<p>My 12-year-old son has qualified for the CTY summer program (SAT 640 math; 610 verbal). He is very interested in the science and math courses. I was wondering if any of you could answer some questions.</p>
<p>Which campuses are comfortable, and which are very hot with non-airconditioned dorms? My son hates the summer heat (but runs around all winter without a coat).</p>
<p>Which science courses are best? He wants to take Fast-paced HS Physics, but does not have the math prerequisites. He is in an accelerated 9th grade math class, and will take the NY State Regents A at the end of this year.</p>
<p>What are the self-paced math courses like? I got the impression that these involved sitting in front of a computer working alone most of the time. He can do this at home all year with EPGY - do these courses offer any more than EPGY does?</p>
<p>He desperately needs to be around other bright, intellectual kids. Any advice would be appreciated.</p>
<p>S was at Union College (no longer used for CTY) and Skidmore. Neither had air conditioning. Students are advised to bring fans. I believe colleges in the Northeast generally do not have air conditioned dorms.</p>
<p>S did Fast Paced High School Physics after 7th grade. He had begun AP-Calc by then, so despite the fact that the class was made up of older students, he was able to keep up. I don't know the level of the Regents Math curriculum so I cannot say if that would be adequate preparation. In general, Fast-Paced High School Physics is the equivalent of Honors Physics, the precursor of AP-Physics C. AP-Physics C is usually taken concurrently with AP-Calc, so I would assume that the FP HS Physics would require precalculus. The text that is used is fairly light on the math side. The FP HS Physics class provided an excellent preparation for AP-Physics.</p>
<p>I did CTY for 3 years. I would recommend doing courses that wouldnt be available in highschools. I really would recommend Genetics, or Investigations into Engineering. I thought that the site at Lancaster, F&M college, was a really good site b/c of its diverstiy in types of ppl that were there. The Johns Hopkins Site is also a nice site, but there arent as many ppl there as in Lancaster. </p>
<p>My son did his first year when he had just turned 13 at St. Mary's College of Maryland. One of his best friends in the program was 12. It was a very nice campus for a "First timer" because it is one of the smaller CTY campuses, so the participants became very close knit very quickly. St. Mary's also has suite style housing so it seemed like it was very easy for the kids to hang out with other people. The dorms were beautiful, and air conditioned. There seemed to be a bit more supervision as the resident advisor lived in each suite. A plus: St. Mary's is an absolutely beautiful campus, right on the water.</p>
<p>Last year, his second, my son attended the Lancaster/Franklin & Marshall (as did his friend). The Lancaster program is larger and more spread out - traditional dorms, lots of socializing at night in the open area in front of the dorms. My son loved it, and will be returning to Lancaster this year, but I think he would have been a bit overwhelmed there his first year. Lancaster and Carlisle (Dickinson) apparently attract more older CTY'ers as well.</p>
<p>As for the classes, I can't address the math/science classes. We left the choice of class up to our son and, while he loves math and science, he surprised us by picking Ancient Greek his first year. He loved it so much that he and two friends started a letter writing campaign to get Johns Hopkins to add a session of Ancient Greek II last year, which he attended. This year, he has a budding interest in philosophy so he hoping to take Philosophy of the Mind.</p>
<p>In any case, you shouldn't worry at all about sending your son to CTY. It has been a life changing experience for my son, both socially and academically, and he is very sad that this will be his last year. In fact, his only regret about CTY is that he didn't go when he was first eligible in 7th grade so he "missed" a year of the experience.</p>
<p>It depends on the child, but I preferred to use CTY as a way for my daughter to gain enrichment beyond what was available at school rather than acceleration. I just wouldn't be comfortable that three weeks of a course could provide her with enough depth to proceed to the next level of a subject. For someone else with an exceptionally bright child, that might be enough but I don't think it would be the right choice for her. Additionally, her high school has block scheduling and breaking the usual sequence can be highly problematic with scheduling honors/AP classes.</p>
<p>As much time as they spend on academic work, I think it's the social experience that makes CTY so worthwhile. My daughter came home with a totally new perspective on what it means to be a smart kid. It was a tremendous confidence building experience.</p>
<p>2) Intro the the Biomedical Sciences at Loyola-Marymount</p>
<p>Both were be in warm weather. Let him choose whatever course interests him the most (although I would support your decision not to choose a math course). Mom of Four brings up a great point - use the program for enrichment, not acceleration. I would highly encourage your son to go back the proceeding year and diversify his course selection. Although all subjects are fantastic, its a good idea to choose one that maximizes the campus's facilities. </p>
<p>One thing to keep in mind is that the camp emphasizes group and outside activies. Time dedicated to the actual subject is a small portion. Your son will engage in a variety of sports, arts and crafts, and dances. Each day the student is given a wide range of options, but attendance is mandatory. I believe it to be a well rounded experience and have met countless quality people there. Hope he has fun!</p>
<p>It does depend on the child whether the child wants to acclerate or take classes not usually offered in school. There is no single best strategy.</p>
<p>My S decided to take the fast-paced high school science classes precisely because he was afraid that the Honors classes in those subjects would be slow (he took Chemistry after Physics). In my S's vocabulary, slow means boring and unchallenging. The instructor who taught Chemistry to my S ordinarily teaches AP-Chemistry in his own high school. At the end of the session, a test is administered; it is designed by the National Science Teachers Association to test the knowledge of high school students.
CTY classes are not for students who need a lot of practice "to get it;" nor do they make any allowance for classroom disruptions. But if we calculate the time in class and actually learning in a 3-weeks CTY session vs. a whole year in school, it actually makes sense that CTY is able to cover the same amount of materials because the students are motivated to learn and not horse around and they have similar levels of ability and preparation. Both of my S's CTY classes prepared him well for the AP classes. Each class has a student counselor who assists the instructor. Dorms have Resident counselors who organize activities and maintain discipline. While older kids may chafe at some of the rules, younger kids seem very comfortable with the structure. They are housed together based on the courses they take, so they have opportunities to socialize outside of class.</p>
<p>Thank you all for your comments. Marite, my son is not as far along in math as yours was, so I think the Physics course will have to be left for another year. The Regents Math A is algebra. Carolyn, the St. Mary's campus is no longer a CTY site. There are 5 East Coast locations; the three that the catalog notes are difficult to get are JHU, Lancaster (F&M), and Skidmore. The other two are Dickinson College in Carlisle, PA, and Siena College in Loudonville, NY. </p>
<p>This discussion is quite helpful as it has made me aware of the choice that must be made between enrichment and acceleration. Like Marite, I have no doubt that my son could cover a one-year HS course in 3 weeks, and he would love the opportunity to move at what would be a better pace for him. I agree that there is much time wasted in a normal classroom. But what happens if a child accelerates through much of the HS science and math curriculum, but is on grade level in English, social studies, and other humanities courses? </p>
<p>j_blg, the Investigations in Engineering course caught my eye, but they recommend against a first-timer taking it, saying that it is particularly intense. So I think this one will have to wait until another year as well. I'll let my son look through the catalog this week, but I think he'll end up trying for Astronomy or one of the math course (Math Modelling, Cryptology, Probability & Game Theory, Mathematical Logic). I may try to get some of the textbooks out of the library so that he can get a better idea of what's involved. There were a number of humanities courses that I think he'd like, too.</p>
<p>Thanks for the reassurances about the experience there. My anxiety level is rising as I think about him being away for three weeks. Besides everything else, he has food allergies and has to carry an Epi-pen.</p>
<p>Sorry to hear that St. Mary's is no longer a CTY site - it was a very good place to spend three weeks. :(</p>
<p>NYMom, I am sure you will find the right class for your son. I honestly believe that you can't go wrong with ANY of the CTY classes, as long as it is in a subject that your son is interested in. And, I agree wholeheartedly with Momoffour --- much of the growth that occurs through CTY is directly related to the social aspects of the program, not just the academics.</p>
<p>Stanford- Intro to the Middle Ages was very fun and very informative-no A/c and wasn't on the east coast.</p>
<p>UCSC-Intro to Logic was also fun and no A/C.. actually, none of them had AC</p>
<p>the last two years I did at Dublin City University through CTYI (the I is for Ireland) and they were the most fun. I took a class on Irish archaeology and we did many field trips and it was the best class I've ever taken, ever. The other class I took there was Psychology. I believe they offered some sort of applied science looking at things under microscopes type class that I heard was great. It also had no AC but it wasn't needed, as it was in the 70's the whole time. I HIGHLY reccomend the irish program and wish I'd done it all four years instead of just the last two. There are other americans there, but its predominantly irish, and its a wonderful experience to go to another country and just be there for a while with other kids.</p>
<p>I also ditto that you shouldn't take a class you can take somewhere else. You don't get credit for it, so just take something you'll really enjoy, not just something you can take anywhere.</p>
<p>Both my S and D did CTY for several years and both had very positive experiences. Neither mentioned the heat as a factor and they were in upstate NY locations but both had fans. Also probably depends on the particular summer weather.( Last summer- a particularly hot one for upstate NY, my D was in a Cornell un-airconditioned dorm-not CTY- and the heat was horrific even with two fans!But-she wasn't in her dorm very much, so....)They are very different personalities. D more social; S more intellectual. My S went to Skidmore for two years. D started at Union (no longer site) and then went to Siena. They took both enrichment and accelerating courses. The enrichment courses they were more excited about but the accelerating courses- e.g. math, sciences enabled them to be more creative in their high school choices- worked out well. I would definitely recommend CTY experience-very well organized- if only for the social interaction.Of course there might be small glitches- your child might love the teacher, not like the assistant as much- love the kids on the hall but not think his roommate is the greatest-think the course isn't as exciting- or love or be indifferent to his RA- But, of all the summer programs we paid for, this was definitely worth the money. Also, when my S went to college, he ended up knowing over 20 other freshman from his various programs, maybe half from CTy- my D is starting in fall- we shall see, but that was really fun for my S.</p>
<p>I agree with everyone who says that CTY has a vast array of courses that are not on a regular high school curriculum but are very enriching. If your S is interested in some of them, by all means go for them.
My S thought of his CTY courses in the context of his curriculum. In fact, the reason he took the Fast Paced High School Physics course was that his 7th grade science teacher warned him that the 8th grade science curriculum was going to be unchallenging- This sent him to take the SAT pronto! He found that he could more than hold his own in AP Physics, so he decided to take chemistry next; he had a blast, literally and figuratively, as the class featured some rather spectacular experiments!
My S was advanced in math and science but not in the humanities and social sciences. Once he finished the high school curriculum in math and sciences, he took college classes in those subjects. Quite a few students in his high school and in schools from neighboring districts do so. Interestingly, our high school lets students take college classes only in math and science, figuring that it can accommodate them in the other subjects better because humanities and social studies are not sequential, so there is no running out of courses to take.</p>
<p>My S did not get along very well with one of his roommates, but he had lots of fun with other kids in his hallway and he liked the instructors, TAs and RAs.</p>
<p>My kids did various sites but I seem to recall that F&M in Lancaster has airconditioning in the dorms. Agree with everyone else... you can't go wrong with course selection, but it seems that the stuff you can't get at home were the true stand-outs-- I recall forensic science, paleobiology, archaeology as outstanding experiences. On the math side I think game theory was the highlight. We never looked to accelerate, just to give the kids a supportive social setting and a chance to explore intellectually without grades or other school work getting in the way.</p>
<p>It was a fantastic, positive experience all around, except for the hours of muffled sobbing in the back seat of the car as we drove home every summer.</p>
<p>If it were me, I'd follow the pre-requisite suggestions pretty carefully, The instructors are generally fantastic, but they teach to the level of the class and so if a course assumes a general level of preparation that your kid doesn't have, it could be a frustrating experience all around. there is virtually no wasted time.... my kids particularly loved the fact that during group projects everyone pulled their weight (unlike at school where the smart kids are expected to do the work for everyone else).</p>
<p>NYMomof 2,
My oldest son attended CTY for many years. He recommends taking a course which you cannot take at your regular school. He agrees that the self-paced math is very isolating and would not recommend it. He also believes that Fast-Paced Physics would not be appropriate after Regents A math. He took Astronomy at Skidmore (Saratoga Springs) and really enjoyed it. The dorms at Skidmore are not air-conditioned but the classrooms are. One summer that he was at Skidmore it was extraordinarily warm-several 100+ degree days and that was not particularly fun but certainly did not ruin his experience. He would highly recommend the Saratoga Springs site in general, although it is very popular with returning CTY'ers. He also heard excellent things about the Probability & Game Theory class. However, he cautions that your son might not get his first choice class in his first choice setting. If you have further questions, please ask. He went to CTY for 6 years.</p>
<p>I don't recommend self-paced math. It's really not fun for the child. Academic summer programs are supposed to be enjoyable, and CTY on the whole does an excellent job in its courses. But the self-paced math is really dull. Try another math course...Reasoning, Logic, and Formal Proof is what I did, and I loved it. My parents said they would never force me to go to a camp where I did math problems by myself all day.</p>
<p>If the kid wants to go, then let him, by all means. If not, skip it.</p>
<p>Thanks for confirming my impression that self-paced math would not be a good course for my son. We are taking the prerequisites and warnings seriously and considering only courses that my son qualifies for. I am also aware that first-year students don't usually get any of their first few choices. Things are a little complicated for us because my son's good friend also qualified and they want to be at the same site. We and the other boy's parents also would like them to be at the same site, although we don't care whether they're in the same course. From the course catalog I gather that we'd have better luck at Carlisle or Siena than the more popular campuses. The Siena description doesn't mention AC. I hate to make that a consideration but I know that it will affect his experience if he has to work all day in the heat. I wouldn't be able to take it myself. So I'm going to try for a campus that has AC at least in the classrooms.</p>
<p>I'm not necessarily recommending it for your son, NYMom, but my older S did self-paced math at CTY for 2 summers and <em>loved</em> it. It all depends on the kid and what they thrive on.</p>
<p>Thanks, mootmom. I guess if there weren't a critical mass of kids who loved it, it wouldn't be offered! My son does like EPGY math, which must be similar if not the same as self-paced math. But I'm looking for something that he can't get at home, and the experience of learning with similarly able students (as opposed to having to wait and wait for everyone else to understand something before moving on).</p>
<p>I would recommend just calling the staff for air conditioning type questions- I think they have people at Johns Hopkins who can answer specific factual inquiries. When my D first started we were looking for a certain combination of courses and we found them very helpful when we were filling out the application- especially with specific information that you are looking for. When she was at Siena the girls' dorm was brand new and I believe air conditioned. The boys dorm was not however as new.</p>
<p>My D took Astronomy at F&M the summer after 7th grade. She loved the class. I believe algebra was a prerequisite. She had already completed algebra and geometry at that point. I have no recollection whether the dorms at F&M were air conditioned. My D has friends who have taken the cryptography class, as well as the game theory class. The friends loved those classes as well. In fact, the only class I am aware of that anyone we know did not like is the self-paced math. It just didn't have much interaction with either the teacher or the other students.</p>