Can his college counselor help at all in lowering his expectations? If he thinks he “should not have any problem getting in” to that school list based on his stats alone, he needs to look more closely at who is being accepted. Not wanting to be a downer but last year a friend’s son who had similar GPA and higher test scores was turned down at U MN for engineering - and he’s an athlete, all-honors track at his school, both parents are alums and his mom works there! He got offered a place in the CAS. It does not pay to underestimate the difficulty of admissions to an engineering program and engineering programs look at GPA, not just scores. If he wants to shoot for GA Tech, VA Tech, Purdue, UW and U IL - that’s great, you never know - but they are reaches and he needs to add some less competitive schools.
BTW, my friend’s son ended up at UND for engineering and loves it. The fact that an engineering program isn’t T20 doesn’t mean he won’t get a good education and have a great time.
Another UA (Arizona) looks like it would offer a $20k scholarship for his stats, for a net price of about $33k. Since you did not give any numbers, we do not know if this is a good price for you.
https://financialaid.arizona.edu/types-of-aid/scholarships/freshman-transfer
Engineering admit rates:
Georgia Tech 18.6%
UIUC 42.9%
Purdue 44.6%
Wisconsin 47%
Virginia Tech 72.8%
Be careful in that Purdue and VT have a secondary admission process for engineering frosh to declare their majors (though 3.2 or 3.0 GPA respectively should be admitted).
Wisconsin overadmits and then weeds out with progression requirements. ME needs 3.2 technical and 3.0 overall to progress.
Where did those numbers come from @greymeer? I checked VA Tech and last year their overall acceptance rate was 62% - 32,000 applied, just under 20,000 admitted. Engineering entering class 50% for SAT was 1370 and GPA of 4.14 so that is a match for the OP’s son, not a reach, but that is based on last year’s numbers… and I would assume that OOS students need higher scores than the average.
^ it’s the 2017 ASEE VPI eng admission data.
VPI 8500 applications 6200 offers. For VPI this data includes CS applications approx 1000 CS applications and 500 CS offers.
So actually the admit rate is higher 5700/7500 is 76% for engineering.
I do see that recently 2018 data has been partially added for VPI, 9700 applications 5100 offers but this also includes CS offers … so 4600/8700 to 4600/7700 52.8% to 60%. This is preliminary data… wait till August to see the final.
Be careful with just admission rates without the context of strength of applicants and admits.
We are from Illinois, and my son is a senior in high school who plans on majoring in ME. So we looked at some of the school options in the midwest.
One school that hasn’t been mentioned is Valparaiso. Although we only visited 5 schools: Iowa state, Michigan state, Bradley. MSOE and Valpo, my Son liked Valpo the best.
Also, what was surprising to me was that even with his good stats (1520 SAT 3.8 UW GPA, eagle scout), he was deferred at UIUC and Case western.
You might consider Cal Poly San Luis Obispo (SLO). I didn’t go there, but I know a lot that did. It’s a very good school and a wonderful small town adjacent to it. Three full hours from either San Francisco or Los Angeles, so it’s not directly influenced by either but you can get to both (weather permitting) and have a great weekend. They also have a local airport.
I am sorry to say that your son doesn’t know. He is not being realistic. Also those numbers just mentioned above are most likely Instate NOT out of state numbers. See if your school has naviance and see who in the last 3 years got in with his stats. They are not bad stats but for OOS engineering schools in the top 20… Not anymore. Sure take a chance on a few. You are only judged by his school and district but at each of those schools kids with an unweighted 3.9 with 34 Act are being rejected. GT he needs like 8-12 AP classes with math to Calc and if he gets to Calc 3 that’s more the norm. They are also upping their instate numbers due to parent complaints etc etc. . Wisconsin is being really tough on Illinois kids but nice to Minnesota kids. VT is tough on OOS kids but love Instate. Cal Poly - not anymore… Their incoming stats are much higher. Do the research. Most of those are not giving money of any type for OOS.
Your son is a very good student but is seeking to be accepted into some of the most selective schools in his chosen field. My D and I have had this discussion. She is recent graduate of Purdue University with a degree in Chemical Engineering. She now has a good job, making excellent money with one of the top Chemical Companies in the world. Now the rest of the story. While at Purdue she did a 5 term coop with another company. Her friends and fellow coops all were Chem Es and good students, however, most came from schools like the University of Cincinnati, the University of Louisville and at least one came from University of Missouri. All of them got jobs with top Chemical companies. The common denominator was not the schools they attended but that they were good students, good workers and had work experience. While I appreciate your son’s desire to go to a top school, the more important thing is the type of student he is and what he does when he gets there. Good luck.
Michigan as a stretch, Ohio State and Penn State as likely admit, Michigan State as a safety (my daughter had similar ACT 31/3.8UW and got in at Purdue, VT, PSU, OSU - as well as Case, Lehigh and Pitt, which I wouldn’t add to your list).
I’m curious why you say there’s no costs advantage at UIUC. Their cost of attendance for in-state says $31-36K. Iowa State OOS starts at over $36K, Purdue is $41K, GT is $49K, VT is $47K, NC State is $45K, Wisconsin is $54K.
RichinPitt- U of I does not give the in state break that I have seen many other states give. I’ve looked up a lot of stated and some are around 10,000 to 12,000 for instate per year. U of I will be about 36,000 instate per year with room and board and Iowa State is 36,000 per year OOS and he would get an aputomatic merit of 8,000 per year and an engineering scholarship of 5,000 for 2 years which would have Iowa State cost less OOS that U of I in state. We still have to visit Iowa State though to see what he thinks.
" Purdue is $41K"
Purdue will be closer to $43k. Engineering has a couple thousand dollar premium. However, they just announced they are holding costs steady for the 8th straight year!
Keep in mind there are departmental scholarships once your there also @ILMomof2. Plus engineering is usually paid internships/co-ops which can be a decent amount of money.
Another thing to consider is whether it’s direct admit into ME or if there are requirements and caps. I would never recommend OSU, as there were few supports and way too much competition. They recruit very bright kids from a multi-state area with their scholarships that make it cheaper to attend for an OOS student than their respective instate schools, don’t support them, and then when they don’t make it into their major, say Too Bad. Schools like that admit too many students and expect to weed out. How unfortunate that this isn’t clear upfront. Send your bright kid to a school that wants them to succeed. U of Cincinnati certainly has supports for success in place as do others mentioned here.
Yes. We just started looking at U of Cincinnati. What are the schools have a “weed out” mentality for engineering?
U of Utah could be worth a look. They have strong STEM programs and a really nice honors college (meaningful project-based programming in addition to housing, etc.) In addition to fairly generous merit (albeit high-ish GPA requirements to keep said merit), they also give OOS students a path to residency after the first year, which can make it very affordable. They offer direct admission to engineering (not all applicants get direct-admit, and there are alternative pathways into engineering for non-direct-admit “pre-engineering” students, but I would think your son would have a good chance at a direct-admit offer). There are tons of direct flights between Chicago and SLC, and the U offers a very best-of-both-worlds combination of urban access with natural beauty and outdoor recreation. Similar cheaper-than-in-state deal to Iowa State but probably less of a “weeder” culture, as ISU’s admissions policy is more open and the STEM majors more self-selecting via the challenging coursework.
College where there is a secondary admission process to get into the major can seem to be “weed out” places if that secondary admission process is highly competitive. The reason for having such a secondary admission process is almost always capacity limitations, so the most popular majors relative to the department capacity will have the highest standards in secondary admission.
Note that several colleges have first year engineering programs, where students enter as engineering undeclared and declare their majors later. Some, like Michigan, Virginia, and Pittsburgh, have basically open admission to declare majors later (for those who are in the first year engineering programs), requiring no more than passing the prerequisites with C grades and/or 2.0 GPA. But others, like Minnesota, Purdue, Texas A&M, Virginia Tech, Penn State, Ohio State, North Carolina State, do have a higher GPA minimum and/or competitive admission to get into specific majors. Investigate carefully how high the GPA minimum or how competitive the admission process is for each college of interest and the particular majors of interest.
Other colleges have direct admission to engineering majors. In many cases, students need only to remain in good academic standing (passing with C grades and/or 2.0 GPA). UIUC has slightly higher minimums to continue in the major (somewhere in the 2.x GPA range). Wisconsin has some majors that require as high as a 3.5 technical and 3.0 overall GPA to stay in the major. Changing major may be difficult at these colleges if the destination major is already filled to capacity through direct admission.