<p>I do not want to sound 'hormonal...but thanks so much for allof the feed back.I feel better equiped to discuss some of the issues that have been weighing on my mind and at the same time trying to be diligent in arranging flights /trip planning.</p>
<p>All good suggestions from posters above and the East Coast parents know more than I do about colleges there.</p>
<p>Although I do second American because it's up and coming and our CA high school has sent several there. One of our recent grads ended up working in the White House part-time while still an undergrad. Of course, one of his jobs involved working in costume as the Easter Bunny. No joke. </p>
<p>Just a note of caution that teens are not often very realistic about their competition. Now is a time when many colleges are posting on their websites the profiles of the incoming freshmen class. You could suggest that she check out these profiles (particularly Georgetown) and let her make a determination of whether she can compete in that pool. If she's in love with DC as a place to go to college then go visit, but look at several schools as others have suggested, and fan out from there to surrounding states. </p>
<p>She may be focused on the top 25 because those are the ones that are most visible....but insist that she look beyond rankings and she may well find the college in the location she wants, with everything she could hope for, and where she can get her degree with minimal (or even no) debt.</p>
<p>talkingto:</p>
<p>You don't sound "hormonal" at all. You sound just like all the other parents who face this situation of having a kid who doesn't want to go "in-state" and prefers a "top school" (your household probably sounds like mine - my own son has recently tried to give us the "guilt trip" for not having "saved enuf" for the college of his choice - Cornell. Unfortunately, we lived in CA for over 40 years and thought that our kids would go to a UC school so we didn't think that we needed to have so much $$$ for college -- not that we would have been able to save $200K per kid anyway!!!).</p>
<p>For my own son, I know his desire to go to a "top school" is completely an "ego thing". He's always been the top male student at his prep school so he thinks he "deserves" an Ivy (or similar) education. I keep telling him that he'll be a little fish in a big pond at an Ivy. He'd get special treatment if instead he went to a "good school" where he could really stand out. Your D should consider this, too. Since she is the Girls State delegate, she must be a top performer at her school -- so she's used to that feeling. She won't like being an "average" student at a school like Georgetown which has a lot of kids from top prep schools with perfect or near perfect SATs.</p>
<p>It would be worth signing up for the US News info - all of the data in one place. I second all of the above.</p>
<p>But I also think that a trip might be worthwhile in several ways, especially if you yourself do some research. When we visited (very early) some of the top-25 schools (Brown, MIT, CMU, Harvard, etc), none of these turned him on in a way that he could see himself there. </p>
<p>But one thing you can do is research some schools yourself, knowing what she is looking for, and find some that might be more affordable or that give merit aid for your daughter. Put these on the visit schedule ("Let's visit, it's on the way to Georgetown!"). She might fall in love with one of these places. </p>
<p>If you can list some of what she wants in a place, CC'ers might have some suggestions to add to the list. For example, there are some Ohio schools that might be worth a look, like Wittenberg (kind of expensive, but they will put up the difference between your EFC and the cost; there is a calculator on their site, and they pledge to meet the calculated difference). Pitt is another school that comes to mind as being "on the way," sort-of. Pitt is not cheap either, but certainly less expensive than a private school.</p>
<p>We also need to send you off to the financial aid calculators do determine what your EFC is. Just don't make my mistake and forget to add 401 contributions back in, lol.</p>
<p>Let me add U Delaware to the list.</p>
<p>And Muhlenberg in Allentown (Lehigh Valley). Again, not cheap, but check out the FA section of the website.</p>
<p>Talking - Lots of good advice in this thread. I'd like to expand on ebeeeee's excellent comments a bit. DD insisted "no school within 500 miles" and I insisted "No application to any school you haven't visited." What made this workable was DD having very firm ideas of what she wanted in a school. If you can somehow help your daughter define what she wants I'm certain things will go much easier. Does she want a relaxed academic environment? Well perhaps American University would be a better choice than Georgetown. Does she want to play a sport? Does she want to live off campus? Does she want internships? Once you have an idea of what she's looking for it will be a lot easier helping her find them. Good luck!</p>
<p>Has your daughter taken long trips before? Has she sat in the car with you for 500+ miles? A few trips like that, and my kids realized they would be happier 5 hours away instead of 10!!! Choosing a college without considering the logistics of long distance travel is unrealistic...your daughter will have to either fly or drive/get rides several times a year for the next 4 years (at least!). There are great schools that would probably provide merit aid for your daughter closer to home. I would suggest that you agree to visit a few East coast schools with the condition that you also visit a few schools about 5 hours away. Make sure that any airport that serves your area in IN--(remember airlines do change their routes) is easily accessible from the campus (otherwise you will have to add in cab fair to travel costs.) Your daughter will be devastated if she is rejected from her choice schools (or if the light bulb comes on and she becomes realistic about the financial commitment!!).</p>
<p>If she wants to avoid the cornfields, then help her find some colleges in cities closer to home so she has choices...It is hard for kids to search for something they don't want to do, so some suggestions from you might be helpful. Once the financial aid papers come in the mail, she may no longer insist upon being on the East coast!!!</p>
<p>I agree with the posters above that say that your daughter has to do some soul-searching and decide what is really important for her in a college...sports scene/ academic majors/ sorority scene/ enrollment size/ in or near a city/ etc. If you have an idea of what she really wants, you can help her find schools closer to home that may be a closer match in financial aid (and admissions). Ask your daughter to rank what is most important to her in a college...then help her find some schools that may be a closer match than the East coast schools...</p>
<p>My daughter and I took a long trip visiting various colleges. Her initial first choice dropped quickly to last place, and her initial last choice college (which I convinced her to visit "since it was on the way") turned out to be the college she is now attending (and loving). She never wanted a college within a city, but now loves the convenience of the transportation system!! Your daughter will change a lot within the next year, so make sure that she is flexible now!!</p>
<p>talking, Just a hunch, but I was thinking that perhaps what your daughter is reacting to is not the location of the school but the size.
I went to a big midwestern university and my son now goes to a small liberal arts college back east. (We now live over seas so anywhere he chose was far away.) For some kids the a smaller school is a better fit. </p>
<p>I'd recommend that you ask your daughter to take a look at some of the excellent midwestern LACs, like Grinnell, Macalester, Carlton, Kenyon. There are plenty of others, but these come to mind. Depending on how she does on her retaken SATs some of these may even come through with merit money for her.</p>
<p>Another idea would be to take the grand tour after the acceptances come in. Many families do this.</p>
<p>It's a fairly intimidating and emotional process, but I assure you that it gets easier the more you learn. Good luck and let us know how it goes.</p>
<p>With such a great State U in Indiana (which MANY kids from the Northeast go to!), it may be tough to look at state schools somewhere else...but UMD in College Park might be a consideration...not right in Washington, but in a suburb and lots of affiliations with gov't. However...also a reach for an out of state student with your daughter's "objective" stats.</p>
<p>If her dream is Georgetown, she should visit and apply there...but you'll need to make sure there are plenty of match and safety schools -- that she's willing to go to -- on her list.</p>
<p>
[quote]
But one thing you can do is research some schools yourself
[/quote]
Absolutely! Welcome to the world of parents who did (and enjoyed) lots of the research legwork ourselves - using the criteria that DS had outlined - of identifying the possible reach/match/safety schools. Also, my constant recommendation: read "Accept My Kid Please: A Father's Descent into College Application Hell" for a necessary laugh in that time-honored Misery Loves Company way.</p>
<p>I'm an avid lurker, but just had to post on this one. D also expressed interest in schools out east. Her only prerequiste for looking for colleges is that it had to be far from home. Her wonderful GC held a May term class called College Visits where he personally drove students to visit great colleges in the area. They saw IU, Purdue, Earlham, Albion, and many more. As a result of that, D realized that there are many well regarded colleges in this area, and she didnt have to go miles from home to get a good education. I later found out that she thought all Indiana colleges would be like the local community college. We are still planning a driving trip out east, but are looking at schools that she might have a reasonable chance of getting in. With the help of that great GC again, we have a good mix, including Mt. Holyoke, because we think it's important that she see a women's college. We have famiy in NH, so we are looking at things not more than a couple of hours from the "family compound" in case she would choose to attend out there, and then get homesick. I'm looking forward to the trip. Having my D all to myself for hours on end while we are driving, and she can't run away.....I bet I'll find out all sorts of stuff!</p>
<p>"...she thought all Indiana colleges would be like the local community college".</p>
<p>A lot of them think that staying in-state for anything is just the same-old, same-old, high school 102. We have a good state system in Virginia and a few good privates, but the D's liked other options OOS. At least merit $ made these choices reasonable.</p>
<p>talking: I live in Indiana and when my D went through the college search, we had a very similar situation with her preferred east coast location being Boston (and NYC). She did not want to go to school in Indiana; she wanted a liberal arts school education at a small to mid sized out-of-state university. She honed in on Boston College and NYU (I know - not small and not liberal arts but it had a small specialized program that fit her to a T and she loves NY) which were reaches for her. When she first mentioned BC, I told her it would cost over $40K to send her there and her first response was "so?"</p>
<p>After several more conversations, she began to see the light that she needed to reassess her school choices because there was no way we were paying over $40k for college. She was aware that merit money would be a factor in the ultimate decision and as long as she knew that, she could apply anywhere she wanted. </p>
<p>We did do an east coast visit. We took advantage of the last minute cheap weekend fares to Boston to see BU (hated the city campus), BC (which she had decided not to apply to because of the cost) and Clark U in Worchester (which she really, really liked but didn't like the city of Worchester so it came off her list). She ended up not apply to any Boston schools but did apply to NYU. NYU was really her "if I could go anywhere in the world school" but I was secretly very relieved when she was not accepted (because of the cost).</p>
<p>We also drove and visited Ohio schools - and there were several she really liked there, including Kenyon, Denison and Wittenberg. But as senior year wore on, her top choices got progressively closer to home. All her closest friends were going to IU or Purdue and she found that she didn't want to be so far away from them (even considering Ohio too far). In the end, she got into an east coast school (Gettysburg) but location combined with cost eliminated that and several other choices. </p>
<p>Ultimately, she heard what we said about considering several factors (cost, merit money, program strength) and came to her own conclusion where she should go to school. We didn't hold her back from applying or visiting as she was clearly aware of the "constraints" that would affect the final decision. And then we let her drive the process and take ownership of it. In the end, it worked out well. She loves her school and while we spend more than we would for IU or Purdue, she's getting an excellent education that is preparing her well for grad school (she's planning on a PsyD and I'll bet she winds up in some big city somewhere at last!).</p>
<p>Boy, it's good to see others in the same boat as me! Thanks everyone, and to the OP, who sounds just like me!</p>
<p>My D started out looking at nothing but reach schools, GTown, Rice, William & Mary, Wash U. Most of that was at my prodding, but then reality (and SAT scores) hit and I realized her chances somewhere like that were slim to none, so I told her point blank. Harsh, but necessary, and I am nothing but a realist. One poster on this thread pointed out the kids don't know what their competition is, and from reading these boards, it's pretty scary.</p>
<p>So we dropped back 10 yards and punted. We took one trip to PA and looked at a couple of schools (Bryn Mawr being the one she fell in love with) and plan another trip this summer to Ohio to look at a few there. But being on the west coast, it's pretty difficult to hit very many at a time and I just don't have two weeks to take off and do a road trip or to fly to 5 or 6 different areas.</p>
<p>My D does not want to go locally and I do agree with that, since the SF Bay area is its own little "bubble" and it would be good for her to get away from it. And, unfortunately, there is little to no support at our local HS for much outside the UC/CSU world. Thus, I scour information relentlessly. :)</p>
<p>Good luck to everyone out there. Now I get to look forward to having reality crushed even more when I start the whole FAFSA/CSS process....</p>
<p>i dont think ive seen the specifics of what your daughter is looking for in a school- size, type of town/city, potential majors, type of student body, etc.
if you give more info, i'm sure people can help you make a good itinerary.</p>
<p>Go to the library (or the bookdstore) and get the Princton Review's book on the top 300+ colleges. Bring it home. Sit down with D and compare her scores to those that are listed as median scores for each school. Perhaps that will bring some reality to her. Let her read about some of the schools that are more matches and/or safeties. Then, she can get on the individual schools' websites and get even more info. Also, get an amortization program that will allow you to show her how much her payments will be over 10 years after she graduates. A little hard reality will help. OK to have some reaches, and remember, there is FA, but everyone needs matches and reaches on their lists.</p>
<p>Having just gone through the process - D originally thought she wanted to go West to CA, then north (a little) to Boston, then South (a little) to NYC, PA, DC, VA and NC and then, on a whim, further south to LA. W and I quickly realized that we could spend as much on trips as we could on a year's tuition....</p>
<p>Luckily, we had done some scouting during vacations during HS freshmen and sophomore years (I STRONGLY recommend this for parents who start this early - we had wanted to go to CA for some time, and so planned a vacation - and while there made a couple of visits to various schools, thus not spending any incremental 'college visit' money); I also took my D on one of my business trips and dropped her off at one of the big state U tours while I did my thing (good trip in that she decided she did not like big state Us, and all I paid was an extra air fare which because I knew far enough in advance, was able to get a good rate on...) </p>
<p>After SATs, we developed a target list of potential reach, likely and 'slam dunk' schools, starting at about 30, and eventually getting to 12 (OK, so we are part of the problem of rising number of applications, but, hey, what's a family to do...). </p>
<p>We took some local day trips (you can always tell your kids that before you go really far away, let's check out some of the local schools to get a baseline - as Nutmeggers, we did UCONN and Trinity for this, neither of which made D's final cut, but were worthwhile morning drives...). Getting to 12 did require one road warrior trip: D & I got airline tickets to Raleigh Durham, leaving at 6:30 on a Saturday morning, rented a car, and visited Duke, UNC, Wake and NCState in a whirlwind (she had already concluded that all the orientation sessions sounded pretty much the same, so we didn't hit all of those which would have been an impossibility...) and then caught a 6 p.m. flight back home - she was able to knock a couple of these off the list just by looking at the campus... While I might have wished for something a little more analytical, turns out she, in her way, had an intuitive sense of what she was looking for (she decided, for example, that Wake was just too small, to my dismay - great school and I had a cousin who went there)....the kids may not use the same decision criteria we do, but by and large they end up making a decision that works for them.</p>
<p>So, to get to the final 12, some we had already visited, others we told D to research the heck out of (using all the guides you can get in the book stores, this and other sites, and the college web pages - some have pretty good video tours....and also peers - trust me, the kids talk about potential schools extensively, though not always with accurate information - be warned!). By that time, D had decided she was getting tired of the trips and modified her plan - she would only make additional visits after acceptances and only when she got to a very short list, which turned out to be 4.</p>
<p>She really had thought she wanted to go to the Northeast, and was excited when she got a acceptances to two schools she thought she wanted to go to. So, off to MA we went, but she wasn't wowed (she didn't know, but I did...). So W decided to take her to LA (I had been to New Orleans before, but W and D hadn't, so they took a 'mini-vacation') to visit Tulane (BTW, W is very good at finding cheap flights and great hotel deals...), where she eventually decided to go. She didn't even want to visit her fourth potential choice - during the trip to NO, it all clicked.</p>
<p>One other thought - our neighbors daughter had gone through a similar process a couple of years ago - they got tired of travelling. Their D decided she wanted to go to So. CA, but they didn't want to take the trip - so they got her a cheap ticket, arranged an overnight visit at the campus, put her on a flight - and said a few prayers. It worked out fine - we sometimes underestimate our kids capabilities (and besides, they all have cell phones now, so even if they get lost, you're but a phone call away).</p>
<p>So, there are some cost effective ways of getting this done....my best advice is don't over stress yourself (easy for me to say now...) and involved your kids in the process - even to the point of having them do the online research to get flights/hotels...from the earlier posts, I really like the idea of setting a 'visit budget' and then have them live within it - will use this strategy for D2.</p>
<p>Enjoy!</p>
<br>
<blockquote> <blockquote> <blockquote> <p>Another idea would be to take the grand tour after the acceptances come in. Many families do this. <<<<</p> </blockquote> </blockquote> </blockquote>
<br>
<p>I know that many families do this but I would rather visit before applying (if possible). Why waste money on an app only to find out later the kid hates how the college looks? </p>
<p>Also, by eliminating undesirable campuses before the ap process, your child won't be stuck with just one or two "acceptable" campus after the acceptances come in. </p>
<p>I know that there might be one or two campuses that we won't be able to visit before hand, but we've already been able to eliminate a few from the App list just by doing a visit, so now Son can consider some others.</p>
<p>Of course you are sitting there in a state with a school with a spectacular rate of future Ph.Ds (better than most of the Ivies), some of the best study-abroad options in the country, little partying, high rate of law school admissions, excellent advising, fine language programs, and which offers hefty merit aid, and costs $12k a year ($48k over four years) less than Georgetown, even at list price.</p>
<p>Earlham.</p>
<p>Worth the trip, but she might find the best option is in her own backyard.</p>