Custodial parent refuses to fill out Fafsa and CSS profile

Paying for College
21

Every family is different, and that includes divorced ones. A child’s refusal to “get involved” is often their way of refusing to be put in the middle or to be used as a conduit. I’m sure you know your child and, if that’s the case, I would not ask her to be the one who “talks her mother into it.”

Financial negotiations are obviously sensitive. The most non-aggressive thing you can do is to simply show your hand and show how much you’re able to pay, back it up with reasonable logic, and get the court to acknowledge that as the limit of your obligation. It’s generally understood that custody and support orders are long-term and modifications along the way, as situations change, are normal.

22

Normally, you don’t have children involved in child support issues. But this is college tuition, no longer ‘child support’. In most states, courts won’t even order it to be paid, or especially paid without limits by one parent. Even in intact families, the college student is responsible for FAFSA and ultimately paying for her own college if the parents won’t. Yes, many of us do the college financial paperwork and taxes, but it is really the student’s responsibility. Our kids are just lucky to have someone else do it, but there are many whose parents aren’t involved and who have to do it themselves. This student has one parent willing and one unwilling. If she wants to go to college, she needs to get involved.

Tell the child ‘I don’t have $70k. You cannot go to college unless the FA paperwork is completed.’ Send this in a formal letter to ex, along with the letter from the school about FA.

23

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Seems crazy to order someone to pay for college when it’s unknown what their financial picture will be 15 years later, without some sort of “out” clause if income or health dives. Heck, what if the CP had become a millionaire during that 15 years? Would she still not have to pay? Weird divorce order


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With all due respect, I disagree with the above…


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I have no problem with divorces addressing future college costs. I do have a problem with some sort of iron-clad one-sided order made 15 years earlier that doesn’t include some basics like: cost is limited to instate tuition, both parents must contribute 50/50, financial aid applications must be submitted or the one who refuses must pay all costs, and some sort of later mediation possibility if one or both parents suffer some sort of financial or health setback.

I agree with @blossom that the dad needs to have a heart to heart with his DD. Who knows what her mom has told her. She may be thinking that dad is “loaded” and just trying to make mom’s life difficult. All she know is that “dad is supposed to pay.” Period. But, you can’t squeeze blood out of a turnip.

I suspect that since mom hasn’t been working that she hasn’t been filing taxes. So, she may be refusing because she doesn’t want to file.

24

It’s possible the mom doesn’t NEED to file taxes. We don’t know what the deal is.

It’s possible that the non-custodial parent is supposed to pay a %age. We don’t know that info either.

All we know is that the custodial parent hasn’t filed the financial aid application forms.

And we also know that the deadlines for institutional aid have PASSED.

I just can’t imagine why this discussion is happening on May 10.

25

I have a friend who practices family law in an affluent town. Every time she tells me some bizarre story I think she’s embellishing the details. And then I realize she’s likely being accurate. She’s been appointed Guardian ad Litem for kids whose affluent parents (both sides) seem intent on spending every dollar which could have been used to pay for college, paying for lawyers to drag the other side back and forth into court. She’s represented wealthy dad’s whose Steps are living the high life but whose bio kids are barely getting by, and wealthy mom’s who are supporting a BF with the money that is supposed to have funded their kids college education.

So nothing surprises me anymore.

Which is why my advice to the OP was to cut out the middlemen (the lawyers, court appearances, the fees for fed-ex and copies) and go straight to the D. Why spend money on a fight. The D is likely exhausted from being put in the middle- which is her right- but unless she hears it straight, “Until those forms get filled out you won’t be enrolling in college. I can’t afford full freight and you can’t get financial aid without your mom’s information” this battle could drag on until drop off day.

OP- hug to you.

26

My ex was telling everyone I could pay for our kid’s college because of some inheritance money I received. What he forgot is that I paid almost all that money to him for his portion of our house equity after our divorce, so it was sitting in his bank account. His brother told me what the ex was saying, and I informed the brother of that fact. He must have told my ex, because he then actually did agree to pay for some of one kid’s college and stopped spreading that particular scurrilous rumor.

OP, what is the cost of the college? Have you run the net price calculators?

27

Oh I hate to tell you this but…there really isn’t a thing you can do about it. At least without getting nasty.

We had the same scenario. My husbands ex refused to fill out the FAFSA for S11, claiming he wouldn’t qualify. Which frankly, since he went to a private college and she was retired and is not sitting on a ton of assets, we found very very hard to believe.

I do not believe she actually filed it, until S14 went to school as it was required for her very small automatically granted OOS scholarship if memory serves.

She VERY strongly believes that her children should not have to pay a dime out of their own pocket, they should not be bothered trying to get any kind of merit aid, they should not work (would not “let” S11 take a work study grant) and that she and my H should split the full cost of attendance for whatever school their child picks with no restrictions.

Thankfully she did finally file on her own and S11’s senior year costs went down quite a bit. Not so thankfully my H really didn’t fight the battle but just chose to pay.

I might ask the mom to run the NPC and at least “show you” what it spit out, to validate her claim of not qualifying for anything. I can guarantee you, my husbands ex did not, and especially did not at the school likely to have given more funds.

Your daughter is in a horrid spot and so are you. That said, legally responsible for paying for college and legally responsible for paying for a SPECIFIC college are two very different things. I don’t know how your decree is worded but typically major decisions, especially financial ones, impact equal say.

I would imagine you have “equal” say in primary decisions affecting the child in your parenting plan which means you have equal say in saying “no” to this choice of school unless they fill out the paperwork. I hate to be nasty but I would do that and force her to file.

I would also call the school. I have heard, in a profile school, they can override the CP as the primary FAFSA and Profile parent if can be proven that the NCP is paying for more than half of the child’s expenses (versus more than half of the nights. If you believe that doing so would result in aid I would get on the phone with the school financial aid office now. It is up to the school though and varies and that is definitely hearsay on my part, no direct experience.

28

If the mom isn’t req’d to file taxes, and that is why she hasn’t filled out FAFSA, then the dad can let his DD know that the mom can check the box about not needing to file. The mom may not know that she can file FAFSA w/o filing taxes (If that is the real hold-up).


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was to cut out the middlemen (the lawyers, court appearances, the fees for fed-ex and copies) and go straight to the D.

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I agree.

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@COLLEGEBRAIN


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extremely different financial profile. My income look good last year but a lot was eaten away by back taxes owed and losses on a home sale. My business has gone south, and I am working to get it back on its feet. I am relatively working for no income at this point and cannot say when that will turn around. I was instructed by the school that they need CSS/Fafsa to even have a conversation with me.

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Then how would you pay “your share” for college even if your DD got aid from applying for FA?

Is your DD going to a local public? a private? What? how much does the school cost?


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My ex does has not work since the divorce and I would venture to guess she has more available assets than I do at this point. I think she might get something from fafsa. She is claiming she needs to go back to work to get by.

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Can you clarify? How has she not worked for 15 years? Were you paying spousal support? Super high child support? Was she remarried for awhile and her husband was supporting her?

Is it possible that your exW hasn’t filed taxes (maybe doesn’t need to) and so she thinks she can’t submit FAFSA?

30

@COLLEGEBRAIN

Does your former spouse have any earnings? If not, he or she would not need to file a tax return. But they would need to complete a non-filers statement for the college. On the FAFSA, and profile, they would,indicate no income, and that they will not be filing taxes.

Of course…if the former spouse has remarried…none of this would apply because his or her spouse would need to be listed on the FAFSA and Profile along with the custodial parent.

31

I appreciate everyone’s response and ideas. I would like to clarify the situation and perhaps answer some questions.

I was married for 2.5 years but the divorce proceedings carried out for years. After that I was dragged into court many times, most of which was because I wanted more time with my daughter - extra days per month, extra vacation time - all which I was granted. In fact, had 15 days a month with her and half of the summer. Like I said, extremely litigious and willing to spend every dime until a judge told her to do something.

Around the time when my DD had to chose a high school, her mom started alienating her towards me. She tried to get me to pay for a private HS, and when I would not agree to the same private school, she took me to court. After being dragged through the system and winning at extreme financial and emotional costs (not only to me but to my new wife and 2 children), I threw in the towel. I could not handle the 7th or 8th court appearance…this time a trial that would have been more expensive than hs. So for the benefit of everyone, I allowed mom and DD to relocate back to where mom grew up in a different state, far away. She had no legal right, but she had me and my family worn down. I had spent years needlessly defending myself. My current wife had to get a restraining order due to the threats. It was ugly, this 11 years after the divorce. The biggest thing though was how she alienated my DD towards me, the father that supported her, always paid her way and was there emotionally for her since she was an infant. It was heartbreaking and the most difficult thing I had ever done.

Fast forward to now. My DD has done excellent in a public school - an honor student. Did excellent on her SATs. I have had little or not contact with my ex over the years and I believe everyone’s life stabilized. My wife recovered from a near nervous breakdown and my younger kids were less stressed.

My ex has never remarried and has, what I believe, an unhealthy relationship with my DD. More of a friend than a parent. There are not many other people in her mom’s life…so her whole life is centered around my DD. I had kept in touch with my DD - birthday cards, texts but still many unreturned phone calls etc. There was not a lot of initiating on her part.

Then about 6 months ago, my ex called me and apologized. Said she purposely hurt me over the years, alienated my daughter and was filled with guilt. Said the move was the worst thing she ever did. She extended an olive branch.

I knew this was about paying for college though…

My daughter did the same. Told me she was sorry, that she pushed me away and wanted me in her life. We have talked here and there and we discussed meeting up for a weekend before she graduated. While I had not expected our relationship to be rekindled at this point, it started moving in a good direction.

By this time though, she had already toured schools, filled out apps etc, without any input from me. This was her and her mom’s thing and it happened before we really started talking again.

During this period my business turned south and I had some financial issues. I had to sell my house and downsize. I am in a position of taking no revenue and it looks like it will be that way for some time - until I can turn it around. This is when I realized that i needed to preserve what I had and needed assistance.

I had a heart to heart with my ex about this and she immediately became distraught. She turned into the animal I was familiar with. She called attorneys, CPA’s, guidance counselors…and probably the pope. She made assumptions that I was hiding money, was rich etc. She called me relentlessly and filled my voicemail as well as sent the most absurd tests, most unrelated to the college situation.

My DD had received a $11K merit scholarship to a private school which is about $62K a year. I had a little bit of sticker shock because I was not aware the school was that expensive. At the time I found this out, I was struggling mightily with my business. Like many other parents though, I want to get my daughter the best education I can afford.

I reached out to the financial aid department. For those asking as to why May 10, this was in early April. Yes, past the deadline, but the school assured me that they had plenty of aid to give out and they would do so until the end of June. They clarified what we all already know, that the custodial parent (my ex) needs to fill out the fafsa and her part of the CSS. In fact, this school will not even have a discussion with me about anything financial, or waive the CP portion of it. They urged me to get it done and they would go through my options. I even sent them my taxes and they would not assess.

Mom gave me every excuse in the book - we do not qualify, the forms are too hard, I should have done this earlier, I didn’t file my taxes and doesn’t know where 2014 is, she is afraid to make a mistake, she could go to jail if she fill this out wrong…basically, like someone else said, she did not want to fill it out because she wants me to pay the most and suffer. She could not focus on the fact that this was for DD and not me.

I contacted DD via email to explain the situation in the hope that she could get her mom moving. It was very similar to the letter someone else wrote in this thread. Totally heart to heart. I focused on my desire to provide her with a great education, what the education actually cost, explained the hardships and struggles I was going through. I included the letter from the FA dept explaining the process. I told her this should be a fun and exciting time for her, and we just needed to move on so she could get back to enjoying it.

She called me and spoke to me soon after and with her mom in the background, and did everything but offer help. Same responses as her mom. Why so late, this is too hard, can’t you fill it out for mom. Aren’t you responsible to pay. I told her that her and her mom had done so much work towards school, what was a few more hours. Asked her to do it for me, considering I was being asked to pay such a significant amount. Nothing. Not even a hey, we’ll give it a try. I even offered them to call me if they got stuck with the forms. Didn’t take me up on that either. My DD said that she didn’t need this on her plate right now (filling out the form) and understood her mom’s position. She said filling out the forms would be “stressful”. This from a girl that does 3-4 hours of homework a night

I tried one more time with FA today to no avail. The school did point out that they give the average freshman $25K in aid though.

continued below…

32

continued…

So here I am.

To answer some of your questions…

Gap year. I love the idea. But even the suggestion of that, or me flat out not paying anything until the form is filled out, will land me in a nasty court battle. Quite frankly, I am not willing to pay attorneys any more. Nothing is ever clear cut and these things take on a life of their own. If she lived under my roof, gap year it would be.

Child support - yes. It ends next month though.

Should have saved when things were good - I have a 529 for her, but started too late (and did not expect to be in this position). Let’s just say that when her child support ends I assumed college payments would only be a little bit more.

Modify the divorce agreement - certainly a longer term option. I do believe that my ex has more money in the bank right now than I do (from our settlement ages ago) but who knows for sure. If my situation does not change, I will go this route as the courts are aware that things written 15 years ago are not in stone and things change

My ex has has not remarried.

Have an attorney fire off a letter - I will get 20 letters in return, get my life subpoenaed. Be on the defensive once again, for the umpteenth time.

Yes my daughter knows she is responsible for the forms. That was explained in my letter to her.

Yes my ex is putting her animosity for me above her DD’s needs. If I had a dollar for every time that happened, I would not be here right now :slight_smile:

@thumper1 - I am obligated to pay 100%. I think I hit cost of college and other questions above. FA keeps telling me there is a lot still available and to get the forms in. Ex did file taxes (she says). Ex is not responsible for a percentage although I could probably (eventually) get that modified. The decision to look into this happened way before 5/10, it is just dragging out.

Does ex have earnings - I am guessing returns on investments. I cannot be sure but she stated she asked for an extension this year she has told me (and her 2014 return is “buried in a storage unit” and irretrievable). So yes, she files taxes.

Sorry for the long post…

33

Well, if you don’t have the money, what are your options? I’d still say an attorney letter saying get it done this month, or you will all be back in court. And then do it. Unless you can come up with the $200K for her college. You may hate the court battles, but I’d say $20K (estimate) to an attorney is better than $200K to colleges.

34

About the only constructive thing I could suggest at this point is to try running the schools posted net price calculator using your financial info. Exceptions can be made if it is proven that one parent is paying more than 50% but it is up to the school and an exception. To get anywhere with that you’d have to be able to prove your current and historical child support was also more than 50% of your daughters expenses.

By running the net price calculator at least you’d know what the college thinks you should be able to pay if you were allowed to file. If that actually comes in less than the remainder after her scholarship then at least you can show that to the ex.

Just be prepared that it may not show less at all. Generally speaking the net price calculators expect about a third of your income (previous years taxes) can go to college. As you are at a profile school they will want everyone’s info and will count your wife’s income as well as your exes. FAFSA too will count any income your current wife has and, at a profile school they will look at assets. That said, business loss is looked at too so depending on the timing of events it could look ok. Even if your ex does file, they will look at all your finances and your wife’s combined with hers to determine need, if any.

I’d want to know I had a leg to stand on before spending a fortune in court.

Assuming it does not show less (or any extra aid) you really have what, 2 options. 1 refuse to pay on grounds you were not involved in the decision. That would likely not have you in contempt. Or, 2. Take out huge miserable loans.

35

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I tried one more time with FA today to no avail. The school did point out that they give the average freshman $25K in aid though.
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This is meaningless. They give ZERO to those who have income/assets. Sounds like your Ex has assets which will be counted. Any assets you have will be counted. Your business will be assigned a value. Your business assets will count. Many of your deductions will be “added back in as income.” Your new wife’s income will count.

I think you’re wasting time on FA papers when likely you all won’t qualify for much or anything.

You need to have the courts revisit this college requirement. Typically, when a parent or parents are order to pay for college, the amount is limited to instate public…not any school on the planet regardless of cost.

36

Figure out what the most expensive public school in your state costs and the most expensive public university in their state costs. Pick the cheaper of the two. This is what you are offering to pay. I have never heard of the student getting to pick any school and requiring the parent to pay for it. There was a case in NJ a couple of years ago where the child sued her parents for OOS costs and the judge only allowed public school rates. I’m so sick of the notion that public universities are somehow less of an education. Is UVA really an inferior school?

I agree you need a lawyer. Can a settlement really be enforced after they have moved out of state? After you have honorably supported the child through her 18th birthday? Do you still have to pay spousal support for the ex in the future after you were only married for 2.5 years? What state did you divorce in? This sounds like a nightmare. If you file for a revision in your state and ex doesn’t appear don’t you win your case?

They purposely left you out of the loop in choosing a college and involved you after most financial deadlines were through. IME if the mom has an income of less than $30k but has lots of cash in the bank the child will still qualify for full Pell which is about $5800 a year. The child can borrow $5500 no matter what your ex & your incomes are but all these require FAFSA as you know.

I feel bad for you. Your ex must be a terribly unhappy woman.

37

There’s no alternative : either get lawyers involved, or be ready to sell your current house and relocate your current family to a rental. If you don’t have the money to pay - if your college budget, when stretched, is monthly child support + some $, not out of choice but out of obligation -then you can’t pay. Let your daughter know that you don’t have the money college costs. That you have contacted the College and you can’t do anything until fafsa is filed, and attorneys will verify that you’ve taken good faith steps toward financial aid but have been told each time that nothing can be done until fafsa and css are filed. That the College I’ll verify the mother has not filed and has been informed, several times, that she must. That your daughter, if fafsa 's not filed, could lose her spot at the college - has she paid enrollment and housing deposits or was she expecting you tons it? Reiterate that you cannot do anything until fafsa 's filed since you are not the custodial parent. That even the 529, which has $…in it, is only available after the College report’s fafsa filed.
Unless you have 200k socked away foebtour daughter or you’re ready to ruin/bankrupt your current family, I don’t think you can get out of attorney battles.
I don’t quite see what your ex is doing beside making sure her daughter won’t be going to college in the fall and thus ensure your daughter hates you. She knows you’ll try to avoid that at all costs, but if you don’t have 200k, you can’t magically conjure them up.

38

@COLLEGEBRAIN If you pay this year without them filing the FASFA and Profile, then you are setting a precedent and should not expect them to file it for the next 3 years. This is dangerous.
I would think it would be wiser to simply not pay one dime until those are filed. You cannot truly, accurately know your cost without the filing.
Remember, this is not just about need based aid. Some colleges require entering and returning students to have filed to be considered and granted MERIT aid.

I feel for you. This is a horrible situation but perhaps all correspondence need to be directed solely to your daughter since child support is ending and the filing is technically on her. An official letter stating that in order for you to pay for college the requisite items must be completed fully:

FASFA
Profile
Compliance with Verification if requested

If mom wants to hire a herd of lawyers on daughter’s behalf after that and risk daughter missing out on freshman year, then that may be better for you to deal with (the herd) than the mom. It may be time for you to end communication with the mom altogether. Child support is done. Daughter is responsible for FASFA. Your need to talk to mom (if she just wants to fight) is over.

39

contact a lawyer today. Have that person draft a letter saying that the financial,aid firms MUST be completed by (and give a date…like June 1) or you will not pay the REMAINING college costs. This is important…because 100% of the remainder is your obligation. The lawyer should,say that too.

BUT…you say your daughter got $10,000 in merit aid to this college? If so, you need to also understand that in MOST cases, a merit award like this will reduce financial need. So…if the college gives $25,000 in need based aid to the average student…your daughter has already reduced her need by $10,000. Does that make sense?

But the BIGGER things. Elephants In the room.

  1. You don't have enough money to even draw a salary, right? How would you pay $52,000 a year when your business isn't earning enough to draw you a salary?
  2. Get this straightened out NOW. You mention younger kids. These kids will likely want to go to college someday too. So, you don't want to break the bank for this ONE kid.
  3. If your ex wife has no money...how would SHE take you back to court. Just say you aren't paying the college bill IF these forms are not completed...NOW.
  4. You are a business owner. Keep in mind that your business has a value. This will need to be reported on the Profile. In addition, there are deductions allowed by the IRS that are not allowed for financial aid purposes.
  5. A bone...tell ex wife that the 2015 taxes will be used for the 2017-2018 school year also...so if she gets them done...she will also have what she needs to file the NEXT year FAFSA and Profile too.
40

Why are you letting your ex and teenage daughter run this show? Your daughter applied to a college you can’t afford and her mom refuses to fill out any paperwork to see if she qualifies for institutional aid. Tell your daughter directly that unless her mom fills out the paperwork, the college won’t generate a financial aid package. And even if they do and expect you to be full pay, it’s unaffordable. Either way, unless her mom fills out the papers and you get a generous financial aid package, she’s not going there in the fall.

I’d talk to a lawyer immediately, but not as a defensive move. I’d go on the offensive to protect the financial interests of your wife and younger children. Get that divorce agreement reevaluated. Run net price calculators so you have a good idea of what you can afford and still provide a home and college savings for your younger children, and have your lawyer present a reasonable plan. In state colleges are perfectly good alternatives to expensive privates.

Think of it this way – you’re not fighting against your ex. You’re fighting for all of your children to have a decent opportunity to get a college education. I understand court battles are costly and tiring but if I were your wife, I’d be livid if you weren’t willing to fight to protect the interests of the younger children. You may have to downsize and take on private loans to cover a $200k school. She doesn’t. And if I were her, I wouldn’t.