<p>I did not watch the special but will try to make time to watch it with my husband and our H.S. junior. We also did not max out HELOC money when we could have and I am happy to say our older son will graduate one of our state U’s in May with no debt. I do see a difference in people’s approach to the amount of debt they are willing to assume between the time he was a H.S. student and now; there is a five year difference between the two kids. Parents do seem a little more sensible now but that really isn’t saying much. People have bought into this whole “college experience” idea almost to the exclusion of reality. Our main goal for our kids is to graduate, have a bachelor’s and be prepared to enter a masters or doctorate program after that. The elite university experience IS very appealing even to a common sense person such as myself but I don’t think that it is worth being in debt for years and years. Some people can afford it easily, that’s great. Some people will get enough grant money to make it work fairly easily, that’s great too. For the rest of the families, I say weigh the pros and cons and know what you are getting into, what the loan payments will be. At one point my son considered a smaller private school that was offering him some academic money but he would have had to borrow approx $25,000. I told him that $25,000 wasn’t bad for that education. He asked what the payments would be and for how long. A quick look at an online calculator revealed a payment of approx $250/mo for ten years. He thought that was outrageous. He said that 10 years was half his life and seemed to have an understanding that if he was starting out and trying to get an apartment, maybe a car and other life expenses that an extra $250 would indeed be burdensome. Now, as he considers a masters for speech therapy, he sees debt for that program as more reasonable because he knows there would be jobs available and that he would have income to make the loans worth it.</p>
<p>students who take the $4K extra Stafford when their parents are denied also have their loan eligibility increased to independent student levels ($57K).</p>
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<p>The undergrad dependent loan limit is $31,000; the independent limit is $57,500. Students whose parents are denied a PLUS can borrow the additional $4000/5000 per year, which is independent level loan maximums. If the student reaches $31,000 in just the base (dependent level) loans can receive more than the $4000/5000 in a year. For example, let’s say the student borrows max dependent loans each year. After 4 years of borrowing, the student is at $27,000. We all know many students are taking longer than 4 years to graduate. In year 5, this student reaches $31,000 limit after borrowing $4000. If the parent is denied the PLUS, the student would be able to borrow $12,500 total even though his undergrad eligibility is really only $4000. Next year, a PLUS denial can result in $12,500 additional unsub - where without the denial, the student is eligible for 0.</p>
<p>I agree with goru … sometimes I wonder if I am a chump for doing things this way. I couldn’t live with myself otherwise, though.</p>
<p>If it’s of any comfort to you, I don’t think that HELOCs received the same treatment as conventional mortgages in the bailout. My sis had a HELOC expire during that time and would have qualified for the low-interest refi in the gov’s affordability program but they would not include the $10K HELOC balance, which she had to pay off. She had used it to help finance her kid’s tuition, but didn’t remember there was a 10-year expiration on the line of credit! Due to the mortgage crisis, the bank was not willing to renew the line although she had adequate income, excellent credit, and 60% equity in her home.</p>
<p>If my parents are buying a house for 150K, they need to go through so much of misery to get approved. But if I want to borrow the same amount of money for education, no checks and balances. The reason is the money is going to the college. It looks like the whole thing is orchestrated by colleges. The solution to the probelm is, have the families qualify for loans same as mortgage, after all parents do co-sign it. Then the parents will think twice before the kid borrows loan. Until the kid reaches age of 24, make parents co-sign loans. The entire system is riddled with loopholes. I hate to see students take the education loans and spend 3 months in Europe partying. The tax payers are held liable for every single flaw in the system. Banking, housing, education loan failures and then add state govt and local cities going BK, it looks like USA is heading towards disaster. The FEDs keep printing money to devalue dollars. Serious inflation coming in 5-10 years. It will be like hell.</p>
<p>^well inflation is good if you owe money 
…on a serious note, inflation IMO will fix quite a few problems…credit lines will tighten up while loan holders will have an easier time</p>
<p>we need 5-6% inflation for a few years…otherwise, i think things will be very bad</p>
<p>It isn’t any surprise to see students with so much debt. Look at the adults who borrow money to spend on cars and houses that they can’t afford. Student debt is just another manifestation of our materialistic culture.</p>
<p>For many students there has already come a time when the costs of a university education are not justified by the returns they will get from it. If you graduate with $50,000 of debt and your first job starts at just $45,000 then you were scammed. Better to go to a technical college for a two year program or even an apprenticeship and get something tangible (a real skill) rather than the “potential” of a career that may never arrive. The value of any degree goes down as the number of graduates rises. Simply creating more graduates does not increase the number of opportunities available! It DOES create more competition and more frustration for those who are left out and have to get by as pizza delivery person, security guard, call center slave and any other “joe job” out there. People shouldn’t worship university educations like they are some kind of miracle; many of them are outright frauds that put money in the university’s pockets while you work for peanuts and wonder what happened to the great career you were promised.</p>
<p>If you haven’t done even the basic research regarding career/major pay and what these loans cost - then I have zero sympathy for you.</p>
<p>You made a bad mistake. Live with it.</p>
<p>The price will continue to go up as the value of a degree does. Good luck making ends meet with a high school diploma.</p>
<p>^I’ll give you credit for not meaning to do so, Sushi, but your statement is full of logical fallacies based on your assumptions.^</p>
<p>First, my father, an AT&T employee with no college degree, makes twice as much as my mother, a teacher with a Master’s degree. Thus, I say one can make ends meet very well without a college degree.</p>
<p>One can get a degree without going into debt. The Ivies and top colleges are sincerely overrated, especially for those of us in upper middle class who can’t afford them and won’t get need based scholarships enough to pay for them and won’t go into a career field that makes such a degree worthwhile when accounting for the debt encrued versus the salary expected. There is no value in a lifetime of debt.</p>
<p>^it is possible to not get into student debt or earn a lot w/o a college degree, but for a new HS grad these days, it’s hard…</p>
<p>That’s the same story they told at my parents’ age. Jobs with apprenticeships and no college degree are still out there as long as you are willing to do the dirty work: plumbing, telecommunications, heating/ac. Of course, like many, these jobs aren’t my cup of tea. I will be going to college so I can learn to work with foreign governments to provide humanitarian aid to those in need. With such a job, I need to watch the debt I get myself into, but I fully believe I can get out of college without a huge amount of debt, especially as I refuse to get a loan for anything but a master’s degree, and any loans I get must be less than my lowest expected yearly salary as stated by the occupational outlook handbook. </p>
<p>The majority of new high school graduates try to bite off more than they can chew. The temptation is out there with no one, neither parents, counselors, nor college admissions saying, “Wait, what do you want to be? There aren’t that many jobs out there for that, or your career is not going to match the price you’re paying.”</p>
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<p>The value of some degrees are high. The value of many degrees is low.</p>
<p>A degree from a non-prestigious, private school is highly dubious in value.</p>
<p>I thought the special was very enlightening. My daughter was accepted to a private university for dance in NYC but decided to stay in-state to finish her degree even though she REALLY wanted to live in NYC. We went over the numbers and it just didn’t make sense to pay tens of thousads more, especially for a dance degree. So she will get her degree in NC and then she will move to NYC.
I think a lot of these kids feel a sense of entitlement to go to their “dream” school no matter what the cost. In my opinion, there are very few degrees that can justify $100,000+ in student loans. If you have the drive and ambition to succeed, you don’t need a $50,000 a year school to make something of yourself.</p>
<p>The days of earning a good wage without a college degree(aside from a trade such as electrician/plumber) gone forever…One needs a college degree,whether the position truly requires it or not,to earn decent wages…Even 7-11 requires one, and i am 100% certain those that work there,have a degree from Schleppy U, NOT Penn or Columbia</p>
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really? … :(</p>
<p>Even 7-11 requires one, and i am 100% certain those that work there,have a degree from Schleppy U, NOT Penn or Columbia </p>
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<p>Actually, the guy who is usually on the counter at my neighborhood 7-11 when I come in has an engineering degree from the top engineering school in Pakistan.</p>
<p>what do you want to be?</p>
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<p>This can work to your detriment if you think you will be earning a lot & use that to justify borrowing a lot. 80% of those who enter college intending to be doctors end up NOT going to med school. It is always wise to keep borrowing to a minimum. There is nothing wrong with paying for a top school, as long as “paying” does not involve a ridiculous amount of borrowing.</p>
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<p>Whoa…that’s a sweeping generalization! I know many people earning over $50k a year who never went to college - and some of them are in their mid-twenties. For example…a bunch of correctional officers (good pay, fantastic benefits, state provides a couple months of training at their facility); my neighbor the utility co. linesman (scary job, great pay and benefits); my friend the alpaca farmer; a UPS delivery person; the local butcher and postmistress; the guy who owns the car dealership in town (just bought land next to BIL and plans to build his dream house…with cash); my insurance agent and my realtor (they’re older guys, don’t know if a degree would be required now); my kids’ friends who are dealers at a casino and were trained there (making too much money to leave for college right away, if ever, which is why I won’t let my kids do this!); my friend the caterer; and two other friends who own successful restaurants. I probably know more - and so do you - but I just don’t know everyone’s educational status!</p>
<p>From pakistan? Many educated foreigners can’t find work, and it is their communication skills that hurt them,not lack of education</p>