There are always exceptions to the rules that the schools have for the normal progression of courses. My son was very strong in math and successfully jumped from Pre calc his junior year to BC calc his senior year and got a 5 on the AP test. He had to get recommendations from his math teacher and approval from the head of the math dept. We also reported his math scores on the SAT and SAT 2 math which I think supported the jump. If you daughter feels like she is ready and has been very successful in her math courses so far I say let her do it.
@gallentjill the box is part of the counselor rec and is for the entire school year. I think your daughter will get the box checked regardless of AB or BC since she has so many APs.
The box represents academic rigor at your school.
I agree with the excellent post #38 of @aec611 . Your daughter has a very challenging schedule next year and if she want to get into BSMD she should take the A in AP Calc AB and spend the extra time on medical ECs and essays. The sooner she learns that med school MOSTLY about GPA and ECs, the better. She is not going to get dinged because she was tracked in regular math early but she will get dinged for B’s and weak essays and ECs.
We were just working on helping kiddo decide on the high school math track yesterday. My spouse who was a math major before CS, and I worked on it for about an hour. We learned a couple of things. First, some classes are pertinent and some are not. You have to decide what advantage taking the highest classes will give you child. For us, putting kiddo into Alg II as a Freshman would accelerate the program but also mean high level learning starting Freshman year ( Private high level boarding school). This combined with other advanced courses ( meaning highest level including APs) would mean a tough curriculum. It’s likely kiddo will not go into pure math but maybe a related STEM field maybe not. We decided to just leave it as geo, Alg II, Calc (whichever version) and let kiddo decide depending on what transpires. The backup plan is to skip ahead via CTY. (Just as an FYI my child got a perfect score in Math SSAT and 99% in 7th grade SAT testing. So isn’t a weak student by any means). Nor, is my kiddo a math genius.
Additionally, I would decide first about what is likely and what is not. Also, if Calc BC is chosen and your child ends up in a competitive math/science program there is no way they are going to skip calculus in college. Hey, I skipped Calc at MIT because I took it in high school. Not going to happen. Hence as my spouse said what is the point of excessive acceleration vs. high level acceleration. We have another kiddo who would likely fly through Calc BC so that would be a good choice for kiddo#2.
Some kids can skip things and still keep going many will find holes later.
I think kids should always be working to their highest level but should still be able to maintain excellent grades. If they are bored that’s an issue, if they are working really hard and getting C’s that’s a problem. Given the tough college metrics, I think the BC calc would give her a small boost but only if she aces it. If it comes at the expense of other classes then it isn’t the best road. Given her history in your post, I don’t see her flying through it. Have you considered her doing advanced math during the Summer so she can have time to do other things in the Fall?
Also someone else posted about girls in math. It is very true there are VERY few girls in high level math. I proctored for a math qualifying exam yesterday for kiddo#2, of 20 kids only 2 were girls. Sad really.
Don’t let the HS admin decide for you. Get the data and realistically assess the pluses and minuses and make your own decision with your daughter. Don’t let sexism get in the way either. Also, remember sometimes kids want to do the highest level because they haven’t factored in ALL the classes. They should give you the outline of the curriculum.
Hi everyone,
Thanks for the excellent advice. I am going to pass along the resources in this thread for self study and then see what she does with it over the summer. I’m not pushing. If she works hard and learns the material, I will fight to get her into the math class she wants. I agree, that if I make enough noise, I can get it done. On the other hand, if she lets it go, she can take AB Calc as a senior and that will be fine too.
Why is that not going to happen?
We were in the exact same position last summer. My D had to push for it, and do quite a bit of extra work to be allowed into BC calc, but she eventually got in. Initially there was some animosity among her classmates because they thought she hadn’t put in the time (the junior year pre-bc Calc class is brutal at her school), but she quickly caught up and has had one of the highest grades in her class all year.
I agree with what others have said, a lot of girls tend to underestimate their abilities in stem subjects and don’t take the higher level courses. It took my D until senior year to realize she loves and excels at math.
I think it’s great you’re letting her give it a shot. You never know, she might actually love it.
@deweydecimal55 Thanks! It is nice to know that my daughter is not the only one who discovered a love of math later in high school. It will be interesting to see how it goes. What resources did your daughter use to study over the summer?
@gallentjill Her teacher at school gave her a copy of the textbook and a list of topics she needed to cover before she could take the class. She met with her math teacher a few times, and used Khan academy to fill in the gaps. It was a lot of work, but she learned how to study independently, which has served her well this school year.
Is your HS flexible on scheduling? Are AB and BC taught the same period? If not, it may not be that easy to change in the fall as it could disrupt her entire schedule.
As for “demanding”, it really depends on the HS, especially if you aren’t going to make this request until the fall. Even if the GC is a total professional, I would be concerned that the last impression he/she had of my kid is a fight over a math class. If lots of kids take BC calc, there may simply not be space for her.
In our district there is a process for parental over-ride into a higher level class, including getting the current teacher to agree that the student can handle the higher level class. If you, or your DD, has not already approached the pre-calc teacher and gotten his/her thoughts and experience, you need to do that ASAP. Also in our district, if a kid tries a higher level class and does poorly, they have to stay in the higher level class for at least the first marking period and keep the grades earned when they drop to the lower class. And they can only drop to the lower class if it fits their schedule and there is a seat in the class.
I agree with SuzyQ7 that she really needs to focus on what will help her achieve the best possible GPA if her goal is a top college and/or BS/MD. Good luck!
Update: My daughter spoke with the calculous BC teacher this morning. The teacher thought it was a fine idea and handed her a text book with the chapters she needs to study. She spoke with her GC and will be given a test in August to see if she is ready. She is thrilled!
She believes that the first math teacher she spoke with who gave her all the negativity, is just a snob and doesn’t want to think that people should be mobile.
Whatever comes from this, its been a great experience for her. She learned a bit about self advocacy AND that you can’t always be deterred by the first person you speak with.
This thread has also been inspirational for her. Although, she stays away from CC, I have been recounting the stories here and it gave her motivation. So thanks everyone!
What was the textbook and what were the topics for her to self study (i.e. additional precalculus topics or the beginning calculus topics)?
I haven’t seen the text book. She said the teacher wants her to know the first three chapters and that she already knows the first two. The third chapter, I believe, is on limits. But I might have heard wrong. She may end up self studying more than that because she is so fired up about math these days. She has started spending her time watching youtube videos about interesting math concepts.
What a fantastic update!
If she did not take honors precalculus then she should self study trigonometry or take an online course.
Trig will be heavily used in calculus.
@coolweather She had a class called algebra 2/trigonometry in 10th grade. She also went through a lot of trig in regular pre-calculus. Do you have suggestions for specific topics she might have missed?
@gallentjill If your daughter wants math textbooks with rigor, I would recommend the series from the Art of Problem Solving. Many of the problems in that series come from national and international math competitions. She should make sure she understands functions and trigonometry well, which is covered in their Precalculus book. They have a Calculus book also, which she could look at in advance, but it is more important for her to have a solid understanding of the precalculus material.
I would personally disagree with the AoPS suggestion. I love AoPS and have a student who used it through cal. But for a student wanting to transition into a BC class as described in this thread, I dont think jumping into AoPS would help them achieve the goal they are desiring.
I think D mostly used AoPS for AMC tests.
That is great! So glad she was able to self advocate and that the school is flexible. Best of luck!
@galanti11 She may want to review trig functions, inverse functions, trig identities. She could be fine without doing this. It depends on how rigorous were the classes she took.