Dartmouth Engr. A BE vs BS degree-what?

Colleges and Universities A-Z Dartmouth College
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<p>My son might apply to Dartmouth and is interested in engineering. Dartmouth confers a "Bachelors of Engineering" , not a "Bachelor of Science" in Engineering. Is this "BE" degree a watered down engineering degree? </p>

<p>I have a BSME and Master's in ME, and I have NEVER hear of a "BE" engineering degree. Doesn't sound as prestigious or as "core" as a BS. I have 26 years of engineering experience and interview new engineers for our company, I have nevere seen a "BE" degree. </p>

<p>Please explain what the difference.</p>

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<p>If I'm not mistaken, Dartmouth confers a BS degree in engineering after four years. Then a BE degree after an extra year of study, usually.</p>

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<p>And it's the BE degree (the fifth year) that is "recognized" by the group of engineers that recognizes such things.</p>

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<p>No, I think you are both wrong, they award a BE after 4 years of study...sounds a little fishy to me</p>

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<p>Bachelor</a> of Engineering - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia</p>

<p>Engineering</a> Sciences</p>

<p>"An AB in Engineering Sciences is a four-year liberal arts degree. To enter the engineering profession requires the BE (Bachelor of Engineering) degree, which usually takes an additional year of study beyond the Engineering Sciences major. However, that time can be shortened with careful choice of electives, and some students satisfy the requirements for both the AB and BE degrees in four years."</p>

<p>Take from that what you will</p>

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<p>
[quote]
Is this "BE" degree a watered down engineering degree?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>From a quick search:</p>

<p><a href="http://www.dartmouth.edu/%7Ereg/courses/desc/engs-req.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.dartmouth.edu/~reg/courses/desc/engs-req.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>"Students interested in a career in Engineering should plan on completing the Bachelor of Engineering or Master’s program. The Bachelor of Engineering degree program is accredited by the Engineering Accreditation Commission of the Accreditation Board for Engineering and Technology (EAC/ABET); it is equivalent in technical content to the Bachelor of Science degree in Engineering offered at many other universities but is broader in scope. It requires 10 courses in Natural Science, Mathematics, and Engineering beyond the requirements of the major in Engineering Sciences, and typically requires up to three terms in residence beyond the 12 terms required for the A.B. degree. Students who enter Dartmouth with advanced standing may be able to complete the B.E. at the same time as the A.B. in four years."</p>

<p>For the A.B. degree, you need:
7 prerequisites.
7 core requirements.
2 electives in engineering.
1 culminating experience in engineering.</p>

<p>For the B.E. degree, you need:
9-10 additional courses in engineering.</p>

<p>For a total of 26-27 courses towards engineering.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Doesn't sound as prestigious or as "core" as a BS.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>As mentioned earlier, it is "equivalent in technical content to the Bachelor of Science degree in Engineering offered at many other universities but is broader in scope."</p>

<p>Another search brought me to this:</p>

<p><a href="http://engineering.dartmouth.edu/undergraduate/be/%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://engineering.dartmouth.edu/undergraduate/be/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>"The Bachelor of Engineering (B.E.) program is a professional engineering program accredited by ABET, Inc., the accreditation board for engineering and technology."</p>

<p>I'm not familiar with engineering, but is ABET-accredited considered prestigious in engineering circles?</p>

<p>
[quote]
No, I think you are both wrong, they award a BE after 4 years of study...sounds a little fishy to me

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Cornell awards a BS after four years of study, if I'm not mistaken. Is that fishy?</p>

<p>At Dartmouth, it "typically requires up to three terms in residence beyond the 12 terms required for the A.B. degree." Which, like I said, translates to 5 years.</p>

7

<p>
[quote]
I have a BSME and Master's in ME, and I have NEVER hear of a "BE" engineering degree. Doesn't sound as prestigious or as "core" as a BS. I have 26 years of engineering experience and interview new engineers for our company, I have nevere seen a "BE" degree. </p>

<p>Please explain what the difference.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Dartmouth is not the only US school that issues "BE" degrees (for example, CUNY does too), but I believe this degree title is most popular outside the US. According to [url=<a href="http://www.abet.org/faqs_hs.shtml%5DABET%5B/url"&gt;http://www.abet.org/faqs_hs.shtml]ABET[/url&lt;/a&gt;], the national accreditation agency for engineering schools:

[quote]
*Is there a difference between a BE and a BS? *</p>

<p>There really is no difference between a bachelor's of engineering and a bachelor's of science in engineering. Institutions can give their degrees any name they choose.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>So the only difference is the name.

[quote]
Is this "BE" degree a watered down engineering degree?

[/quote]
No. The Dartmouth BE degree is fully ABET-accredited, and as such is legally equivalent to any engineering BS degree from Berkeley, MIT, etc. If you want to apply for a PE license and start designing dams or nuclear power plants, then a Dartmouth BE degree will be deemed perfectly valid by any state engineering board in the US. The Dartmouth BE will also be accepted as valid by any engineering graduate school. </p>

<p>The Dartmouth AB engineering degree, on the other hand, is not ABET-accredited, and will not have the same recognition. </p>

<p>Most schools issue ABET-accredited BS (or BE) degrees after only four years of study. However, ABET engineering curriculums are typically rather narrow. Dartmouth puts more emphasis on liberal arts coursework, which means that it is difficult to complete an entire professional engineering curriculum in only four years. So Dartmouth undergrads typically get a non-professional engineering AB degree after four years. If they want the professional, ABET-accredited BE degree, they typically stay for a fifth year. </p>

<p>
[quote]
I'm not familiar with engineering, but is ABET-accredited considered prestigious in engineering circles?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>ABET is the national accreditation agency for engineering schools, just as ABA accredits law schools and AMA accredits medical schools. For legal purposes, such as PE licensure, ABET accreditation is the highest standard for an engineering degree. Engineering employers have more flexibility, but in practice typically prefer degrees from ABET-accredited schools.</p>

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<p>Some other schools, besides Dartmouth, that issue ABET-accredited BE degrees (instead of BS degrees) include CUNY-City College, SUNY-Stony Brook, SUNY-Maritime, Stevens Inst. of Technology (NJ), and Youngstown State (OH). There could be others.</p>

<p>It's not particularly common in the US, but it's not unheard of either.</p>

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<p>Yea, BE and BTech are the most popular in engineering outside US, you got that right.</p>

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<p>
[quote]
Some other schools, besides Dartmouth, that issue ABET-accredited BE degrees (instead of BS degrees) include CUNY-City College, SUNY-Stony Brook, SUNY-Maritime, Stevens Inst. of Technology (NJ), and Youngstown State (OH). There could be others.</p>

<p>It's not particularly common in the US, but it's not unheard of either.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Vanderbilt as well.</p>

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<p>Hey Xan, I hope all is well. Your ears must be burning because I just mentioned you to Chicky this past sunday.</p>

<p>Most engineering students graduate with 2 degrees; AB in liberal arts given after the 4th year and they receive the BE in the 5th year. Yes, they go to graduation twice if they so desire.</p>

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<p>Hi Sybbie! Hope you and your daughter have a happy holiday season.</p>

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<p>My son, who is now a sophomore at Dartmouth, told us when he was home for Thanksgiving that he wants to major in engineering. He said that he knows that some students get their B.E. in four years but he doubts that he could do it (he is also on the crew team and is joining a fraternity so he is pretty busy). Other than the shock of having to pay a 5th year of tuition I am happy with his choice. One advantage of going for 5 years is, I think, that it will make it more possible for him to take advantage of the engineering department's foreign study options. I do have a question and hope someone may know about this- he was planning to major in engineering "modified with biology" but now he thinks that Dartmouth is soon going to introduce a new "biomedical engineering" major (I assume he is talking about the A.B. level here, not the B.E.) He is very excited about this development. Does anyone know anything about this? is it a big deal? </p>

<p>He has an internship next term- something to do with biomedical engineering and sponsored by "Howard Hughes" (whatever that means) and I hope he'll get an even better sense of what all this entails.</p>

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<p>Thanks for starting this thread! I was excited about Dartmouth until I heard it takes five years to get a BE (and then I wasn’t even sure what that was, both my parents are engineers and they didnt think it sounded legit). The thing is, I would have to get the BE in four years (otherwise it would make way more sense cost-wise to go somewhere else). Do you know how difficult this is? I’ve got a bunch of APs, I’ve finished the Calculus sequence, and taken Auto-CAD.</p>

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<p>it’s not that bad. The BE is essentially a “second major” to the normal AB track. It’s like double majoring in terms of workload. If you have a lot of your prereqs out of the way coming in, it’ll be that much easier. Just plan ahead.</p>

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<p>Yup, if you plan ahead the BE is definitely doable in 4 years. You just can’t afford to be lackadaisical about planning your classes.</p>

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<p>My son is getting the BE with only one extra term. It was theoretically possible to get it along with the AB in only four years but he decided to have a life, too. (Girlfriend, fraternity, sports.) I think going in with a lot of AP credits doesn’t hurt, either.</p>

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<p>Very Happy, how many AP classes did your son get credit for?Do you know which math course he started in at Dartmouth? Did he skip out of the foreign language requirement? Math seems the only area that you could really skip into the next level since you need math 8 either concurrently with Physics 13 and Chem 5. I am thinking of testing out of Spanish, but then, I would just have to replace that with something else. Please help me understand how you get ahead in Engineering beside skipping Math 3. Anyone?</p>

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<p>You can place into Math 11 (Multivariable Calc) and get Math 3 and Math 8 credit if you got a 4 or a 5 on the Calc BC exam. If you got a 4 or a 5 in Calc AB, you can get Math 3 credit and place into Math 8. [Advanced</a> Placement Information](<a href=“http://www.math.dartmouth.edu/undergraduate/first-year-students/ap-info/]Advanced”>Advanced Placement Information | Mathematics at Dartmouth)</p>

<p>If you take Math 8, you skip over Math 11 and go directly into Math 13, because Math 8 is basically all of BC plus the start of multivariable, and Math 13 is the rest of multivariable. Math 11 is specially designed and intended for people that took BC, so that it just goes through all of multivariable and doesn’t overlap with the BC curriculum at all.</p>

<p>The Physics Department won’t let you skip intro physics. If you’re on the engineering track you either take Physics 13 or, if you took AP Physics, you have the option of placing into Physics 15 which is the honors intro class. You can place out of Chem 5 and directly into Chem 6 if you got a 5 in AP Chem, IIRC.</p>

<p>Placing out of the language requirement is not a bad idea if you can do it. At least at Dartmouth, some of the language classes are pretty rigorous and can be a bit of a pain, what with drill and all that.</p>

<p>Not sure if that is exactly what you were asking but hope that helps clear things up a bit.</p>

<p>Johnleemk, are you still an undergrad?</p>

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<p>I am only in Calc AB and have a horrible teacher (really!) So, I think I will have to step into Calc 3. The only thing I can even figure that may be helpful is to test out of Spanish. I think I need to get a 4 or 5 on the AP exam to do that, is that right? I think I read that on the Engineering page. I guess that would help me a little, although if I took it, I could possibly pad my GPA, but I have heard that the drill classes are time consuming. I don’t feel comfortable skipping Chem 5, I only got a 3 on the AP exam. I think my AP teachers are not as rigorous as maybe some of the other schools, not many people even pass the AP tests in my school. The average (and I am not kidding) on the AP Calc AB test last year was 1.3! I am a bit scared, but I will work hard. I understand they have tutoring there also. I am excited, but realistic. My parents are a bit afraid because an extra year to get my BE is another 50K. (No aid, but one good scholarship so far!)</p>