<p>Hi guys. I've got a bit of a dilemma with money and college.</p>
<p>I'm a rising senior about to start summer break, about to start the grinding college search. I'm your generic CC student: astronomical Unweighted/Weighted GPA, decent ECs at school, a lot of volunteer work/internship. I'm planning to apply to all the big names - Ivies, top LACs, UCs.</p>
<p>For most of my high school life, my goal was to get into UC Berkeley - I was dreaming of how much money I'd save on college, living within commuting distance to a top school. But a few months ago, I started looking into international schools.</p>
<p>And I decided my dream school was Oxford.</p>
<p>And that's where the ball drops. I'm super middle class - $100k per year, two-parent, one-sibling family. Oxford's tuition is about $20k per year. Adding in living expenses, the total comes out to roughly $35-40k per year. If this was a US school, I would have no hesitation in applying, because I know that being middle class and a strong, meritable student would earn me decent chunks of financial aid.</p>
<p>But there is no financial aid overseas.</p>
<p>Furthermore, you must have a secure income in order to become a foreign student - ie, you must demonstrate that you can pay whatever it takes.</p>
<p>So, I guess the question I pose to you is: What can/do I do to make my dream a possibility? Oh, and don't forget that most scholarships will only grant them to students entering US schools.</p>
<p>@'rentof2: I thought about that, but I guess I should clarify a bit.</p>
<p>I’m hoping to apply as a history/politics course as an undergrad, then come back to the states for an American law degree. I don’t think there’s a Rhodes scholarship for undergrad.</p>
<p>Go to Berkeley or wherever you can afford. Take a semester or year abroad at Oxford. That will make it affordable. If that can’t work out, consider going there for one year after graduating from your UC for a BPhil. Or if you qualify for one of the big scholarships (Rhodes, Marshall, etc.) you would have the money for an MPhil or PhD.</p>
<p>know that being middle class and a strong, meritable student would earn me decent chunks of financial aid.</p>
<p>First of all, that thinking isn’t correct. At the UCs, you wouldn’t get any aid. The income is too high…and financial aid isn’t based on being a “meritable student”…it’s based on income, and yours is too high. Attending a UC will cost your family about $30k per year. </p>
<p>Your EFC is going to be about $30k anyway, and most schools don’t meet need.</p>
<p>You need to ask your parents NOW, how much will they spend. If they won’t spend $30k per year, then you have to find schools that will give you large merit scholarships (many schools do NOT give merit scholarships or don’t give much). </p>
<p>So, don’t do things backwards. Find out what your parents will spend, determine your “expected family contribution” (likely around $30k), and then find schools that will work out for you. Keep in mind that most schools don’t meet need, so use the Net Price Calculators on their sites.</p>
<p>On top of that, I don’t plan on living on campus, so what I would pay would be substantially less, even without financial aid.</p>
<p>@lastminutemom196/happymomof1: That is an option, but if I were to study abroad, it’d probably be in Hong Kong - I qualify for a resident/ID card there if I stay for a little over 6 months. I wouldn’t be opposed to studying abroad, though.</p>
<p>@Iron Maiden: Upper middle class? Lowly wealthy? Not sure where I fall along the scale anymore. I do suppose that we make enough to look wealthy, but we’ve actually got quite a few loans to pay off.</p>
<p>Based on these responses, am I to understand that there is no way I can afford an undergraduate education</p>
<p>Yes, Cal has launched that program. But getting accepted to THAT UC is iffy. The other UCs don’t have that program and I was mostly just commenting on your belief that American schools would give you lots of money. </p>
<p>“we’ve got quite a few loans to pay off”.</p>
<p>That above suggests that maybe your parents won’t be able to contribute much or anything. If so, then that would be a problem if you don’t get accepted to Cal (which would be the cheapest option because of new aid policy and commuting). </p>
<p>The Cal policy is 15% of your parents’ income…which is $15k. It mentions COA, but the COA for commuters is a lower amount. (You may be thinking that the COA is the same, but it’s not.) And, your aid will include loans so you won’t be able to borrow to cover parent contribution. You need to find out how much your parents will pay. </p>
<p>If Cal determines that COA for commuters is $22k, and your parents are expected to pay $15k, then all you’re going to get is a $5500 loan. Your parents will still be expected to pay the $15k. Will they do that? </p>
<p>@lerkin: Community college would be a useless experience for me. With the CA budget cuts, community college classes are overflowing, and many students cannot get into classes they need. Furthermore, I don’t need to go to CC to fill up GenEd requirements - with a grand total of 16 AP tests across the curriculum. Unless the collegeboard lied to me, I (possibly mistakenly) believe that they’ll get me out of most prerequisite courses?</p>
<p>“Students seeking to transfer to Cal State and the University of California will be denied access, those students unable to get into Cal State and UC and who desperately need to get into a community college will be denied, as well as those who are out of work and are coming to us for retraining,” Scott said. “We will do the best we can, but we will not be serving the needs of students or meeting our education goals.”</p>
<p>COA for Cal is about $33k. My parents contribution will be $15k. So, I’m going to get $18k in aid. But, I’m going to commute, so I can use the entire $18k for my costs. </p>
<p>It doesn’t work that way. You’re commuting. Commuters have a lower COA and all the calculations will be done from that perspective. The $15k contribution from your parents will be deducted from the Commuter COA, then grants, loans and work study will be applied to cover the balance.</p>
<p>@mom2collegekids: I’m hedging a guess here, but based on my stats and knowing other students’ stats going to Berkeley from my school, Berkeley is well within a match for me. It’s
a pain to type out my stats, so let’s just assume I can do it. And yes, you’re right. Let’s say that I won’t receive any need-based aid at all, and that my parents are expected to contribute a grand total of 30k, which they can probably do around $20k. The loans we have do take a chunk of income out, but not so much that they can’t contribute at all. They’re planning (if I wanted to go to Oxford) to draw from their own retirement fund to help pay for tuition.</p>
<p>As for backups, there’s always the state schools who would be glad to accept me.</p>
<p>First…could those who are quoting from another post PLEASE use the great quote format on this forum. It makes reading your posts MUCH easier than with quotation marks and the like…</p>
<p>Ssorry…I don’t mean to be the “forum police” but really…it IS easier to read quotes if they are done using this format use a [ then type the word quote then use the ] …then type your quote or cut and paste it…At the end of the quoted words you use the [ again…then the / then the word quote and the ]…no spaces.</p>
<p>Now to my reply to the OP. Attend the most affordable school…and do a study abroad. Personally I think you are looking at college application choices in a very tunnel vision way. The schools you have on your list are all HIGHLY selective and most don’t even offer merit aid to students, only need based. Yes, if you happen to get accepted to HYPS you would likely get some decent aid. However, there are no guarantees at those schools regardless of the strength of your applications. 90% of the students who apply to these schools are denied acceptance and most have outstanding credentials.</p>
<p>Your parents should NOT be asked to withdraw from their retirement funds to pay for college. FIRST if they are really withdrawing, there is a tax penalty and a withdrawal penalty. This is not worth doing. In addition, the money IN their retirement accounts is earning interest for their retirement years, and truthfully should be left alone for that purpose. Retirement accounts are long term accounts.</p>
<p>If you truly have the stats to get accepted to HYPSM, then you have the stats to garner significant merit aid at MANY other schools. I would urge you to look for threads (now six or so years old) from a fellow…Curmudgeon. His kiddo was very very bright. The kiddo had very strong stats as you do, but finances did enter into the picture. The Ivies were not particularly generous. This kiddo attended Rhodes College and had an abundance of wonderful opportunities. Oh…and the kiddo got terrific merit aid. That student is now a medical student at Yale.</p>
<p>You certainly can do a study abroad. Many colleges actually offer the ability to do a term or year at another U.S. school…another way to “broaden your horizons”.</p>
<p>Yes…apply to some of those tippy top schools if you choose to do so. BUT really cast a MUCH broader net than the one you are casting. You may find that there is a college out there that is awesome, and will offer you a great merit package that will bridge the gap between what your parents can pay…and the cost of attending.</p>
<p>OH…are you a NMS finalist? If so, you might want to also look at USC.</p>
<p>nobody is saying that you don’t have the stats for Cal. However, those of us who are familiar with the UC system know very well that Cal and UCLA reject kids with high stats all the time.</p>
<p>I wasn’t asking for you to post all your ECs and stuff…just your stats…UC-GPA and SAT or ACT score. How hard is that???</p>
<p>Borrowing from retirement is a terrible idea and you shouldn’t expect your parents to do that.</p>
<p>While it may not seem that paying $20k per year from your parents will be difficult, you mention debts and living in the SF area is expensive…so please ask your parents how much they’ll pay each year WITHOUT borrowing.</p>
<p>If your stats are that high, why not open your mind to other possibilities and locations within the US? There are many places what would be delighted to have you and might make attendance affordable. Then you could consider a semester abroad. IF you want to have a different experience than California, there are countless places in the US which are as different as different could be.</p>
<p>If you have debt from undergrad and/or need to take debt for law school, rethink that. Law isn’t the field for people with debt now and it won’t be for years to come. So if that’s truly your goal, move heaven and earth to eliminate undergrad debt.</p>
<p>Sorry, I think I missed that from your post. Whoops. UC GPA is around a 4.7 weighted, UW 3.9. SAT is 2290.</p>
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<p>They’re not going to withdraw the full amount, that would be suicidal. My parents have explicitly stated that they will withdraw the maximum of 50000 on a loan for all four years. They won’t be giving me any further aid other than a home and living expenses if I stay at home. Nothing from income, there are too many expenses for that.</p>
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<p>Is there perhaps a list of schools that offer substantial merit aid? As for grad school debt, my original (naive) plan was to stick to Berkeley as my goal, then save on everything and start working part time. I also thought that I might be able to graduate within three years by taking as many APs as possible to cover an entire year’s worth of gen ed requirements.</p>
<p>Once you put “rising senior” and “about to start the grinding college search” into the same sentence, it’s time for a reality check. Forget the notion of Oxford being a dream school. It’s a different sort of education, with, in many respect, less flexibility. Go for the study abroad year, as all are saying, or go for grad experience. You will need lots more exploring of your options. Are you really just now asking about merit schools- some work is needed here. Google. Read some of the college guide books. And, no matter what your stats, college isn’t just about you, what you want and what you think you deserve. Don’t ask your parents to take away their retirement because some school is your teenage dream.</p>
<p>If your family has TOO many expenses that they need to borrow from their retirement accounts…YOU the student need to do some more research into colleges. Your stats are good…and would net you some terrific aid at OTHER schools. You need to have a much more open mind about this college search.</p>
<p>When finances are a consideration, it is VERY important NOT to have a “dream school” especially one that is not affordable. The reality is the money may not be available for ALL FOUR YEARS (and yes…I am yelliing) for you to attend. Your parents say they can borrow from retirement now…but what if something happens and they actually NEED to do so for some other reason?</p>
<p>I’m sorry…but with the financial considerations you are stating here, you should REALLY be looking at programs where you have guaranteed funding or at least a HIGH chance of getting some good merit aid for all four years. It doesn’t sound like you have done so.</p>
<p>If it were me, I would keep UCB on your list (because you can commute to one of the BEST schools in your state…for a great instate price), add in a couple of those reachy peachy schools (MIT, HYP etc), and then look for some schools with similar characteristics where you would garner significant merit aid. Find a couple of those you can love. Oxford is a great school…but the cost of attending sounds like it is currently out of reach for your family.</p>