I agree, I think there’s some of that, in addition to students who sincerely worry about their health or falling behind.
As far as UC students choosing not to show up for hybrid classes, that doesn’t surprise me at all. My younger child’s HS had online access for in-person classes most of last year, and it was striking how many kids regularly chose to Zoom in rather than show up in person. And the more kids in a given class who chose to stay home, the less motivation other kids had to show up, leading to even more kids staying home. My point is not criticize these kids – it was an incredibly difficult situation all around – but just that anytime there is an option to do school online there will inevitably be a large number of students who do just that.
This isn’t a recent pandemic created issue though.
15 years ago I was able to download a lecturers PowerPoint presentation a day before the physical class. Attendance was often only about 60%. Once you made friends with people on your course in the early days then you could organise your own social occasions, going to class wasn’t needed. The lecturer often just read straight off the slides anyway so you didn’t lose anything educational by not going in person.
Well that’s sad too. I wouldn’t want our kids going to a college where that’s the case. If it matters to parents and students, they can find colleges where very few to no classes are like that.
D said the other day “I am going to be so smart when I’m done with college”. Made me laugh. But the truth is she’s being stretched by her professors and her peers already and that’s what she (and we) wanted. This happens when kids are in class and part of a discussion, not sitting behind a screen in their bedroom.
However, the bigger problem is that the majority who want to return to classes are intimidated from speaking out by fear of being accused of “privilege” or “discrimination” by those who’ve learned to manipulate the system.
You’re right. Right now the student movement to stay online, offer hybrid etc. (I’m not 100% clear on all of the demands) is spearheaded by the Disabled Student Union, at least at UCLA. Try calling out the Disabled Student Union and see what happens…Most students say they would do anything to help their disabled fellow students. But there are many students who want what they signed up for, not what works best for the few. BTW there is a center to help students with disabilities at UCLA (my daughter has a friend who is hearing impaired and has many accommodations through this center).
I hope UCLA shows some leadership. Right now things are messy this quarter and I will reserve judgement until after the dust settles. I will come back to the thread and give an update when I know more. My daughter did drop a lab class because it was going to be online and in her appraisal that was a waste of time. On the other hand she has had classes with profs that have gone above and beyond helping students with their learning (both academic and socioemotional). So overall she’s happy.
Wow. I had not heard of that incident. The manipulation of the system, the discrediting of sources, and the harassment of one sides opinions create a place that quiets discussion and mandates false apologies. Watch.
One of S21’s friends attends UCLA as an OOS student. Is knee deep in transfer apps because the experience has been nothing like he expected.
Three of his four first quarter classes were primarily remote (I guess technically hybrid, but I don’t have all the details), and then with the whole month of January being remote (he stayed at home), he’s had enough.
Some might say he didn’t give the school enough of a chance, but in reality he will have a lot of options, no one at UCLA is showing leadership in the form of communicating a path to normalcy, and the college years go by fast.
So sorry to hear that! He should go where he can thrive. My daughter’s first quarter was all in person and very active in clubs and outings. Did he choose hybrid first quarter or was it imposed on him? I know they kept some classes online for students that couldn’t make it to campus due to the pandemic but I thought it was a choice. It doesn’t sound like it for your acquaintance.
I think it was just the setup of three of his classes (I’m not sure whether he could have chosen other sections that were in person). I know one class was 1,000+ students, and I believe that one is always hybrid.
He did try and get involved in some things…a club here and there, and intramural sports (but only met grad students there, LOL). But, he applied for and was rejected from a number of clubs too, which has added to the overall poor experience. So that’s a big reason he didn’t even go back until just this week.
Anyway, I agree he will likely thrive elsewhere, and I’m confident he will be able to transfer if that’s ultimately what he decides.
1000+ or 100+? My daughter’s largest class had 140 students in lecture, 15 students in discussion. Smallest class 7 students (she loves it and the prof is a gem of a human).
Sorry again and thanks for sharing. I live and learn. I wonder how they get to student to instructor ratio of 18/1 with 1000+ people classes…
Who knew that parents in a college related internet community would have such low opinions of college students at top institutions like the UC’s?
Believe it or not, there are many college students who, absent covid, would much rather have classes in person, but are nonetheless uncomfortable attending crowded classes during periods where the covid risk is extremely high. It could be they have a medical issue or potential medical issue. It could be they have contact with siblings, friends, parents, or grandparents who are vulnerable. It could be that they don’t want to get the virus for fear of quarantine. It could be that, in their own cost-benefit analysis, attending a lecture online is not a big deal and is much less stressful than sitting in a crowded classroom with people coughing all around them.
Of course there are also college students who really suffer by having to attend classes online and will mask up and there every day if they can, but even some of these students nonetheless recognize that having the online option during periods of high contagion is the best path toward normalcy.
Sure, some are lazy n’er-do-well’s who probably wouldn’t show up with covid or not, but to broad brush a large segment of college students at top institutions into this group? Seems overly cynical, at best.
Student — Tests administered on campus (this week): 121
Student — Currently in isolation: 56
So it seems as if they are only testing very selectively (<10% of students)? If only symptomatic students are tested, then you’ll likely have high positivity rates.
It also sounds as if they do ask for vaccination status, but possibly don’t require?
In contrast, Barnard College (and Columbia University as a whole) had started in-person classes on Monday, in-door dining the Friday before and some (but not all) restrictions on gatherings were softened.
Boosters are required university-wide, and from 1,079 tests thus far this week, they had 5 on-campus, 1 off-campus, 1 staff and no faculty positive (0.65%), with 10 persons in isolation.
So far, it looks sustainable.
They do ask for your vaccination status including booster status, but don’t require vaccination. They did gateway testing of everyone at the start of the semester, but those tests aren’t included in the chart. Otherwise, vaccinated students aren’t tested regularly, only symptomatic testing or if triggered by wastewater testing of their dorm. Unvaxxed (or decline to state) are tested every other week (more often for athletes).
Thanks for elaborating.
In Michigan less than 60% are fully vaccinated (SOM - 404 - Page Not Found). So, if Hope College is somewhat representative of the population (or possibly “attracting” individuals who refuse vaccines), it might contribute to them seeing a larger percentage of cases than colleges with strict vaccination policies.
At the beginning of Fall semester they said that 83% of students were vaccinated. I haven’t seen any updates of that figure though. They did ask people to update their records as to whether or not they’d had a booster.