Daughter Not Taking an Interest

Parents Forum
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<p>I disagree. Our daughter attends the University of Texas Austin and we only are only a 40 minute drive (just 25 miles) away. Her college experience would be nothing similar without the residential aspect. When kids live on their own (or in dorms, sorority houses, etc) they are forced to manage their own lives. They do their own laundry, they manage their own time, they manage their own party schedules…etc. If a child commutes, the parenting aspect is so clouded and complicated because they are your child, adult or not, and it is too easy to judge, interfere, or try to manage things for them.</p>

<p>When they live on campus, 5 miles away or 500 miles away, there is a physical break between parent or child, that is SO good for the growth of the child. Your daughter seems to push back against you when you try to keep her from flushing her potential down the toilet. You may consider having her visit a life coach to try to formulate a game plan. For some kids, the parents will never be able to provide this insight without being “controlling”, “difficult” or “dumb” (some of my son’s favorite words of choice…lol) Some kids listen, some don’t. For those that don’t you are spinning your wheels. I have a son with so much potential, who at this point (23) has yet to put his life on a firm and steady path because he is so busy being “right” he can’t see how wrong he is. Let me save you from yourself and let you know you will NEVER win with this type of personality.</p>

<p>You may consider outlining an email to her that basically says, we have xx number of dollars for your college education, (or I have run the numbers through FAFSA and project you will qualify for the pell grant)…(the situation does not matter…only the truth does), and that you want to be upfront with those figures and that money needed beyond that will have to be obtained via scholarships or loans. You can stress that scholarships will be awarded for work done in HS and that frankly it does not matter to you whether she earns money for school, or borrows money for school, but that she needs to be aware that there is no leprechaun at the end of the financial rainbow. So she can work hard now and try to earn some money for college or she can bust her a$$ after college and pay her loans back. Either way, no skin off your teeth, but that you simply wanted her to be aware. Close the case and see where the chips may fall.</p>

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<p>One thing you can always be sure of is that there’s always a “smarter” kid out there.It amazes me how many really smart kids I come across at my kids academic competitions. Some of them are brilliant!!!</p>

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<p>if she would spend just 15 minutes a day on college searching or 1/2 hour a day on SAT prepping</p>

<p>OP, you are thinking like an adult and she’s 16 or 17. Her life has revolved around family and school structure. Even if you feel you’ve given her freedoms, the leap to college is a whole 'nother matter. Everyone talks of it as a major decision, major steps to be taken, results to achieve, how one’s whole future depends on it- and there you are, saying the same.</p>

<p>And, she’s there saying, but I don’t have the answers, I don’t know.</p>

<p>Think like a kid. What makes sense to you, the adult, isn’t always as obvious to them. Tell her she’s taking the SAT/ACT this fall; tell her, matter-of-factly, objectively, no sarcasm, that that battle is hers to win or lose. But, that you love her, believe she’s worthy of college and would like her to find where she can be happy. That simple. Buy a test prep book, leave it out, along with the guides. And, go do research on your own. You, too, have miles to go.</p>

<p>And, get her looking at colleges. You don’t need a school break to do this; there are many schools in driving distance. Be her buddy, through this- I can’t emphasize enough how important that middle ground is- not only to help her get the wheels on track (whatever that may be, however long it takes) but also to set the basis for a good relationship going forward. Otherwise, as she does grow, become more independent, you can lose closeness.</p>

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<p>Maybe increasing pressure could do the trick… sometimes kids only change under intense pressure. Also, if you want to use the pressure approach, do it all of a sudden.</p>

<p>In addition, do NOT relent the pressure, keep increasing the pressure.</p>

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<p>There are many schools that will accept students with sub 600 scores on sections of the SAT. Our very capable DD never broke 600 on one section of the SAT. We let her go to a private residential college anyway where she managed to graduate with a double major engineering and biology. That sub 600 SAT score was not a hindrance at all. I’m not sure why this is so important to you unless you absolutely need a merit award that she won’t get without this.</p>

<p>I also agree that an SAT score in 10th grade is not perhaps what you will see with the retake in March even if she does NOTHING. She can also retake in the fall of her senior year. OR she might want to take the ACT…some kids do better on that.</p>

<p>Our kids would have lived in the dorm for college even IF the school had been in our backyard. They were ready to leave and we were ready for them to make this transition. It sounds like you would pay that money for a dorm if the school were not within commuting distance. So…why not just pay it anyway assuming the finances work for you?</p>

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<p>Your D is still young, and maybe it is overwhelming to think about such huge decisions for which she doesn’t feel ready. It’s okay.</p>

<p>It’s also okay that you recognize that you have “spoiled her.” When we are watching our kids get ready to leave the nest, all of OUR stuff comes up, too. Our regrets about parenting, and our own lives. The thing is that it is still early in her college search and you BOTH still have time to grow into it.</p>

<p>I suggest you see this as a (frustrating) beginning…but only a beginning. As time goes on, each time she shows some initiatvie, reward it by affirming her progress, and then back off a bit more.</p>

<p>D is a senior and we applied to 9 colleges. When we began it was disastrous. Frankly I was obsessed and forced her to start before she was ready (which she resented, the cycle began, she got more passive, I got more controlling, etc.) </p>

<p>This website helped me a lot to 1) get realistic parameters for today’s college realities and 2) to process my own feelings without dragging her through them.</p>

<p>I took her to see probably six schools before taking her to one she liked. Finally the ice was broken. Maybe because she saw that I wouldn’t force her to apply to a school she didn’t like. And…I took her to schools I didn’t like (reputation wise) but which she was interested in. They ended up on her list, and… I got used to it!</p>

<p>D is a good but not great student. No chance of merit aid at great schools but no chance of getting into need-based fin aid schools. However she (not I!) found three private schools she liked, which have different possibilities (first one, an opportunity program, second one, an Americorp program and third one, a merit scholarship which she actually got since it’s not that competitive). We also applied to three state schools (her choices).</p>

<p>Now she is accepted to several schools, many of which we can’t afford but a few of which are distinct possibilities. She may end up at a state school. She may commute to the mediocre private college with merit aid nearby – where she would be considered a top student, boost to the ego! Fingers crossed on the two private schools where she has been accepted and where we are waiting for financial aid notification. </p>

<p>Best of all she is happy with the thought of any of them. Because she chose them. When it came time to make THE LIST, it was her choice. </p>

<p>With reluctant kids who really do have the potential (and who DO articulate that they WANT to go to colelge!) it can be like a dance, you start off leading and they will get the hang of it. Once they start leading the steps, notice quickly and respond to their lead!</p>

<p>It is an exciting time to be able to grow in your love for your D. You can change…she WILL change. Try to channel your obsession away from her, work on your own stuff apart from her. Try to focus on timely and concise info which will serve her situation. </p>

<p>Don’t beat her over the head about grades. I did, and my daughter finally had to say Mom I know already! I’m doing the best I can! I really had to push to get her to re-take SATs. She went up only slightly, but at least she took them twice, no doubts about whether she could have done better. She will not go to a top college, and that’s okay. </p>

<p>Point is, let her know you love her and will be there for her, no matter what.</p>

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I’d forgotten, that a lot of schools lost vacation time this year. That’s unfortunate since I think it’s much better to see a college in session. Nevertheless, I’d figure out a way to do a few easy college visits and not on Saturday or Sunday morning when campuses are dead! </p>

<p>AP tests aren’t the same as subject tests, I forget which APs she was taking, but US History and Biology line up very well with the SAT subject tests. If you look through the big blue subject test book or the sample questions on line you can probably get a pretty good idea of what it makes sense to sign up for. My younger son did quite well on the Literature despite hating English classes and not taking either AP English option. He’s a naturally good test taker though. You may not need subject tests, not all colleges require them, especially if you take the ACT.</p>

<p>I think you should be happy if she’ll do the “Question a Day” at the SAT site. No way you’d get 1/2 an hour!</p>

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<p>Lots of good advice here for you, but I would also direct you to the success stories rolling in at:</p>

<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/939937-3-0-3-3-gpa-parents-thread-2013-hs-graduation.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/939937-3-0-3-3-gpa-parents-thread-2013-hs-graduation.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>That forum, filled with parents of kids very similar to your daugher, will hopefully let you relax a bit that things will work out just fine, really. </p>

<p>As others have pointed out, she’ll likely either bring her SATs up in Round 2, or you’ll find that the ACT fits her best. But even if she doesn’t bring up her scores, that and her GPA as it stands now will get her into many fine colleges, and MANY will give her merit money. No, not top tier, but colleges that will be a good fit for her. </p>

<p>Message me if you’d like a list of my similar kid’s successes this year in the college lotteries. Really, it will be fine!</p>

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<p>Looking at current SAT Scores, and the fact that the student is just not intrinscally a go getter, I don’t see her upping those scores to the point where she is going to get merit money. It’s tough to get sizeable merit awards and it’s going to take quite a bit to bring private school costs down to what in state would cost, and in her case, her numbers are not well in the 50% midstream of the publics that are being considered. We are not talking about someone who is close and a little bit of a push might bring her over the merit line.</p>

<p>As a parent, part of our job is to make sure our children do well in school, learn the material covered, learn basic study skills, and to try to motivate them to do the best we can. So the parent is asking an age old question …the sulky school child has been around ever since lessons and school were in the picture. If she could come up with a universal answer that works, she’d be up for the Nobel Prize. There is no answer that works. You try to get your child to do a little more, keep plugging away, and try motiviating him/her. It gets trickier as the child gets older because teens and young adults go a bit crazy, IMO, many times during thiese years, will cut off their noses to spite their faces…and yours, so it’a a balancing act. You pick your battles, yet be the parent. Who the heck knows the answer to this? I have underachievers that have broken my heart–the cracks are still there. </p>

<p>Though it is possible that a complete turn around will occur, I don’t see this as a child who is most selective college material or in line for a full award. My one son’s whose test scores were along the lines of the OP’s was not going to be getting into college or getting money on his test scores. The best that could happen with him, which did , was a steady improvement in grades as he also built up the difficulty of courses taken, so that he was in good shape to be a good candidate and investment for college. Even if he were not, or in this case, if the OP’s DD were not, most of us concerned parents here, do the Hail Mary pass over tthe college goal line and pay the money to sent the kid to colllege in hopes that s/he gets through and even gets better in school. Hopefully, it happens.</p>

<p>Though it’s THE thing to do to send the kid off to college, into a dorm as part of THE experience, it may NOT be the optimal thing for certain kids, and greatly reduce some of these kids’ chances of getting through that first year or college altogether. There is a community of kids, some from well to do households, commuting to a local school that is generous with merit money, and most of the ones we know are loving it ,doiing well, and the graduates I know are in good shape too. Probably over all better than one who went off to school and came back. Some of them are joining their ranks when things did not work out, though paying full freight as transfers after blowing the moneyspent to send them to sleep away school. It all depends on the kids as well as the finances.</p>

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<p>I think your D needs a fact check. Here are some things I would pull together and show her:

  • The total amount of money you have to spend on college
  • The total cost of a few different college options for her. Start assuming NO merit aid. Show her a private college, OOS public, in-state flagship, in-state “directional”, and community college. Use colleges you think she could get into with her current scores. Assuming no merit money with her current scores.
  • Explain how much money she can borrow on her own, and whether you are willing to borrow any additional beyond what she can borrow.
  • Ask her if she has other options or thoughts in mind (ROTC, gap year with a plan, technical school, etc.)
  • Ask if she would prefer to start visiting the affordable options on the table, or work on her scores to see if she can move herself into a category where better colleges (at the same price) or merit aid might be on the table. I would assume you will pay for a prep class or tutor, or maybe be willing to tutor her yourself (we did that, but I am not sure it would work given your history with her on the SAT).</p>

<p>I am all for giving kids choices, but I think it is a rare 18 year old who can pull together this type of information to make an informed decision. I am not at all with the posters who say to leave her alone or wait until junior year. She is planning to spend YOUR money on college, so I think you need to help set the agenda for talking about how she is going to get to a place that satisfies both of you.</p>

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<p>I think that you are thinking a little in black and white: either she does things the way you are hoping she will, or you let her “fall on her face.” This age and time of life is very tricky for us parents. We need to balance involvement with detachment, and give them the feeling of autonomy even when they cannot truly pull it off.</p>

<p>Think middle road: for example, as someone said, leave the books/SAT stuff out, but don’t mention them. Her SAT’s are fine for her to attend a decent place, public or private.</p>

<p>You might want to have a real talk with her. Tell her that it is fine with you if she does not go to college next year. Tell her you will support alternative, whether work or gap year program.</p>

<p>Then tell her that, on the other hand, if there are schools she wants to look at or apply to, you will be available to her, but won’t push anything yourself. That suggestion is for a kid who is resistant and/or dependent.</p>

<p>Depending on the kid, another strategy can be to suggest, say, two schools for early action, which is a manageable task, so that she has somewhere to go. Again, that suggestion is for the kid who is overwhelmed or paralyzed.</p>

<p>Tell her there are many paths to follow. The majority of college students today are over 25.</p>

<p>I personally have two who went right through college, but my youngest has been more complicated. I fully support her, because she has earned that support -not with academic ambition or achievement, but because of who she is, her integrity. She has required more involvement from me, not less, but is also more independent and really wants to do things herself. As I said, very tricky balance, but rewarding. Remember your relationship with your daughter is, ultimately, the important thing.</p>

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<p>As a junior in high school, i can tell you that i wasn’t a huge fan of beginning the college process esp. in sophomore and freshman year. Once my parents took me to visit a few, and once i began to take interest in [College</a> Admissions - SAT - University & College Search Tool](<a href=“http://www.collegeboard.org%5DCollege”>http://www.collegeboard.org) i began to think much more about the right major for me.
But you know, not everyone is meant for college and i know that is hard to hear esp. from a high schooler. I only say that because there are members of my family who aren’t made for it. Maybe she could join the Peace Corps after high school, or do another kind of global aid mission?</p>

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<p>A good SAT study resource is the “SAT question of the day”. Sign up on College Board website to get it emailed each day. </p>

<p>I’m more concerned about the the organization skills. This might be one those kids (like my D) that skated through early years on brainpower. You usually can’t do that in college.</p>

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<p>@MomFullofQ’s</p>

<p>Did you ever consider that your daughter has undiagnosed ADD? A physician told me that it is often undiagnosed in girl’s is because people look for ADHD - hyperactivity. In girls, ADD is sometimes misinterpreted as disinterest in class, etc. So the girl’s are labeled as lazy, unmotivated and have inconsistent school performance.</p>

<p>If that is NOT the case - some students blossom late. Community college might be a perfect solution. Or a gap year with a structured schedule (volunteer work, job, etc.). But don’t push a student into college if they aren’t ready. It’s a waste of time and energy and she’ll need good recommendations and test scores to even be considered for competitive colleges. Community college can help with learning organizational skills and finding what a student’s passion is.</p>

<p>Some students bake slower than others. For some - enlightenment comes later than expected.</p>

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<p>Glamwriter…Peace Corps takes college grads, or folks with significant life experience…not high school grads right out of high school.</p>

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<p>Thanks everyone. I have been reading throughout the day. Daughter has been on the computer most of the day working on a school project. I am definitely taking in everything everyone is saying and considering all suggestions. </p>

<p>Exie, I would be surprised if my daughter has ADD. She is a great student and her teachers are highly complimentary of her. There are a few times that she has struggled with a class but not because she couldn’t concentrate. She’s a lot like me – if I don’t grasp something immediately I tend to throw my hands up and walk away instead of trying to persevere. She has also had multiple teachers offer to prepare letters of recommendation for her, without her asking. </p>

<p>Somehow I think a few of you might have misunderstood, or I didn’t explain clearly. My daughter is a junior now, not a sophomore. I had her take the SAT at the end of her sophomore year (last year) because she had just finished honors Geometry/Algebra II. </p>

<p>We have made a few adjustments in her schedule. She originally started out in all honors, then dropped honors science sophomore year. For junior year she dropped honors math. So she has 2 regular level classes and 2 AP classes. Her lowest grades last marking period were an 83 in AP US History and an 86 in AP English (unweighted) so it’s not like she’s doing poorly in school. Both teachers told us the grades would probably drop first marking period but as they became acclimated to the rigors of AP classes they should improve from there. Pre Cal is a 91 and Marine Science is a 95 (neither of which will be weighted) and Honors Spanish is a 93 (unweighted). They’re not Ivy-quality grades but I’m happy with them. Hopefully her AP grades will improve throughout the year. I really believe it’s the SAT that will be a problem and that’s where we butt heads the most. She never has done as well on standardized testing as she does in class.</p>

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<p>Please don’t equate attending community college with “falling on her face.” One of my S1’s best friends was very much like your D. Just not motivated about SAT tests, college tours, any of it. He attended our local JC, and after completing his undergrad work, transferred to Berkeley. He’ll graduate this Spring. What happened? He grew up in those two years. The JC was the very best place for a student like him who needed to ease into it.</p>

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<p>Has she tried the ACT? My one son who just doesn’ test well did do better on the ACT. Not a whole lot better but enough to get into the mid 50% of the schools to which he was applying which was not the case with his SATs. </p>

<p>And I all with LongRangePlan. Alot of the attitudes about comm colleges come from threats and remarks that just sear it into too many brains that it’s just for losers, which it is absolutley not. Some kids I know who couldn’t find squat for jobs for a couple of years after graduating from some selective colleges, are now in the career path after adding a certificate program from the Comm Coll. It took them a while to get out of their heads that they wre too good to be doing such a thing.</p>

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<p>Definitely look into the ACT. It was a godsend for one of our sons.</p>

<p>(cross posted with cpt)</p>

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<p>The only reason I haven’t suggested the ACT is because I’ve been told that the math is even harder on that test and since that seems to be her weakest subject, I didn’t think it would help. Maybe it should be another option.</p>

<p>I have quietly placed the SAT and college books back in the livingroom. I honestly don’t think she even noticed they were gone. I have also not mentioned the subject of testing or college since Sunday other than to tell her if she’s still interested in going to visit the college we had discussed this Saturday, she should go online and see if we need to register, to which I got an eye roll and a tongue cluck which was followed up by “how am I supposed to know how to do that?”. I told her I’d be happy to help if she wants assistance, but I won’t be taking the lead any longer. And now, of course, we’re supposed to get snow on Friday. LOL.</p>