<p>My son has two scholarship offers. Both from Public Universities and both with top 20 "rankings" (whatever those are worth...) in the major he has been accepted in. </p>
<p>School #1 is a very well known public University which is two hours from home. The $10K per year scholarship will leave us with about $10K to cover this year; totally doable. Next year, when our daughter graduates, we expect the out of pocket to rise to about $18K. Son would have to take out loans and contribute via work to the additional $8K for the next three years (assuming he gets through in four years...). Total debt would be about $20K.</p>
<p>School #2 has a very good department but is out of state, though only a 10 hour drive away (or a quick hour and a half flight). Not nearly as prestigious as School #1 but a very good school indeed. Full OOS tuition scholarship, guaranteed over four years, which would leave a bill of about $10K (much cheaper housing) for us. Note, Parent like this one :). Stats show that getting out in four is very likely.</p>
<p>So, while our son was willing to move all the way across the country for his well known "reach" school, we feel the allure of the name brand public schools, fairly close to home, has him hooked. As with most kids, no concept of what a $20K loan looks like or, for that matter, what rent, water and power, insurance, etc.. costs after he graduates.</p>
<p>FYI, going to visit School #2 next week but feel he has made up his mind without really understanding what "debt" is. While a difficult assignment, how do we convince him to understand that debt is really not a good thing (even though the college community has made it the new norm...)?</p>
<p>Are there GPA requirements to maintain his scholarship at school 2? Is there any info on percentage of students who keep the scholarship for all four years?</p>
<p>A full OOS tuition package for four years needs to be compared with the costs at the other university that are likely to increase year over year. Our state’s flagship is projecting an 8% increase this year, on top of some hefty increases in the prior couple of years.</p>
<p>Good questions. For school #2 it will be necessary to maintain a 3.6 GPA in a tough discipline. That being said, according to the school, the average GPA for all in that department is 3.6. So, with a full tuition scholarship you would think my son, who is very driven and has great time management skills, would fall above the average (we hope…).</p>
<p>School #1 seemingly has more difficult grading policy whereby achieving a 3.0 in the department is considered doing well. Too keep the scholarship one must stay in “good standing” without any particular GPA.</p>
<p>Arabrab, now you’re talking like a parent :). I fully realize that, but my son is, well, a child…17 years old and ready to get his college career started with little concern for the ramifications of that debt hanging over his head.</p>
<p>I should note that School #1 probably has more opportunities in his field as far as geography is concerned and he would probably want to move back here anyway if he ended up at #2. Way too much to think about at 17…</p>
<p>UCB, after receiving the offer I was a bit concerned but knowing that the “average” GPA in the major is 3.6, I have no worries with regards to my son achieving that (not solely based on faith, but understanding that the competition is far less at that school versus #1, which is somewhat cut throat in nature according to some).</p>
<p>Break down what HIS monthly loan payment will be after graduation for each school. Remind him that for someone just starting out with a lot of debt, something like buying a car will be very difficult.</p>
<p>While his friends are buying clunkers, he can afford a fairly new or new car after graduation.</p>
<p>He won’t have to postpone vacations until his debt is paid off.</p>
<p>Try to think about what a young man will want at that age, what he will be able to have if he is largely debt free VS what he will have to sacrifice if he has large debt.</p>
<p>Our son has gotten some very nice scholarships that would still leave him and us with lots of debt. Thankfully, he understands that his full ride (tuition, room, board, and books) at U Buffalo, is an amazing gift and hasn’t thought for a moment to turn it down.</p>
<p>$20k is really not that bad. Get a job throughout the year and summer and he could easily cut that down. He should definitely be able to earn more than 4k.</p>
<p>Be careful with this. Is it average GPA among those graduating seniors in the major, or of frosh in the major? Senior GPAs tend to be higher due to the worst students having dropped out, and the seniors taking mostly courses in their major of interest, rather than prerequisite courses that they may be less interested in. Also, if the major is known as a particularly tough one that students tend to transfer out from, it may be that the frosh GPAs are considerably lower, since they include those who get “weeded out” by tough intro courses.</p>
<p>Oraco, my son had that same feeling before school #1 came in with the “unexpected” $10K per year scholarship which made it somewhat doable. I know in his head that he worked his rear off in HS, will be the Valedictorian, and was known on campus as the smartest kid, and now he wants to prove it by going to School #1 (that is, unless he gets accepted to his 2nd reach, Stanford, then the merry go round has another horse…).</p>
<p>While many people have much larger loans for college, 20K is stilla lot of money for a young person starting out. Besides house and cars, I’ve never had that much debt and would be a bit panicked if I did. I know, it’s the American way.</p>
<p>Here’s a calculator. On a standard plan, it’s $230/month (without accumulated interest). I still think that could be cut quite a bit with a job though.</p>
<p>I’d be very leery of a 3.6 GPA requirement. It’s one bad class away, one prof who hates you and is unreasonable (happens) away from disaster, imho.</p>
<p>That said, if you are determined to go this route, you should call the school and find out how many start with this major and how many finish with this major. If they will tell you.</p>
<p>then, take him to see your accountant and have your accountant explain what debt is and what he will forego… but only if you are sure with the GPA.</p>
<p>UCB, thanks for the heads up. We’ll be visiting #2 next week and I will pose that question face to face. That being said, you have to post a 3.35 in the first 1.5 years to be admitted into the major officially at school #2. So, with my menial math skills, that seems to mean that the average after at least two years is probably around 3.6 (am I figuring that correctly…math is my sons best subject but he didn’t inherit that gene from me…)</p>
<p>Sorry didn’t see the GPA requirement. That would make me very nervous. I’m graduating with over a 3.8 GPA but my first semester GPA was just BARELY a 3.6 and I was in pretty easy classes. But, when family tragedies happen, grades take a backseat. It’s terrible to think about but it’s a very real possibility. 3.6 is quite a high bar and would really assume a smooth ride throughout college.</p>
<p>And there is something to say for cost savings on travel (10 hours vs 2 hours can easily add up).</p>
<p>Roman, good thought except he wants to pursue at least a masters if not a PHD so not sure $20K of undergraduate debt is a good plan.</p>
<p>Poet, that much math I do know which is why I was very leery of the offer; particularly since it applies across the board regardless of the major (doesn’t seem quite fair to me if Major A’s average GPA upon graduation is 3.8 and Major B’s is 3.2)</p>
<p>Oraco, the “American way”, as you so eloquently put it, is a terrible new “norm”. Debt sucks! Of course, if kids just watch what our government is doing, why should they think any differently about debt?</p>
<p>I’ll add another consideration- Are there paid internships available near either school? Is there a geographical advantage for his major? I agree with the others who say that he could easily make $5000/year if he works full time during the summers and part time during school. That’s less than 700 hours a year at minimum wage. That’s less than 13 hours a week year round.</p>