<p>why ask for advice on what to do when you don't consider any of it?</p>
<p>I am considering the advice, but I need explanations. Some people here agree that this is stealing, while others don't.</p>
<p>For those that do think it is stealing, I would like to hear better explanations. I stated above the definition of stealing and what I did doesn't portray that definition.</p>
<p>"You're the kind of guy that uses the "But the keys were in the ignition, so they meant to give it away!" defense when they're caught by a police bait car, aren't you?"</p>
<p>This statement has nothing to do what I did. Did I got the company and steal the computer? No I didn't.</p>
<p>I bought the computer and I never received the computer. Therefore, I filed a chargeback. I then a received a refund from my credit card company.</p>
<p>After this, I ended up receving the computer from the company. They sent me the computer eventhough they offered me a refund.</p>
<p>The order could of been put into the system before you got the chargeback.</p>
<p>The order was in the system, but they stated that my computer would be shipped within 48 hours. I got no confirmation that the computer was shipped and no response from them.</p>
<p>After I received the refund, they responded to my e-mail and said they never know when items will be shipped and called me impatient.</p>
<p>After about a month, I received the computer and a full refund.</p>
<p>Return the freaking computer, or pay for it. You didn't pay for it yet. How do you not understand that this is stealing?</p>
<p>You seem to be making the distinction here based on the fact that you didn't "actively" go to a store/vendor and steal a computer without paying for it. They "gave" it to you by mistake after charging your account back, and you think that poor service is enough justification for you to keep over a grand's worth.</p>
<p>Thing is, you're "actively" deciding to keep the computer even though you did not pay for it. It would be like if I robbed a bank, ran down the street, and handed you off a bunch of cash. Clearly that money was stolen. In this case, clearly, the computer is also stolen if you decide to not pay for it.</p>
<p>It looks like you're just ignoring any advice that tells you it's stealing, and are looking for people to just appeal to you by saying "Eh, it's their fault -- go ahead and keep it!"</p>
<p>Furthermore, you're hoping they're going to just overlook it. When they do inventory checking, they are going to have you on record as someone with an unconfirmed/charged back payment, but with a shipped computer. They'll quickly put two and two together, and you'll get charged anyway. A thousand-dollar product is not something they're going to just dismiss so easily -- they WILL notice an entire grand is missing from the books. Not only is what you're doing morally wrong, but it's illegal, and you're probably going to be charged later for it ANYWAY. You may as well pay for it now instead of risking future issues.</p>
<p>Also, to address your response to this post:
"You're the kind of guy that uses the "But the keys were in the ignition, so they meant to give it away!" defense when they're caught by a police bait car, aren't you?"
You say this has nothing to do with what you did, when it really does. His point was that you're using some external circumstance/fault to justify your own wrongdoing. If the keys are in the ignition of a car, that doesn't give you the right to use that car, as it's not your car! You can't just "assume they meant to give it away." If a woman is mean to you, but passes out drunk at a party, that doesn't give you the right to take advantage of her just because she was mean, or just because you can. You can't assume "she was cruel... I deserve compensation!" If a company ships a computer to you without charging you properly, that doesn't mean you can just keep it because they took forever to get it to you in the first place.</p>
<p>So, yes, you're stealing. Please stop trying to get around this fact and do the right thing, here.</p>
<p>It's not stealing. It's the companies god damn fault. They actively shipped it to you after you got a refund. If they want it back, it's on them to contact you about it and arrange it. Pretending you didn't receive it or trying to delay the process of giving it back would be stealing. Passively going along with their idiocy is not.</p>
<p>"It's not stealing. It's the companies god damn fault. They actively shipped it to you after you got a refund. If they want it back, it's on them to contact you about it and arrange it. Pretending you didn't receive it or trying to delay the process of giving it back would be stealing. Passively going along with their idiocy is not."</p>
<p>Finally somebody understands what I am trying to say. If they charge me, then they charge me. The computer will be used either way.</p>
<p>It would be stealing if I received the item, contatced my credit card company that I never received the item, and keep the item.</p>
<p>"Not only is what you're doing morally wrong, but it's illegal, and you're probably going to be charged later for it ANYWAY. You may as well pay for it now instead of risking future issues."</p>
<p>Tell me what is illegal about getting a refund for a computer I never received, but later received it. Please state the law I am breaking and what I can be charged for. </p>
<p>The only future issue will be that I will be charged and the case will be closed. Or, the company will overlook it and I will keep the computer.</p>
<p>Say you're living at 740 Evergreen Terrace. A valuable package that should have been shipped to 742 Evergreen Terrace gets delivered to your apartment because somebody accidentally put down the wrong address on the mailing form. Do you feel it is wrong for you to keep the package?</p>
<p>Also, just realized that since this computer you got went through the mail it's quite possible that it could be considered a federal offense since it's quite likely the package crossed state lines.</p>
<p>It's technically a federal offense to open up mail that doesn't belong to you under obstruction of correspondence. Since your computer came in the mail, and you haven't paid for it, it doesn't belong to you, and so I'd assume it operates under a similar law. I don't know the specifics as to whether or not "belonging to" operates under, purely, address or under proper transaction... since it was addressed to you and was simply not paid for.</p>
<p>Either way, you're not even clear about the law (and admittedly, neither am I when it comes to unpaid packages), but you shoulder potential liability since you know you've already been refunded for something you should have paid for, instead. If you are disregarding morality here and truly don't care that you're taking something you didn't pay for, you should at least look into the legalities. Just "waiting to hope and see" is a very dangerous strategy when it comes to law.</p>
<p>They <em>WILL</em> probably notice it eventually, just like they eventually shipped it. Keep it unopened and give it back to them when they do. You can send them an email saying you have it and want to give it back if you haven't already--they seem so disorganized it wouldn't make a difference.</p>
<p>The package wasn't shipped USPS, it was shipped UPS. Therefore, a federal offense would be out of the question.</p>
<p>There is no law that says you can't open mail that has your name on it (even if it wasn't paid for).</p>
<p>I think they will probably notice their error, but there is a chance that they won't. If they do notice the error, I will be charged and I will keep the computer. If they don't notice it, I will keep the computer.</p>
<p>This information is straight from the Chase website. This is written to the merchant's point of view:</p>
<p>Non-receipt of merchandise - cardmember is claiming they did not receive the merchandise
or merchandise was paid for by other means.</p>
<p>To Avoid:
Do not process a transaction until merchandise is shipped. If a customer has
paid for merchandise by another method, do not process the transaction.</p>
<p>To Dispute:
Within twelve (12) days of the date you were debited we must receive proof
that the merchandise was received (i.e., UPS, Fed Ex, etc. tracer and delivery
receipt; signed invoice, customer name and delivery address).
If possible, contact the cardmember directly to resolve the inquiry/dispute.
Submit a letter in writing to CHASE MERCHANT SERVICES, L.L.C. with supporting documentation stating why you believe the Chargeback may be improper or invalid.</p>
<p>I recieved my chargeback refund on September 10. It has been almost a month. They have to respond to the chargeback within 12 days.</p>
<p>It says they have to provide proof that they shipped the merchandise or contact me directly to resolve the problem.</p>
<p>They did neither. I am not surprised. They seem like such an unorganized company.</p>
<p>
[quote]
The package wasn't shipped USPS, it was shipped UPS. Therefore, a federal offense would be out of the question.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Interstate commerce is interstate commerce.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Since your computer came in the mail, and you haven't paid for it,
[/quote]
</p>
<p>He did pay for it. </p>
<p>He later asked for a chargeback. </p>
<p>He got the computer anyway. (Did it come with a bill?) </p>
<p>He also used the money to buy another computer. </p>
<p>Now, he's expected to use HIS TIME AND MONEY to send it back for NEGATIVE profit? (opportunity cost)</p>
<p>Something is unjust here. The company should use ITS time and money to claim it back.</p>
<p>Legendofmax, RacinReaver: but your analogies are flawed. The company is causing him great inconvenience by making him go through the whole motions of calling up and waiting on the phone for what will be most likely 20 hours, just so he can arrange for some means to return the computer.</p>
<p>The computer did not come with a bill.</p>
<p>This is my whole point. The computer company should use its time and efforts to contact me, it should not be the other way around.</p>
<p>Even if I didn't buy another computer, the situation would be the same. The company provided poor customer service to me, so I will offer them poor service. </p>
<p>I know two wrongs don't make a right, but the company should learn from their mistakes.</p>