I mean if you know anything about American history you know who Robert E. Lee was. Elihu Yale? Not so much. They don’t teach about him in history class in high school.
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What a compelling, heartbreaking firsthand account from a Black student at the college. Appreciate the link.
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I’ll assume that posts will deal with the questions outlined in the opening post and will neither simply rehash posts from the dedicated W&L thread nor get bogged down in minutiae like where Lee’s remains are located.
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I would not be too surprised if Native American Opportunity Plan | UC Admissions had something to do with Morrill Act land grants being land taken from Native Americans, although there does not seem to be any announcement of such.
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Until just a few years ago, an important lake in Minneapolis was called Lake Calhoun. When a name change was proposed, there was a fair amount of resistance with all the usual arguments especially that “we shouldn’t erase history.” But the name change went through anyway, and after a couple of years of work to readjust (including teaching people how to pronounce the new name) the new name now seems pretty normal and natural. And best of all, in my opinion, the new name actually enhanced understanding of history rather than “erasing” it, because the “new” name is actually the name the lake was called for centuries by the original people of the area, the Dakota.
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Hmmm, if the name change did not go through, would there have been a movement to call it informally “Lake Slavery Politician Calhoun”? I mean, that would make the history more prominent…
Or other informal names to highlight the history…
“Slaveholder Washington and Slaveholder Lee University”
“Slave Trader Yale University”
“Smallpox Amherst College”
“Robber Baron Carnegie Robber Barons Mellon University”
Along those lines, there was a student vote at Stanford University in the 1970s to change the mascot to “Robber Barons”.
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I live in an area where there were two high schools with mascots called the Indians.
School A changed the name to that of an animal about six years ago. Many people were vehemently against this name change. There were bitter community arguments, but overall, most people seemed to agree that the school had to move with the times, and the change occurred.
It’s already hard to recall when they hadn’t been the new mascot.
School B is now proposing the same thing and that community is really lashing out.
It’s always the same arguments. Snowflakes are referred to on all sides😄. I don’t need to reiterate because we all probably know what those arguments are.
School B will almost certainly change its name. People will get over it.
We have to acknowledge that times change. A lot of people don’t like change, of course. Change can be uncomfortable.
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Right – I wonder how we will be judged by the human-derived life forms a couple hundred years hence. Even those of us who try really hard to not engage in the -isms might be missing some microaggression that will really trigger future generations.
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I think a lot depends on what is meant by “historical context,” and how intertwined the school is with that abhorrent history in contemporary times. In the case of W&L, we aren’t talking ancient history.
If, as recently as a few years ago, Yale was forcing all new students to sit through lectures falsely extolling the many virtues and “honor” of Elihu Yale, then there would be a much better case for changing Yale’s name too.
Likewise, if Lord Jeffrey Amherst was the symbolic figurehead of an enduring and pervasive myth centered on the “honor” and nobility of the man, and if such genocidal racists marched and celebrated in Amherst annually, then there would be a much stronger case for changing those names too.
Not sure that it makes sense to equate slavery and genocide with “microagressions.” Those things were evil, then as now.
As for future generations I hope they look back with an eye toward correcting similar evils that may now exist.
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Along those lines I have wondered how long Florida State will continue with the Seminoles and the “tomahawk chop”.
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That’s just it – we may believe we are being more or less righteous, but we may be overlooking something that becomes axiomatic in the future.
It is true that there were debates about slavery in the 18th and 19th centuries – maybe they wondered how the issue would be viewed in the future. They had to be aware… right?
Maybe in our times, that is gender dysphoria, affirmative action, abortion, or the role of government – or some other issue.
Known issues aside… I wonder if there is something we currently accept, which almost nobody deems controversial, which will be frowned upon in the future. It’s those things unknown to us that I worry about.
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However, even by the standards of the time they lived in, some historical figures were much more pro-slavery than others. For example, those who enslaved others and voluntarily joined or donated to the Confederate States or pro-slavery political causes indicated that they were more pro-slavery compared to others of their time. Avoiding presentism (judging historical figures by today’s standards) does not mean that historical figures get a free pass on stuff they did that was particularly noxious even by the standards of the time they lived in.
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OP’s reference to “bad actors” is not referring to the film industry, rather “a person or organization responsible for actions that are harmful, illegal, or morally wrong.”
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Exactly. There was a vigorous anti-slavery movement at the time. There was a national debate over slavery that had been going on pretty much since the American Revolution. The Union, after 1863, at least, was fighting in part to eradicate slavery. The British Empire and most of the western hemisphere had already abolished chattel slavery (only Brazil and Cuba would follow the US). So the Confederates do not get free passes. It was clear even then that they were on the wrong side of history.
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Fort Benning, Ga. – rename Fort Moore after Lt. Gen. Hal and Julia Moore.
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Fort Bragg, N.C. – rename Fort Liberty after the value of liberty.
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Fort Gordon, Ga. – rename Fort Eisenhower after General of the Army Dwight Eisenhower.
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Fort A.P. Hill, Va. – rename Fort Walker after Dr. Mary Walker.
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Fort Hood, Texas – rename Fort Cavazos after Gen. Richard Cavazos.
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Fort Lee, Va. – rename Fort Gregg-Adams after Lt. Gen. Arthur Gregg and Lt. Col. Charity Adams.
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Fort Pickett, Va. – rename Fort Barfoot after Tech. Sgt. Van T. Barfoot.
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Fort Polk, La. – rename Fort Johnson after Sgt. William Henry Johnson.
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Fort Rucker, Ala. – rename Fort Novosel after Chief Warrant Officer 4 Michael J. Novosel, Sr.
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Yup and many of those were lesser figures that most people don’t learn about in history class – like Gen Braxton Bragg. I wish they had found another person to name Fort Bragg after rather than Liberty – that just sounds like Liberty Mutual insurance to me – but I appreciate that they are looking at this and making changes.
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The US Navy is doing something similar: Navy to change name of warship honoring Confederate battle victory
The guided missile cruiser Chancellorville, named after Robert E. Lee’s greatest battle victory, will be renamed Robert Smalls. Robert Smalls was born into slavery and conscripted as a harbor pilot on the Confederate ship Planter. When the overseers were away, he “snuck the ship out of Charleston harbor in 1862, spiriting away his family, other slaves and military cargo before handing the steamer over to the U.S. Navy.”
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Yes, these changes are being made across all branches.
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I somewhat agree with you. But obviously a slave trader (Yale) is abhorrent right? Was abhorrent even then?
I’m more interested in the whole philosophy behind name changes than the particular case of W&L or Yale or Amherst. Where’s the line? Who gets to decide? What comes into the decision?
I’m going to bow out of the discussion now because I’ve always believed that debating on the internet is kind of silly. These are important discussions but best had face to face.
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And is against CC TOS. 
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