When DS built his college list, he included Pitt because of their merit options (and of course they have his major!)
Because of the good merit Pitt offers to some OOS students, Pitt came in as cheaper than our state flagships (we are #38 in the list) even with just the full tuition scholarship he was initially offered there (at Pitt.)
The best scholarship offered at our state flagship didn’t cover tuition, so overall the expenses were more. I thought it was pretty bad that our own state offered so little, but now it seems that Pitt has better merit aid for OOS students. As a parent of a future OOS student at Pitt, I’m not complaining about the merit aid he received. I just probably shouldn’t complain about my own state not offering us much.
Our #45 rank made the paper. I didn’t need this to know that our publics are very expensive if you are low income and don’t have super high grades/rank/scores - and mostly even if you do. Only one really gives big merit, even, and there isn’t really any need-based aid at any of them.
When the President of Penn State says that the best way to cut costs is to ensure students graduate in 4years, not 5, I think of all the PA families who can’t afford to send their kids to Penn State. Increading graduation rates is great, but it’s not an excuse not to have scholarships for instate students.
Just an interesting observation, as I do more research on PA schools. Penn State, Temple, Pitt and Lincoln are referred to as “state-related.” It seems like there may be a misunderstanding because different schools have different status conferred that seems to indicate a different level of funding. Obviously a lot more history on this system detail that I am not aware of. If you look up the Pennsylvannia’s State system of Higher Education they list the following Universities:
Bloomsburg
California
Cheyney
Clarion
East Stroudsburg
Edinboro
Indiana
Kutztown
Lock Haven
Mansfield
Millersville
Shippensburg
Slippery Rock
West Chester
^Yes.
The flagships are “state-related” in PA, and the directionals are the only “state” universities, which is a disgrace in itself, and doesn’t justify outpricing Pennsylvanians out of their flagships.
Also, aren’t the choices of majors at PASSHE schools more limited than at other states’ public universities that serve similar students (less selective, more commuters)?
PASSHE schools are mostly located in the middle of nowhere (Slippery Rock, East Stroudsburg etc.). There are not many commuters. Many have declining enrolments, especially in western PA.
Not being in places where lots of students can commute to also hurts affordability, even though it may not be too obvious just from looking at list prices.
I remember when I was applying to colleges in the late 70s. When you got no financial aid from Temple and Penn State you were reminded that they were “commonwealth-related” (Pennsylvania is a commonwealth–isn’t that an ironic term!) and so there was little aid to be had. And that was back when those schools were relatively inexpensive. It’s only gotten worse, with the exception of the big merit money now being offered by Temple to high-stats students.
Pitt was originally a private school that went public in the sixties. All three (along with the HBCU Lincoln) are really quasi-public institutions as members of the Commonwealth System of Higher Education. And I agree with @MYOS1634 that it’s a disgrace that our flagships are out of reach to so many Pennsylvanians.
The PASSHE schools don’t offer ABET-accredited bachelor’s degrees in engineering. There are a couple (West Chester most prominently) that have benefited from Penn State’s rising costs and are attracting higher-stats students, but they really aren’t on par academically with the state-related schools, although most are excellent for teacher training as they all started out as normal schools.
I haven’t looked at the methodology or how these rankings were arrived at, but just looking at the state we live in (Illinois, ranked 23) and the state in which my daughter attends college (Alabama, ranked 47), I don’t get it. In-state tuition for my daughter’s major (business) is roughly $10,000 at Alabama’s state flagship, and over $20,000 at the Illinois state flagship. They must be looking at something other than state flagships. I was shocked that Illinois, with UIUC being so expensive, was in the top half of affordability.
It is likely that they are looking at all of the schools, not just the flagship, and the effect of financial aid for more “typical” students from “typical” income families (i.e. not the big-merit-eligible students from high income families that seem to predominate in discussions on these forums).
@“beth’s mom” Take a look at the report for Illinois. It’s public two-year schools (with 48% of the states enrollment) is ranked 12, but the public 4-year Nondoctoral schools (9% of enrollment) are ranked 45th, and public research (18% of enrollment) is ranked 35th. The private schools (which are included in the rankings) are ranked 26th and 14th.
Since almost 1/2 of the state wide enrollment is in public 2-year schools, and they have them as highly ranked, it pulls up the states overall rankings. Then you have to consider the private schools, which also help the states overall rankings.
And as I said in an earlier post, merit based aid is “quirky” in how they work it into the rankings.
EDIT: You can compare the average net price by income of UA and UIUC.
For those with incomes less than $75K, UIUC is far more affordable. Once your income goes over $75K a year, UA is more affordable. UIUC is spending far more on need based aid, while UA is spending far more on merit based aid.
State taxpayers who find their own state’s elite public & private colleges to be unaffordable and filling w OOS students, smacks of sweat shop workers in Pakistan sewing pricey soccer balls & athletic shoes for export.
The main recourse people have is to push for more state aid for middle income and lower income families whose children qualify academically for the flagships. Influencing the platform, then voting for that plan, seems the only possible recourse.
It’s pretty common for high stat PA kids to find better deals at private schools. Two of my three did. The third went private anyway for not much difference.
I love living in our section of PA, but our higher education funding is definitely not on my “pro PA” list.
Why is NYS ranked so low? We have many community colleges (tuition is ~$3-4k/year), and several 4-year campuses. My son is commuting to a 4-year SUNY. Tuition is only $8k/year. Dorming at a state school is ~$20k for state residents. Low income students who get full Pell, TAP (state tuition grant), and the federal student loan would have a net cost of ~$5k/year. If the student works and the parents contribute a little, they can make it work. NYC has the CUNY system, so kids can live at home and get a degree. And there’s the online SUNY, so if students can’t commute they can get a degree online (that will look no different than those granted to the students who took classes on campus). I don’t think our colleges are unaffordable. Kids may not get to dorm, but they can still get an affordable education.