<p>The ACT is preferred by public universities, while the SAT is typically preferred by private (and thus, usually more selective) colleges.</p>
<p>Not the big public (state) universities that I know, like UTs, UCs, etc.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Of course they claim no preference, but it's an open secret that they have one. They can't come right out and endorse one test or the other. It's implicit that they prefer the SAT. Why do they prefer it? Because it is the more rigorous test of the two tests. Everybody knows (and many have stated on this forum) that the ACT is easier. And they have another reason: anyone dumb and naive to take the ACT for a competitive school application isn't smart enough to hack it at an Ivy in the first place.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>"Of course" ... "they can't come out and endorse one test or another" Wrong. For decades, most schools used to require one test or the other. There was and is no legal impediment to doing so. Wake Forest still says only the SAT. Randolph Macon says it prefers the SAT. Those are the only two I know of that have retained something like this. May be more, but I've been arguing this for years and those are the only two I know of now.</p>
<p>I asked for evidence and I received none. When someone says "it is an open secret" or "implicit" (or the converse is "inconceivable") that means s/he has no proof. We are simply to believe that all these colleges for inexplicable reasons decided in recent years it would be a kick to lie to prospective college students for no reason whatsoever.</p>
<p>The tests are of equal validity in predicting college success. (Neither particularly that strong, apparently, but that is another argument.) So why wouldn't colleges want to accept them both?</p>
<p>According to Kaplan (<a href="http://www.math.com/students/kaplan/satoract.html):%5B/url%5D">http://www.math.com/students/kaplan/satoract.html):</a></p>
<p>SAT or ACT?
Information provided by <a href="http://www.kaptest.com%5B/url%5D">www.kaptest.com</a>
You might wonder why you have to choose between the SAT and the ACT--maybe one of the two is favored by the students in your school. Ten or 20 years ago, choosing which test to take wasn't even an issue. Until recently, the ACT was traditionally required by colleges in the midwest, and the SAT was the test of choice in the northeast and on the east and west coasts. But now an increasing number of students are taking the ACT, and the majority of schools in the United States now accept both SAT and ACT test results. </p>
<p>How This Affects You
This increased acceptance of the ACT gives today's savvy students a strategic advantage. The SAT and ACT are significantly different tests, and in many ways, they measure different skills. So depending on your particular strengths and weaknesses, you may perform much better on one test than the other. As a result, many students embarking on the admissions process are now considering both the SAT and ACT--to figure out which test provides a better showcase for their abilities.</p>
<p>Actually if you go to this Kaplan site, it says that many educators "off the record" express a preference for the ACT! So much for an open secret ...</p>
<p>No, the SAT is not more rigorous. Sometimes people score better on it than the ACT. People have reported such scores here on CC through the months and years. You've just joined CC this month.</p>
<p>The accepted conversion chart was derived by looking at the actual scores of people who took both tests. The average comparison is what it is. </p>
<p>Your comment about students being "dumb" and "naive" -- presumably because they have researched this subject, talked to ad comms, checked out both tests and seen which shows them to best advantage -- is uncalled for. My daughter is doing well at her Ivy -- something predicted well by her high ACT score and the rest of her application. I prefer Kaplan's adjective of "savvy."</p>
<p>To answer 2400SAT (who, if s/he got this, of course is going to report that!), there are not 4 component scores to the ACT, but really 8. If schools want the ACT coupled with SAT II's they can do so, and some do. Also, people can always report scores even if they aren't required to do so.</p>
<p>I've never understood the need for a subset of SAT-preferers to knock the ACT. No one is forcing anyone to take it. If people prefer the ACT (my daughter scored better on it, true, but also liked the format better -- this was before the SAT changed its content to be more like the ACT! she would probably score the same on them now ...) and find success in taking it, why is it so necessary to dispute their experience and call them names? No, my daughter isn't an URM, legacy or recruited athlete, either.</p>
<p>Which highly selective college are you talking about that doesn't accept the ACT? The "backdoor admit" theory makes no sense, because average ACT ranges for schools are consistent with their average SAT ranges. Again, the best evidence of how, on average, people score on one test versus the other is how they actual did score(i.e., the conversion chart based on the concordance study), not on individual anecdote or personal prejudice. </p>
<p>I talked to ad comms at the potential schools of both my children and they all denied a preference. I even talked to the ad comm of a school neither was interested in (he was on a listserv with me) -- at a northeastern school -- and he said he had never heard anyone at any school express a preference to him off the record. At his school, an administrative person does the necessary ACT-SAT conversion and the committee doesn't even usually see which test was taken when they decide on admission.</p>
<p>If people want to throw in their lot with just one test (and a company that seemingly can't grade it accurately) -- and not even see if they will present a more compelling case with the other one -- they are welcome to do so.</p>
<p>Of course, people can and do take both tests and submit them both. My son did the same on them and so did this. Since they are slightly different tests, they can only confirm one another.</p>
<p>Honestly, if you TRULY believe that the SAT is a better test and Collegeboard is a better organization, then SURELY you would believe a CONVERSION CHART that the collegeboard made. <a href="http://www.collegeboard.com/sat/cbsenior/html/stat00f.html%5B/url%5D">http://www.collegeboard.com/sat/cbsenior/html/stat00f.html</a></p>
<p>ACT isn't easier and it isn't some underground strategy kids use to game the system. Both SAT and ACT are tests which over a million kids take every year, and ivies/top colleges have a set conversion chart CLOSE to the collegeboard chart.</p>
<p>Let me tell you how the chart was made. It took a pool of 100,000 students who took BOTH tests and compared the scores people got. It makes scores equivalent. It's simply a fact that many kids who take ACT are in areas of the country like South Dakota, which don't have as high achievement as the SAT. However a 32 composite (1410+) is in the 99%th percentile of ACT takers while a 1410 on the SAT is a bit lower, maybe 97th or 98th of SAT takers. So, the conversion fully accounts for the different pools of students taking the tests.</p>
<p>Two RETIRED admissions officers from Dartmouth and Harvard have written books that specifically state ACTs are converted to SATs directly and admissions people just look at the converted scores. The dartmouth assistant admissons director says there is no preference, and the senior harvard admissions officer seemed to indicate a liking for the test and said there isn't a bias.</p>
<p>These people have no reason to lie, since they were no longer parts of admissions committees. They simply commented on the reality of the process, which is that both are standardized tests that are equally accepted.</p>
<p>Anyone who disagrees with this analysis should provide some sort of evidence to back up their claims. If there really is such a bias, then WHY isn't there a book from a former admissions officer saying there is one? Someone can probably find flying pigs before finding credible evidence against either my or DianeR's arguments.</p>
<p>Saavy? More like lucky that the ACT didn't harm her applications. You keep saying that admissions people have no reason to lie, which is ridiculous. These people can say whatever they want as the admissions process is highly secretive and not open to any public scrutiny. It's really sad that some people are so naive to believe there is no preference. But if you want to be rube, I suppose that's your choice.</p>
<p>It is your choice to offer no evidence or rational argument on the subject. Restating your conclusion over and over again is no more persuasive than your ad hominem attacks. </p>
<p>You say it is ridiculous to say that colleges would not lie, yet you've yet to come up with a plausible reason they WOULD lie about this (and would get Kaplan and others to go along). So, people are supposed to believe your opinion (based on nothing you've been able to articulate) and think that thousands of college admissions officers are involved in some sinister conspiracy to trick high school students, a plot so nefarious we cannot begin to figure out what it is. And no disgruntled college employee would tell all in a best-selling book...</p>
<p>GoIvy, let me sum up what your arguments sound like (and forgive me if I'm misinterpreting):</p>
<ol>
<li>It is common knowledge that colleges prefer the SAT.</li>
<li>It is absurd that colleges would not prefer the SAT.</li>
<li>Even though colleges say they have no preference, they could lie if they wanted to.</li>
<li>In insisting that there is no preference, we are being naive.</li>
</ol>
<p>(1) is what math students refer to as "proof by intimidation". (2), to use more math slang, is "proof by cosmology". It's similar to the arguments for intelligent design (but let's not get started on that here). (3), even if it were true (which I doubt), does not prove that colleges are lying. I've claimed in many of my posts that I go to Stanford, and I could easily be lying about that. But that doesn't mean I don't go to Stanford (I do). Finally, (4), as DianeR said, is just an ad hominem argument.</p>
<p>If someone takes both act and sat
is it ok for him to send only one of them
or does he hafta send both scores?</p>
<p>lets say someoen takes act and sat and he scores significantly higher on the act and this one college accepts both sat and act, is it ok for him to send his act and just omit the sat part?</p>
<p>A kid from my school submitted only his ACT score and got into UPenn ED.</p>
<p>In response to AdamantineX: You need send only an official test score required by a college and if the college takes either ACT or SAT you can send either, but be aware of the following:</p>
<ol>
<li><p>Do not assume you can necessarily hide a score. Many high schools put all your test scores on your official high school transcript that is sent to colleges.</p></li>
<li><p>If the college also requires SAT II's in addition to the SAT or ACT then when you send those II's, any SAT I score you have will also be sent since College Board always sends all your existing SAT and SAT II scores whenever you request any one score be sent. ACT, however, sends only test score ordered.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>I agree with drusba....you can't really hide anything.</p>
<p>I think it's really disingenuous to get all up in arms and accuse me of ad hominem attacks when that's all you guys are doing to me.</p>
<p>Ad hominem attacks are those that are lodged against the individual, such as calling folks dumb, naive, not smart enough to hack it at an Ivy, or rubes. On the other hand, no one has called you any names or offered personal criticism at all. They have criticized your arguments. Criticizing the factual or logical underpinnings of someone's arguments is not an ad hominem attack.</p>