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<p>Just because Asians are ORM at medical schools does not mean that most Asian pre-meds are successful at getting into medical schools.</p>
<p>This is all futile. the point was that changing parents is not possible. All the kid can do is to make the best of his situation as any other should. So, ignoring what they say and appreciating what they do will work. Others might have other options. I stated mine based on my experience, others share the ones based on their experience, then OP will have to choose. Nothing else, forget med. schools and all the numbers, point is not getting across, so consider it irrelevant.</p>
<p>In my view, the majority of high-end (read, professional) immigrants in recent decades have been what I call ‘economic mercenaries’ - not necessarily to just find a better financial position, but to take advantage of it as much as possible (such as advancement)</p>
<p>If you have a large sample size of immigrant friends it’s easy to see who are the ‘mercenaries’ in the sense that they were the ones with the big sticker on their luggage on the way in “Americah or Buste”. The rest of us, well, just happened to end up living here, most likely by marrying locals or their field of work was simply not available (exactly how many embedded Linux developers does Elbonia employ?). </p>
<p>The equality part goes out the window once the kids start interacting with other cultures and parents feel ‘threatened’ by all the ‘equality’.</p>
<p>One can get some insight from how the ‘mercs’ do if/when they return to their home country. My own birth country sports a stunning return percentage (even tho our economy is in the gutter) simply because of what is perceived ‘quality of life’ by my former compatriots. That is, while economic opportunities are better here, one can’t pass up the fun aspects of life - i.e. why work 40-60 hours a week when you can work 35?</p>
<p>For other cultures it is not quite the same - the delta between the haves and the have nots is stunningly higher than where I came from or the US, and this increases the pressure to avoid any risk of landing in the have nots category.</p>
<p>There’s even a cultural aspect regarding the reputation of various professions. In some cultures government work is respected (and even revered :-)). In the US it’s tolerated, but in parts of the world where government and people were not always in good relationship with each other, any government related job is immediately rejected (law, politics, military, and so on included)</p>
<p>Personal situations in the country of origin also play into this - a family that was well off to do in the home country is not likely to settle for anything but, and even ‘honorable’ entry level jobs in many fields are not well received… So, employment goals that involve college-to-NFL salary advancement may be perceived as more appropriate. As the joke goes, “people from XXXX country don’t want to start as a teller in a bank, they want to own the bank”.</p>
<p>In any case, I think that your typical Mr. and Mrs. Tiger (from all over the world) would do well to get out of their cultural shell for a while and see the economy as more than their local circle. Unfortunately, this involves widening one’s circle, adding experiences like travel, volunteering, and the like, and that’s not always the case (for the parents). </p>
<p>Without understanding deep under what the parents have in mind I agree that it’s futile to try to argue with them. Even if you do understand why, it may just be enough to get you to your favorite school / major, but not enough to grant ‘nirvana’ and acceptance.</p>
<p>Maybe I should write the anti-Amy Chua book one of these days :-)</p>
<p>I suspect OP is wondering how does any of this discussion solving my problem?</p>
<p>I don’t think that NerdyAsianKid [NAK] can get his/her parents to leave him/her alone–but NAK can overcome the feeling of feeling like a “disgrace,” if he/she attends the state flagship. It seems to me that NAK’s parents get to NAK at least partly because NAK has bought into their values. I have been suggesting different values, which do not connect worth to accomplishment.</p>
<p>This seems to me to be a variant on the situation where a student has his/her identity tied up in being the “top” student, then goes to a college where the competition is stiff, and the student has an identity crisis, not knowing how to handle the new situation. </p>
<p>In this case, the issue is already facing NAK at high school level. There is no objective reason whatsoever to feel like a “disgrace” if one is attending the state flagship. That is just wrong on many levels. This is a case where I don’t go for cultural relativism.</p>
<p>Also, turbo93, if you write the anti-Amy Chua book, I pledge to buy it. Haven’t bought her book on principle. I suppose if it winds up on the remainder tables, I might change my mind.</p>
<p>Why so many posts about immigration? These are well researched cultural characteristics in place in the home countries. Sometimes, you know what: it’s not about us.</p>
<p>Because the root cause of the issue is **some **immigrant parent attitudes… The cubs, er, kids, born in Topeka, KS or some such, never had The Talk with their parents as to how they ended up on this side of the ocean versus that side… Or what did the olde country looked like, and so on.</p>
<p>Likewise, the parents are more often than not stuck in olde country mode even after three decades, and don’t consider the fact that they actually live in Topeka significant.</p>
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<p>I don’t think this is limited to high-end professional immigrants or to those of recent decades. Most high school classmates who experienced this type of treatment had parents who were farmers, laborers, waiters, etc…jobs most wouldn’t classify as “professional”. </p>
<p>Secondly, this isn’t limited to immigrants from the last few decades. Heard many stories from older high school alums and teachers (non-Asians) who experienced the same back when they were attending high school in the 60’s, 50’s, or in one case…even the early-mid 1930s. </p>
<p>One of them happens to have had an Italian laborer for a father who insisted his son MUST go to CCNY back when it was “The Poor Man’s Harvard” or else he’d disgrace the entire family. A tall order considering every NYC/NY State resident who were shut out of the Ivies/elite LACs due to financial, racial, or social constraints was gunning to get in back then. </p>
<p>An older neighbor who graduated high school in 1950 recounted how he felt ashamed at “only getting into NYU” after being turned down by CCNY back when it was considered an elite university. He also never heard the end of it from his parents…even after he became a successful ophthalmologist. </p>
<p>In short, this phenomenon of parents trying to live their own dreams through their children is much more widespread beyond merely Asians, “high-end immigrants”, and/or restricted to the last few decades.</p>
<p>Not limited, true, but far more common.</p>
<p>Turbo, do you mind revealing your home country?</p>
<p>I guess Greece or Italy, something Mediterranian at least. Maybe a Balkan country. Am I close?</p>
<p>To clarify, and apologies to any poster here who thought I was talking to them when I posted
That was my suggestion to the OP as to how to handle the overbearing, nagging parents :)</p>
<p>My guess is Poland or Polish who has lived in the UK - economic mercenaries.</p>
<p>Don’t buy noise-canceling headphones, that’ll be seen as rude. Just remember, every time you get annoyed “I’ll be gone in a year”, no matter where you go. All you can do is make the best of your situation. If you’re not happy in college, try and transfer out, or go to that dream name-brand school for grad school.</p>
<p>My European living experience includes both Northern and Southern… Thanks to my looks I am rarely identified as either (think Frank Zappa). </p>
<p>Trying to understand the immigrant experience without being one of us is difficult. Some people spend 30 years and don’t adapt. Other people spend 30 weeks and adapt. The high achiever economic mercenary types often feel resentment for their home country (“look at me, I got a PhD in Organic Chemistry from Elbonia State University and a lot of good that did to me, I had to work for the National Chewing Gum Company for 20 years before I was given an exit visa”) and vow never to have to go thru this again. </p>
<p>But then, no two immigrant experiences are alike. Had we stayed back home, life would have been scripted better than a Kardashian wedding based on a lot of cultural or economic or social factors, leaving us with few options. </p>
<p>It is ironic that people spend all the effort pursuing ‘options’ and then effectively throw them away by focusing on a single goal for themselves and their children, with anything other than this one goal being considered a failure.</p>
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The post was said in jest, waiting for ivy. That said, what the parents are doing to this poor kid is, IMO, more rude.</p>
<p>There have been several posters who have posted threads that their parents would refuse to pay for certain schools, so they felt forced to drop very good schools that they wanted to attend from their list. And ,if a student wanted to transfer out, their parents would essentially blackmail them, and refuse to pay for the new school. This is not “rude”?</p>
<p>@jym626: It’s not rude. It depends on the reason the kids choose to attend a certain school. I told my kids that we have very good state universities in Virginia, they are spending my hard earned money, and they need to justify why they need to attend out of state, including Ivies. (Personally, I do not feel the Ivies is worth the money for undergraduate but willing to pay for graduate school). S1 liked UCSD and Michingan, but not for $30K more a year. He went ED in-state. </p>
<p>Some parents may feel they are will to pay for Ivy but not XYZ, that’s personal. Just like someone maybe willing for $40k-$50k for a Mercedes but not for a Lexus even though the Lexus may be as good as the Mercedes.</p>
<p>Late to the party but Quantmech, I really enjoyed your posts above.</p>
<p>parents are expected to pay for the kid’s education. I don’t see that entitles the kid to a specific level of school. </p>
<p>One can get an education for 50-100k in a state school or 250k in a private school. It is entirely upto the parents which size tab they want to pick up and whether they want to attach certain conditions to it.</p>
<p>dav-
the issue the poster I referenced was the opposite of what you are describing. The student might have preferred an instate or less expensive school the parents said they would only pay for a top 20. That is silly, IMO. I only used the word “rude” because it was the word the previous poster chose. It is overbearing, IMO.</p>
<p>texaspg- I agree that if the parents do help fund school ( I agree, I see it as my responsibility, but many other parents do not) they can and should be up front with what their budget it. What they should not do is say “I will pay for x top 20 school buy not Y top 50 or LAC.”</p>