<p>Does her guidance counselor know her reasonably well? If so, it might be useful to talk to her/him. </p>
<p>I agree that depression is quite possible. I wonder if she would be willing to meet with a therapist in order to get a professional assessment of whether or not she is depressed.</p>
<p>You might explore with her the question of what she would like her life to look like. Certainly not “school, homework, bed, repeat.” But, what? What would she do if she were not going to school all day? How would she spend her time? Then create space in her life to pursue those things. They don’t need to be organized activities- just an activity.
The only thing I’d veto would be passive computer surfing and social media- unless she’s creating her own blog or website.
Another idea is to put her to work at home. Get her out from behind the computer and the textbooks and have her learn to cook, help with the yard, paint a room, take care of a pet. She needs more balance and perspective in her life, and it can start at home.</p>
<p>“Another idea is to put her to work at home. Get her out from behind the computer and the textbooks and have her learn to cook, help with the yard, paint a room, take care of a pet. She needs more balance and perspective in her life, and it can start at home.”</p>
<p>I agree with this too. I read somewhere a long time ago that children feel better about themselves if they have a role in contributing to the family’s well being. My children have always had chores connected to chores. They don’t simply receive money; they do chores. One son seems to have developed a genuine interest in gardening and landscaping.</p>
<p>Thanks for all the great advice and support. I am confident she will make it through this tough time. We have just let a bad situation deteriorate and now she feels stuck. I’m going to make an appointment with her doctor to get a professional opinion in case of any underlying depression/anxiety issues. She needs to find her passion in life and the only way to do that is go out and try things. Our school does offer a post-secondary option at a local university and this may be something we will explore. Thanks.</p>
<p>This may sound strange, but fencing is a great sport for smart kids. It’s like chess with exercise. </p>
<p>Many fencing clubs offer a free lesson. It’s also very social and the kids really bond with each other. </p>
<p>school - homework - bed - repeat </p>
<p>is not a life. This must change now.</p>
<p>^^I agree with CRD, Fencing is a good (if stinky) sport that seems to draw the smart kids.</p>
<p>I think just getting your daughter out of the house and trying new things would be better than the status quo, but get her checked four depression if you think it’s a good thing to do. She didn’t have to like every experience, think of it as exploring and taking little risks - nothing works out immediately. We (the entire family) rock climbed, biked, hiked. Have your child do something outside of school. Pottery, drawing classes, archery, swimming, photography, volunteering, even a part time job at the local frozen yogurt shop, go to anime cons. Eventually she’ll meet others who may “get” her.</p>
<p>I think this is a perfect time to give her a glimpse into what HER hard work is going to yield. Bring her to a place like Princeton and let her walk the campus and see the buildings. My eyes opened wide when I saw how special these places are. and it was at that point I realized I was no longer trying to impress people in my high school but rather building up enough energy to escape and begin a new life. yes EC’s are a great thing but I don’t believe its about her fitting in at her high school but using opportunities to help her see the next stage that is waiting for her. If she quits & gets depressed then there is nothing for her. but if she uses it as motivation then something really positive could happen.</p>
<p>I personally don’t think leaving the school to go to a college will make her any happier - what it sounds like is she wants ‘in’ on the social scene at school. Doesn’t sound like anyone is being mean or bullying her but rather she is waiting to be invited. How about suggesting to her that she do the inviting - there is probably someone in one of her classes she feels comfortable socializing with - perhaps the two of them could join something together. Once she gets comfortable doing this she may be willing to take a few more chances at trying new things.<br>
These social situations will come up again throughout life - learning to navigate these waters and developing social skills will benefit her if she starts doing it now.<br>
I think it’s a good idea to touch base with the school counselor. Wishing you and your daughter well.</p>
<p>It sounds to me like part of the problem is an excessive focus on grades, and that focus is also happening in a school environment that is not inspiring. So she is hitting a wall of meaninglessness. Believe it or not, I think that finding her academic life to be empty is a developmental stage that is healthy. She may be growing up to the extent that just doing the work to get an A is not enough for her, but that is the only pattern she knows, so she doesn’t know any other perspective. She needs to move from the “should do’s” to the “want to do’s.”</p>
<p>To put it another way, she has always been a “good girl” and done her work and gotten A’s. But that is an immature motivation (though common) that can cause feelings of emptiness in the long run. She may need to have more inner motivation (interest), rather than outer motivation (grades), which might require a change in environment. And she may need a break from the kinds of homework she currently has, to give her psyche room to breathe and for her to start getting to know herself.</p>
<p>I think that a kid like this, at this stage, may rebel or may withdraw. I think it is very important to talk to her about how she might inject some meaning into her life. Her depression may have advanced far enough now that changing the situation won’t help until she is treated, or some big changes may jump start her. You know her and can talk to her so that is something she and your family can figure out.</p>
<p>So without knowing her, I would lean toward making a big change. Leaving that school. Finding a school where academics are valued for the learning and there is less emphasis on grades, perhaps a more creative environment, or a school with small, interactive, interesting classes. Maybe portfolio-based rather than graded. Or even, believe it or not, a lower quality school where less work is required to get A’s, if she cannot get off the track of worrying about A’s.</p>
<p>There are online courses, online diplomas, GED, community college/dual enrollment and opportunities at college extension schools. If you cannot afford a private and there aren’t public options, perhaps she could spend some time at home doing school in a different way.</p>
<p>In any case, it seems like she needs more free time. to free up her psyche enough to find other things to do and to get to know who she really is, beyond the smart girl who gets A’s.</p>
<p>Theater, music, art are all great things to get into at school or outside of school. There are other things, whether chess, debate or health. She could volunteer at a hospital, with kids, with animals, at a senior center, all kinds of things. Service can be energizing. Does she like programming or web design? Nature? Is there any seed of interest that can be developed?</p>
<p>On the other hand, the idea that every kid is going to have some grand passion at 16 is misguided and harms a lot of us. The real challenge is to find things that are interesting in ordinary, daily life, whether that is classes at school or books at home or taking a walk, or spending time with a friend. Depression prevents all these things and overwork can keep you from facing it.</p>
<p>The pain of the social scene may also be pushing her into overfocus on work and grades. I am not saying she is obsessive compulsive, but it is not unusual to find kids who are compelled to work really hard in order to avoid pain. She just needs a friend or two. High school social life can be so toxic. Again, a new environment might help.</p>
<p>There is a great book out about gifted girls, I can’t remember the title, but it does say that gifted girls are often not social. Is it possible she could come to value time alone?</p>
<p>Above all, it would be great if she could see a therapist. Medication might help but a good adolescent therapist might be the best first approach. An MD can rule out low thyroid and things like that, but it sounds like this depression is situational. </p>
<p>It’s going to be a hard transition for her but hold onto the thought that this could be some kind of transition to the next stage of maturity, and might bring positives in the long run. And better now than when away at college.</p>
<p>Any chance she can attend a private high school in your area for her last two years? I felt very similarly to your daughter in a public setting . . .intelligence and high achievement are not what’s held up on a pedestal in many public schools. Private school was completely different . . .there were lots of smart, motivated kids and those kids were respected if not necessarily SUPER popular. I got much more involved because the school was smaller, and I could make the sports teams, get the lead in the play, etc. I was sooooo much happier and really came out of my shell during those few years (I switched schools in 10th grade).</p>
<p>amarylandmom has suggested exactly what I was thinking. </p>
<p>Change schools, preferably to one where intelligence is valued. My parents did that for me and it changed my life. I was a new junior at my school.</p>
<p>I still remember interviewing with the head of school – who asked me if I liked school. Looking back – 43 years later – what the head was looking for was so obvious. She was building a community of girls that liked learning and liked school. </p>
<p>Yes, it’s expensive. In my case it was worth every penny. It cost my parents about a year of college tuition for my last two years at the private day school. And as I said, it changed my life.</p>
<p>If you make your daughter only do something which is a “passion” I doubt things will improve. It’s ok to do something just for fun, even if you are not good at it and don’t take it seriously. Also, how is she supposed to know what she has a “passion” for without trying anything? If you only let her do something hyper competitive and challenging, it will end up being just another misery to endure so she gets in to college.</p>
<p>I know the concept of doing anything that does not aid college admissions is alien to this board but that is what I think. Let her try loads of things. Let her fail at them and continue doing them even so. Also meeting people outside of school is a good idea. The American high school is all encompassing. It’s not like this in other countries. People go to school, but their spare time is their own. ECs are something which take place in the community (and they would be called hobbies) for pleasure not to win (and not only because they will help in college admissions).</p>
<p>I have another suggestion, and it would be pretty controversial, but liberating. </p>
<p>Have her choose her least favorite class besides math and tell her to get a (B or an A- whatever she can live with to break her cycle of perfection). Miss a few assignments, don’t study hard for a test, etc. Let her know that it’s ok. Her life needs to be about living, not just about college. </p>
<p>I leave math out because that’s cumulative, but any other class will do. It’s liberating to break a cycle of perfection and have the world not end.</p>
<p>D1 took fencing in 8th and 9th grade to fulfill her gym requirement. She was very good and was asked by a well known coach if he could train her. D1 said no. She said fencing outfit was ugly and kids were making fun of her. At the time, I thought it was a silly reason, but I figured if she felt uncomfortable I wasn’t going to push her on it.</p>
<p>OP’s D maybe pegged as a smart/boring kid already at her current school, so I do agree with others to transfer to another school if it’s possible. D1 went to high school in the NE and D2 went to an international school for the last 2 years of high school. D2 didn’t have as much of issue at her high school, kids just didn’t seem as catty. D1 had a tough time navigating US high school pettiness. She learned very early on not to discuss her grades with other kids. Whenever asked how she did, she would just say fine. She graduated top 5% of her class, was known as a smart kid, but she always flew under the radar. </p>
<p>If OP’s D can’t transfer then I would encourage her to find ECs outside of school. She could meet new people and recreate herself (or just stay the way she is). I don’t think it would be a good idea to try to break into a clique. It maybe more frustrating than it is worth. I would encourage her to make few friends, offer to have them come over or take them out to dinner/movies. Kids that age will come if the venue is fun even if they are not sure if they like the host (sad, yes). Once she has few friends then if one of her friends is invited to something then she’ll be more likely to be invited too.</p>
<p>Could she try math team? or any academic clubs?</p>
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<p>Your daughter is unhappy, and her unchallenging school environment is likely responsible for at least some of that. Many excellent suggestions here for helping her find a better match for her abilities. I would encourage you not to think in terms of how **she ** needs to be different – more passionate, more outgoing, less passive. And I’d suggest that this is not in your control – you haven’t necessarily “let” this happen, and she wouldn’t necessarily be any happier if you’d pushed her all along to be more social and more passionate. An existing passion can be fostered and encouraged, but that kind of interest itself can’t be pushed on a child.</p>
<p>Trying to break into a clique-ish group is not a good idea, imho – cliques exist in order to exclude people. Making a good friend or two is a different story, and could well lead to involvement with a larger group of friends.</p>
<p>Classic Rocker Dad, I was thinking the same thing. You are much more concise than I about getting beyond the false motivator of grades, and your suggestion of breaking the perfectionist cycle is an interesting one- as long as it doesn’t go too far!</p>
<p>I feel for your daughter because I was that girl. In grade school I was so quiet my classmates thought I was dumb and avoided me because of it. I didn’t realize that until we reached middle school (when teachers started posting exam grades on the wall outside the classroom) and many of my classmates expressed surprise that I was “smart.” Until then, I never really fit into one of the ‘groups;’ I wasn’t athletic, or viewed as a smart kid, and I was too quiet to be the funny kid or one of the popular group. But while being viewed as smart earned me some respect, it didn’t help me make friends.</p>
<p>I didn’t realize it in high school, but I’m an introvert. (I get my energy from being alone). Being in huge groups for any length of time is taxing, as is being with people who are perpetually ‘up.’ Recognizing that earlier would have helped me find activities and people who were more suited to my personality. The thing that changed high school for me was a cross country move when I was in 9th grade. I went from a small northern school to a large southern one, so I had to make an effort to connect with people. I met a girl in one of my classes who had moved from the north the previous year and discovered we both felt out of place in our new home. She introduced me to her friends. We didn’t all become friends right away, but we were friendly. I joined band because that’s the one EC my old school had that I was comfortable with and got to know several people there too. When I joined our school paper and the track team the following year and some of those people also chose those activities, we became friends. By then we had several things in common: my friend from the north, band activities, classes, the newspaper, and/or our track team. But it wasn’t the move itself that changed my situation, it was the change in my approach.</p>
<p>What I would suggest is to have your daughter choose an EC that she thinks she’ll enjoy, try to find someone with a similar personality or interests, and invite that person to do something. Keep her eye out for other kids who are on the fringe or feeling left out too. They probably won’t be the ‘popular’ kids or the cliques everyone’s trying to fit into, but I don’t think that’s a bad thing. The girl I met in 9th grade wasn’t in the popular clique, but we had a lot in common and have been friends for over 30 years. When her parents divorced while we were in high school, I was a sounding board for her. When I moved out of state after high school and was frustrated that I had to wait a year to get residency so I could afford college, she offered encouragement. I think that by focusing on things outside ourselves, we were able to make deeper connections that lasted longer. So instead of trying to find a group of friends to fit into, I’d suggest trying to find one friend. I think the rest will fall into place from there.</p>
<p>A lot of good advice here from experienced parents who have seen a lot.
Letting her know you love her and want her to be happy and productive and not just an A student might help her ease up on herself. Sometimes we parents are unaware of how much pressure they feel from us even if we don’t verbalize it. Taking a look at what we reinforce by our own attitudes is never a bad idea.</p>
<p>Consider a great boarding school. Applications are due shortly. They have all the challenges academically you could ever want, great teachers, in-built friends, tons of ECs integrated throughout the campus. boardingschoolreview is a place to start.</p>