<p>Hi Dean J:</p>
<p>I went to the UVA blog site, only it doesn't seem possible to leave an email that way for the time being.</p>
<p>CAn a parent make the phone call to inquire about the outcome, or must a student make that call? </p>
<p>Thanks.</p>
<p>They encourage students to make such a call.</p>
<p>Are you asking if we will give a parent a decision over the phone or if we will answer your questions about your decision?</p>
<p>We will chat about decisions generally with a counselor, parent or student. Shoe is right, though…students should be able to make those calls (though most came in two weeks ago, right after decisions were released). Most calls these days are asking about how the waitlist works and the info we give is pretty much covered by the FAQs that were mailed.</p>
<p>Dean J-
We had not seen your reply to the post at the link below; it was question #21.
Thanks</p>
<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/university-virginia/677795-minorities-admission-2.html#post1062149747[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/university-virginia/677795-minorities-admission-2.html#post1062149747</a></p>
<p>Seriously, what are you trying to accomplish here??</p>
<p>jumpseat, you’re trying to force an admissions counselor to deduct superiority of one race to another? Are you kidding me?</p>
<p>Jump, I’m not sure where you’re going, but it sounds like you might be interested in [this</a> event being sponsored by the Miller Center on Thursday](<a href=“http://www.dchoos.org/events/social/2009/04/16/index.php]this”>http://www.dchoos.org/events/social/2009/04/16/index.php). Some from our office were hoping to head up for the debate, but unfortunately, we have DOTL the next day.</p>
<p>Thanks Dean J; would love to attend, but says it’s sold out; obviously a very hot topic, that needs revisiting.</p>
<p>Barboza…not sure how to read your post, if it’s sarcastic or not. But my answer is nothing about any race being ‘superior’; simply wanting race not to even enter into the acceptance equation at all. The stats clearly show far more blacks get accepted into UVA. Why is that? Skin color does not add diversity, unless for the sake of a photograph; socio-economics ‘might’. Being black, white, brown, red, or yellow skinned doesn’t automatically correlate to a difference in thought, background, etc. </p>
<p>Many well-deserving non-black applicants are denied admission to UVA in favor of black applicants with lesser qualifications. Can anyone justify that??</p>
<p>(And that is NOT a slap to blacks. Just asking for color-blindness)</p>
<p>I agree with jumpseat and he has a valid point. Now, if his questions are answered or not, that is up to Dean J to decide if his questions are worth answering or ignoring. There’s nothing disrespectful in being curious and in wanting to know…so for someone to ask him “where are you trying to get at?”…Dang, he just wants an answer…there’s nothing wrong with that.</p>
<p>The problem is that there is no answer. No one from admissions will ever say flat out “we give preference” and no one will ever accept a different answer because someone always feels like they’re getting screwed. This topic is always brought up, and a few of us would like the dead horse to be left alone.</p>
<p>The Miller Center webcasts all of their debates.</p>
<p>In just 22 posts, jump has become a bit of an Affirmative Action ■■■■■. I’ve responded to him before and have no interest in having this discussion yet again.</p>
<p>“Many well-deserving non-black applicants are denied admission to UVA in favor of black applicants with lesser qualifications. Can anyone justify that??" - Jump seat</p>
<p>Is this your personal assumption? Please give me a valid reason why you assume black students who are admitted are less qualified than whites. Before you scramble for scraps of information, be sure to have more backing that mere SAT and GPA statistics, for the University selects students using a much more holistic approach. </p>
<p>To answer your question, no one can justify the admissions of unqualified students. But how do we determine if a student is unqualified or qualified? How do we determine which students are most qualified? Is it the SAT score? The GPA? The Class rank, the racial status, or the alumni relationship? Please, present to me a clear layout of what determines an applicants overall quality. Not only will you gain my respect, you will likely garner nation wide praise and thanks for answering such an important question. </p>
<p>Next, to help you understand Affirmative Action at the University, I thought it would be nice if you would be willing to read a few passages from the president of the University that we all love and care for. In a written address to the public, he said:</p>
<p>" I believe in opening opportunities to students of diverse backgrounds-- perhaps especially those whom Virginia excluded by law for more than 125 years."</p>
<p>He goes on to say:</p>
<p>"Alongside other Virginia colleges and universities, we have worked over the years to remedy the brutal and specific costs of Virginia’s history of racial segregation and especially the costs of Virginia’s massive resistance to U.S law. Much of today’s problem derives from Virginia’s refusal to desegregate its schools under orders of the U.S Supreme Court and its decision instead to seize and close local schools to keep black students out of the classroom.”</p>
<p>Clearly he finds it necessary to admit African American students for reasons that should be clear to you. I do not feel the need to elaborate. I think it clear that he wants to admit qualified minorities. </p>
<p>Before I continue with the words of the president, For a moment, I would just like to say a few thing. You seem to be quite bitter. You present to me a cruel and unjustified tone of bitterness and hate. Every day, I spend my time thanking God that I am different than people like you. I realize the importance of the Universities mission- to heal the wounds that burden the commonwealth. You feel the need to say cruel things, such as blacks are not qualified, to boost your own ego and somehow soothe the pain caused by your own short comings. I will pray for you. Yes, I am an African American and I was admitted to the University of Virginia. By no means am I unqualified, nor are my black peers who will join me as members of the class of 2013. Sure, my SAT scores may not be in the 99th percentile, but I have worked hard over my high school career and I have excelled. Take the time to see me as a person rather than the numbers that seem to consume your every thought. Sorry that I am not the cardboard figure that you idolize. I am simply human- a living, breathing entity with feelings , emotions, and other humanlike qualities. And for the record, my white peers are proud of me, as I am of them. We value the diversity that will enrich our school next year, and we thank the University for the valiant effort in recruiting and enrolling QUALIFIED students of all races. </p>
<p>Back to the wise words of Casteen. The president concludes by saying:</p>
<p>“ This is a debate (Affirmative Action) about what we are as a community and what we will be, about how we fulfill the most idealistic and most essential mission in all of the American education. It deserves to be conducted in the open, with dignity and decency, and with determination. It cannot be conducted by means of personal attacks or by means of casual generalizations that dehumanize others. And it deserves to be driven by compassion, by awareness of moral responsibility, and by optimism about the young.” </p>
<p>Please take the time to read this carefully before you respond with words that are hurtful and demeaning… Remember that words are hurtful. </p>
<p>Though your words may hurt me, you cannot stop me. Though you may demean me, you cannot kill the character that thrives in my heart and soul. Though you want to kill my spirit, I will still thrive with pride, determination, and resilience. Only God has the ability to stop me. With the help of him, I will enroll at the University in the fall, succeed there, and graduate. As will my black peers, who graduate at a rate higher than any other group of black students out of all of the nations public universities. </p>
<p>Have a blessed evening.</p>
<p>well said jlb2820</p>
<p>jlb2820–that was inspiring. </p>
<p>And incredibly well written. </p>
<p>WELCOME to UVa. You will do something special there–I am sure of that.</p>
<p>I completely agree with JLB and am a minority myself, but I think the issue needs serious reconsideration. There need to be clear rules and regulations for affirmative action, which certainly isn’t the status-quo.</p>
<p>Ahmed - there are never going to be clear rules and regulations, because then they would be more subject to court challenge and would likely lose. Some fuzziness and some behind-the-scenes assessments are the way to go. I wouldn’t expect UVA to be completely open about how much legacy counts, how much certain factors are weighed if you have a mixed record, when connections play a part, and so on. I am baffled by some people who get into elite schools and by some people who get excluded. And so it will be.</p>
<p>jlb2820-
First of all, congrats on getting admitted. As a young freshman, however, you need to improve your reading comprehension. The post obviously hit a nerve, and you read wayyyyy more into it than what was there, jumping to conclusions and reading into it what was not there. You’re not very objective. If you read it accurately, you would not be hurt, which was not my intention. My post said nothing nothing nothing that was derogatory toward blacks, but you somehow read that into it. See the reply by wahoomb; he/she was right on the money>> that I’m ASKING a question. (Dean J obviously chooses not to step up and handle ‘difficult questions’; so be it. Basically saying, “…you’ve asked before, and I ignored you, so therefore I’m not going to answer this”. Nice job.)</p>
<p>I DID NOT write/assume that black students who are admitted are less qualified than whites, as you say. (If I did, please tell me where)</p>
<p>I DID write “The stats clearly show far more blacks get accepted into UVA”; and I need to amend that: a higher percentage of black students get accepted into UVA, than any other race. If you want proof, see this link from UVA:</p>
<p>IAS Historical Data: First-Time First-Year Applicants by Race</p>
<p>[IAS</a> Historical Data: First-Time First-Year Applicants by Race](<a href=“http://www.web.virginia.edu/IAAS/data_catalog/institutional/historical/admission/first_by_race.htm]IAS”>http://www.web.virginia.edu/IAAS/data_catalog/institutional/historical/admission/first_by_race.htm)</p>
<p>So again, I’m asking a question, based on factual data. And an answer from UVA would be nice. Typically around 50% of blacks are admitted, by far the highest %; the total acceptance rate is around 35/36%. I’m not saying this is right or wrong.</p>
<p>However, that begs the obvious questions below:</p>
<p>-Are black applicants to UVA applying with a set of credentials, test scores, and high school accomplishments that not only meet UVA’s tough guidelines, but also are far superior to every other racial class?</p>
<p>OR</p>
<p>-Does UVA use 2 sets of criteria and significantly lowers the bar for certain black applicants in order to admit a far greater % (50% vs 36%) and admits certain black applicants whose set of credentials, test scores, and high school accomplishments are inferior to all other applicant races?</p>
<p>It’s a fair question, I don’t know why people are getting so worked up here. Jumpseat–I doubt your question will be answered in the manner in which you want it to be answered, no Admissions Dean would flat out answer it in a message board even if s/he knew the answer, but at least you put it out there. Now, people, please don’t pretend you haven’t thought about this before, because most people at UVA have. </p>
<p>PS: I’m a minority by the way and while at UVA I used to hear people say that latinos got the same boost (whatever that may be) that African American students did…this could not further from truth (look at the admissions rate for Hispanic transfer students in the same data page that Jumpseat has provided)</p>
<p>Jump-“Skin color does not add diversity, unless for the sake of a photograph; socio-economics ‘might’. Being black, white, brown, red, or yellow skinned doesn’t automatically correlate to a difference in thought, background, etc.”</p>
<p>I understand what you’re asking, Jump, and I think it is a valid question and one that you will never have answered by the UVA administration (and trust me, they use a separate set of credentials for better or worse. I am NOT saying this inherently means that these students are unqualified because they are all qualified or they wouldn’t have been admitted); HOWEVER, I don’t understand how you can make the above claim.</p>
<p>Your race/ethnicity is a crucial part of your social identity and one that changes both how you perceive the world and how you are perceived by others, which I believe is the very definition of diversity of thought. I don’t know what ethnicity you are and don’t presume to know. Just think though if you were latino instead of white, or if you were white instead of being black-This would significantly alter how people treat you and ultimately instill a different belief system. I am not condemning affirmative action or supporting it, I am just saying there are multiple variables that contribute to how you make decisions in life that include race, geography origin, sexual orientation, and socio-economic status as well as others like if you come from a military family, if you have red hair, if you’re 7 feet tall, etc.</p>
<p>“Your race/ethnicity is a crucial part of your social identity and one that changes both how you perceive the world and how you are perceived by others, which I believe is the very definition of diversity of thought.”</p>
<p>Couldn’t agree more.</p>