Columbia Arrogance?

<p>I know that Barnard’s a top- notch school, but do Columbia students tend to look down on Barnard as a “back door” to their school, and is this attitude terribly pervasive?</p>

<p>Some do, yes, but I wouldn't call it pervasive. It gets a lot better after your first year, definitely, when the cockier Columbia students find out that some of those normal, smart girls in their classes were Barnard students, and get over themselves a little bit. And then a lot of Columbia students aren't arrogant like that to begin with.</p>

<p>But a not insignificant few will stay that way through all four years, and will probably still be like that til their dying day. They're pretty avoidable, though. (stay away from people who say they posted on CC!! ;) )</p>

<p>I am going to Columbia and I have to say, I don't think I will have a problem with Barnard girls at all. ;)</p>

<p>whew. I guess that's kind of consoling/good to hear. my greatest fear about going to barnard is that the columbia students will be douchebags about it. otherwise, barnard is great!</p>

<p>Well, when I went to Columbia they called the West of Broadway----the Barnyard. THen again, most of my classmates were jerks and I ended up dating a girl from Barnard who was beautiful and brilliant and is still a good friend.</p>

<p>Yes, but who are "they?" No one I know actually calls it that; they just know "it's called that."</p>

<p>As you said, mostly jerks. :)</p>

<p>Ha, the Barnyard. My brother keeps saying that I "want to go to a hillbilly school. Baaaaarrrrrnnnnnnyard! Mooo! A vegetarian is going to Barnyard!" Of course, then I punch him and it's all good again. :)</p>

<p>I think the whole thing on the part of the Columbia students is kind of stupid. I mean Barnard girls are smart. Just because some have lower test scores than some of the Columbia girls means absolutely nothing. Its like they are completely ruling out people who could be awesome friends/girlfriends just because of a stupid test score. My view is if you are cool and can hold an intelligent conversation when the time calls for it, then you are cool with me, I don't care where you go to school.</p>

<p>
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Just because some have lower test scores than some of the Columbia girls...

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</p>

<p>And some Columbia women may have lower scores than some Barnard women and women from both might have higher scores than some of the Columbia men...</p>

<p>Barnard women rock---the one's that I had in my classes brough interesting prospectives and were definately as motivated and as intelligent as the Columbia College kids. Barnard women have the great advantage of having a real sense of community, sisterhood etc, while having all the advantages that Columbia has to offer.</p>

<p>Ha, most definitely, catnamedzane. If I ruled out everyone with a lower standardized test score, I'd have no friends. And not just because I did well, but also because that's a stupid shallow way to choose friends, and who would put up with that?</p>

<p>That is what I am saying. I am saying that the only reason some Columbia people could possibly put consider themselves better than Barnard is because SOME of the Barnard girls have lower test scores (I am getting this from the mid 50% on US News), and I am saying that is stupid. Come on ladies, the last thing I want is a war before I even get to college. Just know I agree with you, and I am a Columbia guy (not all of us are mean jerks).</p>

<p>Just bringing back this old thread.. it's funny and also a lot of girls applying are so concerned about this issue.</p>

<p>HAHA, I remember when I was applying to Barnard and I was worried about this so-called "Columbia arrogance", and Barnard girls being looked down upon. Now that I've been accepted and I plan on going there, it really doesn't seem to be an issue to me anymore.</p>

<p>I think Barnard is really the best of both worlds and if I do happen to come across some unpleasant people who find Barnard girls inferior I'll just step out of their way.
Now it just seems like a really shallow thing.</p>

<p>It really is true.. lower SAT scores really means nothing.
The only reason why I think Columbia girls may have a hissy fit is because of the attractive, intelligent, sophisticated women who STEAL their Columbia men hehehe :) LOL!
Go BC GIRLS :) </p>

<p>Let me put this out to some Columbia guys: Is there a certain appeal/attraction to women who go to an all women's college? ;)</p>

<p>Is there usually any kind of disdain for Barnard students who also happened to be rejected by Columbia? </p>

<p>I have heard that people who don't get into Columbia will just make themselves miserable if they settle for Barnard, but that's not really how it would be with me. Even though I had applied to both and originally considered Barnard "just in case," I came to like Barnard more and appreciate all the nice stuff about its being smaller and more personal, plus I was considering women's colleges in general (Smith). </p>

<p>I would hope it isn't such a common thing for Columbia to look down on Barnard, but I was wondering if students who get into Barnard and not Columbia are considered, at either school, to be getting into Columbia through the back door or something. Although I don't really think Barnard could be academically inferior in any significant way.</p>

<p>It depends on their attitude. There are some people who really liked both schools. But the thing is...</p>

<p>With many people, they're COLUMBIA! COLUMBIA! From day one. It's this big fancy school that's famous, impressive, and clearly better than other schools (regardless of what they know about it in detail, they're confident of this much). Once they get rejected...</p>

<p>They either really do start looking at other schools with greater attention, and finding great places that don't have that knee-jerk "DREAM SCHOOL" reaction, but might actually be better for them in many ways. So do they "come to like" another school.</p>

<p>Or they pretend. They say now that they have perspective (i.e. don't have the option), they realize that a smaller school is better for them, and they're going to get the best of both worlds, yadda yadda, all that great viewbook stuff. Since people can easily do this insincerely, it's hard to believe the people who LOVED Columbia, got rejected, and honestly had a change of heart and really ARE glad they got rejected to open their eyes and broaden their options a little bit.</p>

<p>I'm not disdainful of students who get rejected from Columbia, just as I don't think I'm better than students who get rejected from Barnard. Admissions is a silly process that often has little to do with how smart or interesting or hard-working someone is.</p>

<p>But I am disdainful of those who feel like they need to keep mentioning that they're SO glad they didn't get into Columbia, because Barnard is SO much better anyway, and those Columbia girls sure are suckers. Heck, think it all you want. ;) But if you say it all the time, it starts to sound a little fishy--who are you trying to convince? And even if you believe it, saying that is JUST as rude and immature as someone saying that you were using Barnard as a backdoor.</p>

<p>In short, no one's going to care if you don't harp on it all the time. Be proud of where you go to school, but don't be annoying about it.</p>

<p>Well Gretel, that is my case.. And back in Dec when I heard my Columbia ED rejection, I thought I'd be miserable at Barnard and that it would not be the best option because of my former interest in Columbia, but I still applied because I knew that my feelings would be different come April. I have also heard about how some people use BC as the "back door" entrance to Columbia. I guess people can choose to see it like this if they wanted to, but it is just a matter of opinion. There are plenty of women who choose to go to BC rather than CU from the start. And others who choose BC over CU, if they get into both.</p>

<p>And sure enough, come April, my feelings have completely turned around. And quite frankly, I got over my rejection very fast, and after a couple of days later I was moving on and looking at all the other prospects for a bright future.
Before, I saw Barnard through the affiliation with CU, but now I see BC as its own entity and love it for what it is. Of course I'm not GLAD and LOVE it that I got rejected from Columbia. That's not the case at all. I was devastated and crushed. And I moved on. I'm not "settling" for Barnard, like as if I'm just going to Columbia's counterpart. If I saw it like that, I wouldn't want to go, because I'd be so worried about being inferior or 2nd tier or whatever. I just want to go there. Believe it or not, I'm going to say it, for ME it is the perfect combination and the BEST of both worlds. Now this may be a bias because I'm going to Barnard and I am very sure that if I got into CU, I wouldn't have had to consider Barnard. I'm making do with my situation and looking at it in a positive way. I am grateful for what I was able to get (within my capability and reach).</p>

<p>But like I said before, I think everything happens for a reason, and each individual finds their own path... And my path happens to be Barnard. I think that that is where I am meant to be. I have considered all the other 4 schools I got into, and Barnard is the one that I feel most comfortable with, and I know I'll be most happy there.
For me, it is the perfect place as I want to major in English literature and Art history - Barnard has an excellent English dept and I hear Eng. is the most popular major there. And I've known of CU's strong English dept too. Both unis have great Art History depts as well. And I absolutely adore New York City and all it's wonderful resources and internship opportunities.. I couldn't ask for anything more.
I'm sure that I could have coped with the workload at CU, and I'm sure that I would have been happy going there too, but turns out that BC may be just the perfectly snug fit for me.
The setting of a intimate LAC atmosphere is very similar to my HS, and I think I'd really flourish with the personal attention and care given at Barnard.
Like primefactor said in few of her posts, the professors at Barnard really want to help you and teach you.
Last night my parents' friends came over, and the man had just recently graduated from Columbia Grad school and he strongly emphasized that at CU it is hard as an Undergrad to have close contact with professors (on the whole). He said that the famous renowned professors were so "busy" esp. living in a huge city like NYC... they are constantly called to go to certain events and what not..
So being in a small LAC within a large research university is such a blessing.
And I think I'd definitely love the experience at a women's college being surrounded by strong, intelligent, gifted women.. There's just something about women's colleges... </p>

<p>Truth be told, I think it's a matter of how you want to deal with BC/CU relationship.
Like someone told me before, if you want there to be a difference then you can make it to be like that.
Under my circumstances, I chose to go to Barnard. If I felt bitter about not getting into Columbia and felt the need to bad mouth it all the time I wouldn't have chosen to go to Barnard. There are other great schools I could have gone to.
But I still love CU and now I love Barnard too. I have been wanting something for the past 2 years, and the opportunity has shown itself, there is no way I would turn it down.
Having said that, I don't think I'll be trying so hard to be a CC student rather than a BC student.
As for the Columbia arrogance, I think it is definitely avoidable.</p>

<p>Thanks very much for your responses.</p>

<p>To clarify a little about me specifically, I only found out about the Columbia rejection yesterday; I meant that I had decided at some point a few months ago that I would probably prefer Barnard--the greater focus on undergraduate students was important.</p>

<p>I think this seemed like it could be a problem because I was still a bit disappointed about being rejected. I did consider, though, how annoying it would be if I were to always qualify the Barnard/Columbia thing as you said, primefactor ("Barnard is SO much better anyway").</p>

<p>But I suppose that since I'm sincerely interested in Barnard, it doesn't really matter if people think I'm going to be looking longingly over at Columbia all day, because I won't be anyway. I just worried that there could be some sort of problems with it that might go along with any general antagonism between the schools. </p>

<p>But, yeah, I guess it doesn't really have to be a big deal.</p>

<p>Well to be honest Gretel, when you go to college people don't need to know and won't know that you didn't get into Columbia but got into Barnard and ended up going to Barnard..
You know what I mean?</p>

<p>And you sound like you sincerely like Barnard and if you think you'll be happy there and it's a place for you, then I don't see why you wouldn't go there.
I'm sure if you wanted it, your parents would be more than happy to let you go.
I don't think there is sucha "antagonism" between the schools. I have friends at both CU and BC, and they are friends with both CU and BC students.
And I know that in sororities there are both CU and BC girls.</p>

<p>If I, who didn't get into CU ED, can be fine with going to BC.. then I'm sure you can too.
I for sure won't be looking anywhere longingly either.
I'm just happy with what I have.</p>

<p>"I wouldn't have had to consider Barnard. I'm making do with my situation and looking at it in a positive way. I am grateful for what I was able to get (within my capability and reach)....I'm sure that I could have coped with the workload at CU"</p>

<p>But that IS settling... and automatically assuming it says something about your capability, what you can get... the assumptions about workloads... even if you like the school, you still think it's inferior.</p>

<p>Also, note on terminology: BC is contained within CU. It's BC/CC you're comparing. :)</p>

<p>But there really aren't that many problems with antagonism, honestly. There are a few bad apples at Columbia, but mostly, no one cares who goes where. It's never been a problem with any of my friends or my significant others, except for the VERY occasional "You're so smart, I always forget you go to Barnard," which to be honest is still a little insulting. :P to them and their silly stereotypes. A lot of my friends even confess that they are a little jealous of the way we gamed this whole college thing, but that they figured it out way too long after they'd been here.</p>