<p>S was very excited with the UVA acceptance until he saw the FA package. He has been offered $3k work study and $5k loans. He is most likely to choose a private school. The scholarship or need-based he received from every private school he received makes each of them a much more financially viable option. He loves UVA a lot and we thought it can be an excellent option as it is one of the very few public universities claiming meeting demonstrated need 100%, but apparently their terms of "demonstrated need" are very different from what at least some of us would think.</p>
<p>It does meet 100% of demonstrated need. The other schools are going above that. The aid changes from year to year also. By her 4th year, my roommate had all work study and no loans. I wonder if the aid from the other schools is the same in the 4th year. One of my high school friends had to take out a 10k private loan to finish at her private college in her 4th year.</p>
<p>One more comment: some public universities like UVA and UNC offer merit scholarships. They are great opportunities but the benefits are limited to maybe less than 5% of the accepted. Among those lucky ones, OOS kids may be only 20%. With those top qualification, they will be admitted to top private colleges, which in my opinion are generally more generous with aid.</p>
<p>@hazelorb I mention 100% under their terms. But private schools’ interpretation is more favorable to families based on my opinion. UVA maybe is the best in public schools. Understandable with what they are doing - it is essentially supported by Va taxpayers. </p>
<p>Not complaining. Just want to share my thoughts on picking schools for application and attending from cost perspective.</p>
<p>Financial Aid to meet “demonstrated need” is very different from Merit Aid, which has nothing to do with financial need. Don’t confuse the two. For example, if your FAFSA says you can pay $20K and UVa’s COA for OOS is $56K, then your “need” is $36K. Don’t expect to see more than $36K then when totaling AccessUVA aid, federal loans, and work-study combined. UVa does Not provide merit aid/scholarships. It would appear that since your son qualified only for $8K between work-study & federal loans and yet not for any AccessUVa grant $ that your FAFSA indicated a high ability to pay close to full COA. If that’s not the case, then you should be contacting the Financial Aid office to discuss.</p>
<p>If you are fortunate enough to get Merit scholarships at universities that provide them, including Private universities, then Yes, your cost can be less at those institutions. </p>
<p>UVa does its own determination of EFC. Our EFC as determined by the FAFSA is zero, and 5 other schools my S was admitted to also determined EFC to be 0. But UVa determined it to be about $1500. They confirmed that the determination was made based upon income with very little of it being determined by assets. We did ask the financial aid department to recheck as we thought this was a mistake because our family’s income is so low, but they confirmed their determination of the EFC. The EFC amount was put directly into an unsubsidized loan. My S also got the maximum in subsidized loans capped at $7000.00 per year. This is the first year in which accessUVa program includes loans and we had thought that the cap of 7k per year was reliable. However, caution, when they determine their own EFC which doesn’t align with FAFSA or other colleges, it seems to be a way to go beyond the cap for low income families causing them to have to take out unsubsidized loans past the 7k subsidized loan cap. So the ideal of a low income student graduating with no more than 28k subsidized loans after four years is not necessarily the case. When you combine their own determined EFC with the unrealistic work/study amount of 4k per year, there is still a significant gap for low income families to overcome. And in reality the only way to do that is via unsubsidized loans. This made the choice for our family between an instate school and UVa a heart wrenching one. My S loves UVa and his state school (determining that his EFC is 0 as the FAFSA did) offered him full tuition and all other expenses paid with only a $3500 per year subsidized loan. One would think it’s a no brainer and to take the instate school. But my S decided that when he graduates UVa he will be able to pay the 28k in subsized loans and the 5k+ in unsubsidized loans and will be attending UVa. He went with his heart, not cost. As a parent I’m left with mixed feelings. I support my son following his heart as it’s his life. But I feel that the revamped accessUVa program is not exactly as it presents itself. This causes me to have mixed feelings about his decision.</p>
<p>Neon - I’m sorry it is difficult for your family. However, keep in mind that the vast majority of US colleges do not meet 100% of need. In my state, the flagship public university meets about 60% of need and most of that is federal and state money, not money from the university, and tuition is much higher than in-state at UVa. </p>
<p>I do agree that $4,000 of work study for UVa out of state students is too high - particularly for first year students who are still getting adjusted to college life. If a UVa student can find other funding (such as good summer jobs or outside scholarships), they be able to avoid that work study.</p>
<p>My experience as a middle income OOS parent, as of 3 years ago, was that UVa’s net cost and amount of loans was very similar to private universities that said they met 100% of need. Those private universities typically said they were offering a mix of private and need-based aid, but the result was the same. One selective private university was much higher in net cost.</p>
<p>Charlie thank you for your shared concern relating to the $4000 of work study. But focusing on the work study issue is less important for potential students than understanding how the new accessUVa program is applied. This being the first year that low-income entering freshmen have experienced it (all other UVa students prior to the 2014-2015 year are grandfathered into the former no-loan accessUVa program). The new accessUVa program provides a SUBSIDIZED loan cap for low-income students of 7k per year (which I think is the maximum amount of subsidized loans that a low-income student can receive from the federal government). But there is no unsubsidized loan cap. The examples of how accessUVa works on the UVa website show students with an EFC of 0 recieving 7k of subsidized loans and grants (federal and accessUVa) equaling the total cost of attendance. No unsubsidized loans. And I think that many people thought or believe that is how the program is/would be applied. But that is not the case. We have a FAFSA EFC=0 and 5 other colleges (1 public and 4 private) have also determined that our EFC = 0. That is a compelling objective measure. Yet UVa determined our EFC to be 1500 and included an unsubsidized loan of that amount along with the 7k of subsidized loans to our S’s financial aid. It seems as though this is a way to get around the proposed “loan cap” for low-income students and add unsubsidized loans rather than increasing grants. Since this is the first year for the new accessUVa, it’s important that potential applicants understand how it really works. Our low-income student will graduate UVa with 28k of subsidized loans as promised by the accessUVa program, BUT he will also graduate with at least an additional 6,000 in unsubsidized loans not contemplated for an EFC=0 student. </p>
<p>I will be the first to agree with the point that the $4k work study expectation is too high, and impossible in many cases, and that the offer of unsubsidized loans is not “aid” (and in fact I complained about both last year). But the loan is an offer you do Not have to accept. Our S was offered both the $4K work study and the $1500 unsubsidized loan. He turned the loan down, and will make a more reasonable $2400 in work study and hopefully make up the other $1500 over the summer. There are ways to cut COA through budgeting for living expenses, buying discounted books, travel, etc. and we’ve been able to make it work with the lower actual amount. 2nd year may be more of a balancing act as the Room cost amount is determined not on where you’re staying, but rather is based on the lowest dorm rate - so we’ll have to find more areas to cut - probably with a reduced meal plan since S doesn’t eat 3 meals a day. @neon, you stated that prior year students were no-loan. Just remember, this is ONLY the case for instate students. OOS students have previously had a loan amount. </p>
<p>Thank you grp2013, and we are hoping we won’t need the subsized loan that financial aid is telling us we will need. Of course he doesn’t want to take it and would rather find ways to cut expenses (travel, personal spending, meal plan) so that he won’t need to. @grp2013 you are mistaken about OOS previously having loans through the accessUVa program. In years prior to 2014-2015, accessUVa met the need of low income students both instate and OOS without loans. Here is a link to a chart that shows how accessUVa will work in 2014-2015 as compared to how it worked in 2013-2014. The link is to a chart on the accessUVa website. This chart shows that OOS students with an EFC of 0 received no loans as part of their accessUVa package in 2013-2014. Here’s the link: <a href=“http://www.virginia.edu/financialaid/forms/Documentation/Access%20UVa%20Examples%20082013.pdf”>http://www.virginia.edu/financialaid/forms/Documentation/Access%20UVa%20Examples%20082013.pdf</a> I’ve also found articles on the web concerning the decision last year to change the accessUVa program and there are discussions about how for instate and OOS low income kids, it would mean loans where there weren’t any before. Lastly, when I’ve discussed the EFC=0 issue with financial aid just days ago, we discussed the chart that I’ve linked to above and they confirmed, under the former program no loans for EFC=0 instate and OOS students.</p>
<p>If you are eligible, I would always take the subsidized federal loans. There is no interest accrued while you are an undergrad, and they can also be deferred during grad school. You can always decide later to pay them off early.</p>
<p>The amount of subsidized loans that can be taken out each year is limited by the feds. If you don’t take out federal loans your first year, you can’t take out extra amounts of loans in a later year. </p>
<p>The Perkins loan program also may not be renewed by Congress. It could disappear in 2 years.</p>
<p>You should never use up all of your savings your first year, but should try to spread it out over 4 years.</p>
<p>Also, situations may come up that require an extra semester. UVa aid only covers 8 semesters, so you want some breathing room just in case.</p>
<p>Thanks for the interesting information on this trail. Am I right that UVa does NOT offer any merit aid to OOS freshmen? </p>
<p>@neon, thanks for the chart - I do stand corrected. I apparently mis-read that for OOS last year. Unfortunately for us we can really only afford $0 (3 kids, one disabled, one income, etc.) but our EFC says otherwise becasue they don’t look at expenses - so we have our share of loans on the horizon. But our instate U was similar, so… Oh well, who wanted to retire anyway? </p>
<p>@charlie, Savings? What savings?! LOL! :)</p>
<p>UVa offers almost no merit aid to first year undergrad students. There are a few merit scholarships listed on the UVa financial aid page. There also are some scholarships available to students as they get older, tied to specific departments and programs, etc. The Jefferson Scholarships are run by a foundation and provide a limited number of full tuition scholarships to superhuman entering students. </p>
<p>Generally, it is easiest to win scholarships in your local area, but they are often only $500 to $1,000, and often are only for the first year. Families should also think about their state education grants. The states often provide grants to both Pell grant recipients and to students from middle income families. In my state, a middle income student is eligible for much more funding if they attend an in-state college than an out of state college.</p>
<p>@Charliesch my S will take the subsidized loans because you are totally correct about not wanting to come up short. What grp2013 and I were discussing was the possibility of not taking the unsubsidized loan which if taken would result in 6k of additional debt at graduation that would be accumulating interest the four years he’s in school (each addition of $1500 would start accumulating interest that year, so only the first $1500 would accumulate interest all 4 years, but the next would be 3, and the next 2 years of interest, then the next senior year would be one year). These uncontemplated unsubsidized loans are the ones we’re trying to avoid. lol @grp2013 about savings and retirement. My retirement will probably be spent flipping burgers at Denny’s. But at least with my S attending UVa, his won’t. Thank you to both Charliesch and grp2013 for a most helpful and informative discussion. If you’re any example of your kids then my S is going to have a wonderful time at UVa with sharp, thoughtful, and compassionate peers. :D</p>
<p>Oops I see in one of my responses I said I was hoping not to need the subsidized loan. I meant were hoping not to need the UNSUBSIDIZED loan. My bad. Sorry for misleading you Charliesch.</p>
<p>@neon, thanks. I believe your S was accepted in Engineering? My S is in engineering as well. Obviously we’re hoping it will pay him dividends as well and he can support us, so no retirement necessary right 
On a serious note though, I do believe with an engineering degree coming out of UVa our kids should be in good position to deal with the loan amounts they are expected to have. Also, if he’s interested in continuing with band (you posted in another thread he played flute, yes?), feel free to PM me and I can pass along some information. The band program is great, and there are many engineering students involved.</p>