiculous aid and she realized that the art program at New Paltz is comperable to CMU after all. Now she is a little learly of the overall academic vibe at New Paltz. Kinda got the impression from a few people that it was a bit of a party school and the classes outside of the honors were not that great as far as challenge, great prof etc. Loved New Paltz little village, campus seems nice, new housing looks beautiful. Would love any info you have to offer...
Loved the campus at Hamilton, great academics, not so great art dept. Hmmm. Good FA, we could work with it anyway!</p>
<p>vahevala--I have never seen D work as hard as she does at NP. I think this is because her profs have been, for the most part, demanding, but they are also personable and supportive. Bear in mind that she is a regular student, not an honors student. I was shocked first semester not only that D received a C- on an essay in her Poetry class, but that her prof met her in the library that evening for several hours of point-by point elaboration of where her thinking and expression needed to grow. They worked until 10:30 pm. This prof called her out on grammar and usage as well as on superficial thinking. In Spanish class, within two days the prof suggested she move up to a more challenging level, which she did. In just two days. I was impressed. And here's something that I really like: Even though D is a mere freshman, the Dean of the Business School knows her name and they have a collegial relationship to the point where the Dean is actively seeking interships for her for the summer, trying to connect her with alums. Having said all this about academics, I must also add that D is extremely social and is involved in all kinds of things both in the school and outside of it. She is not shy, and I am sure that has helped with her networking. And believe me, she loves to have a good time. However, from watching my son go through four years at SUNY Binghamton, known as the "public ivy," where he never did meet his advisor (but then again, he never wanted to), I can't imagine that New Paltz could live up to Bing's extreme partying. The number of students who were heavy party people at Bing was actually scary. NP doesn't come close, as far as I can see, although I am sure that partyers exist there as everywhere. Hope this helps. If there is anything more specific you would like to know, just ask.</p>
<p>//gardenmom: YES would love info on New Paltz!! Just got back from our final visit tour. We have it narrowed down to New Paltz(if she gets into the honors prog...pretty good chance) and Hamilton, CMU gave us ridiculous aid and she realized that the art program at New Paltz is comperable to CMU after all.//</p>
<p>One of the better profs I had at SCAD attended New Paltz as an undergraduate - I don't know where he got his Masters degree. If you go back to New Paltz for a visit, you MUST visit Monhonk Mountain House ( <a href="http://www.mohonk.com%5B/url%5D">http://www.mohonk.com</a> ). You don't need to stay at the "castle" but you can visit and there is a really fun scramble through a bolder field to the top of one of the ridges. There are also some beautiful horse and bike trails. </p>
<p>The area called the Shawungunks is also a hot spot for rock climbing in the Northeast, but not on the hotel grounds. I think it is part of a state park and runs along the same ridge as the hotel.</p>
<p>Here are some pictures for "inspiration."
1. <a href="http://www.nationalgeographic.com/adventure/photos/Gunks.jpg%5B/url%5D">http://www.nationalgeographic.com/adventure/photos/Gunks.jpg</a>
2. <a href="http://dynamicoutdoors.com/RockClimb.jpg%5B/url%5D">http://dynamicoutdoors.com/RockClimb.jpg</a>
3. <a href="http://www.mohonkpreserve.org/picture/AutumnClimb.jpg%5B/url%5D">http://www.mohonkpreserve.org/picture/AutumnClimb.jpg</a></p>
<p>Yes, I think it has a bit of a rep as a party school.</p>
<p>gardenmom and raining again: thanks for your input on NP. So glad to hear the info on the prof's and graduates. I love the art facilities and the town itself. She isn't much of a party girl, not too worried about that, just hoping she finds kids of like mind.</p>
<p>Gardenmom: the story about your D eases my mind about the quality of the academics and teachers.</p>
<p>Now she has to decide...as we told her either choice is a great one!!</p>
<p>I was very interested in the comments made about New Paltz. My D is waitlisted at Muhlenberg and Ithaca and is now planning on attending NP for Theater in the Fall. She has also heard that it is a heavy party school which has her a litlle concerned. Perhaps we should get them in touch with each other if your daughter decides to attend. I am glad to hear the academic support that exists. Any other comments would be helpful and appreciated.</p>