Decision help: Oxford or Columbia?

<p>this thread is pathetic haha</p>

<p>Lost4ever, which high school did you go outside of the States?</p>

<p>The OP is perfectly within his/her rights to decline an ED offer in favour of Oxford (or any foreign university). There’s nothing Columbia can do about it, and Oxford won’t care. Treating ED as some kind of holy oath made to god is foolish, you shouldn’t be made to feel obliged to attend a school that you’re having doubts about - I really hope the posters in this thread haven’t caused the OP to make a huge mistake.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>the idea of ED is that it is binding. that is, if you apply ED you are expected to have fully considered your options, and be absolutely committed to attending columbia if accepted. theoretically, you must attend. </p>

<p>

</p>

<p>nope, a signed oath made to columbia. </p>

<p>

</p>

<p>if you signed an ED agreement, yes, you should. while i am totally unfamiliar with the procedure if an applicant inexplicably backs out of an ED commitment (i.e. without compelling financial justification), i can’t imagine it’s very nice or totally apathetic on columbia’s part. as a deferred ED applicant, i’m frankly kind of offended by your attempt to diminish the value of an ED application. what it says is that the applicant truly wants to attend columbia, literally more than any other college in the world. treating it like some informal, non-binding, what-the-hell-i’ll-just-throw-an-app-out-there-even-though-i-don’t-know-i’d-want-to-attend-if-i-got-into-oxford thing is precisely what columbia doesn’t want. it would open the system up to frequent abuse and effectively render it meaningless.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>ED is not completely binding because it doesn’t apply to international universities. They do NOT care at all whether a student has promised to attend an American college.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>That’s as may be, but it’s irrelevant for reasons given above.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>I really don’t care if you’re offended to be totally honest. I’ve made no attempt to diminish ED in the US, all I’ve said is that it’s irrelevant and of no importance to Oxford (or any other non-American university) whether one of their students promised to attend an American college. It’s unfortunate if an ED student changes his or her mind and opts to study abroad, but it’s hardly morally repugnant. People are allowed to change their mind, and thankfully Oxford don’t punish you for doing so.</p>

<p>yeah, I wouldn’t worry about morals, but I’ll say that Columbia beats Oxford in terms of the education and opportunities you receive. Oxford is completely overrated because it’s old and part of an imperialist country. Columbia is doing more ground breaking research, has a larger endowment, caters to a more diverse population and importantly has a better education model which allows you to explore and experience different areas as an undergrad.</p>

<p>The classes are small at columbia, the kids definitely match those at oxford and the jobs are better and grad school placement is imo better. The U.K. simply doesn’t have universities which match the US’s best anymore. Oxford and Cambridge have world class prestige, competitive students and little else.</p>

<p>I would take Oxford over the UVa (for example), but not over Columbia, Stanford, Penn, Yale etc.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>Oxford’s age has very little to do with its prestige. Lots of universities in the UK are old, but few enjoy the reputation Oxbridge does. The UK isn’t an imperialist country; you do know its 2011 right?</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>Do you have any proof to back these statements up with? I doubt it.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>That’s subjective. The US style of higher education wouldn’t suit me at all.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>Classes are very small at Oxford.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>Yes it does.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>my point wasn’t about how international universities treat ED. it’s about how columbia treats it, and columbia doesn’t consider ED any less binding for international students, even if it is effectively powerless to stop them from attending an international university. i consider it unethical for an international student to abuse the ED system simply because most international universities don’t care about it. </p>

<p>

</p>

<p>i don’t quite understand how it’s completely moral to back out of a signed supposedly-binding agreement. and you seem to have missed my point, which is that people are theoretically not allowed to change their minds under the ED system. that’s why it’s called binding. </p>

<p>

</p>

<p>oxford is the second oldest university in the world, and the oldest in the UK. its reputation and prestige are inextricably related to its age. not to say that it’s not a fantastic university, simply that much of this is because it’s so old.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>Only 1 Oxford graduate entered Yale Law, and 22 Columbia graduates entered Yale Law.
[Yale</a> University Bulletin | Yale Law School 2010?2011 | Law School Students](<a href=“Welcome | Office of the University Printer”>Welcome | Office of the University Printer)</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>Columbia is <em>just</em> a university, it’s feeling won’t be hurt if one of their ED applicants ultimately goes somewhere else. Not every promise has to be kept, especially trivial ones like these.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>But what you, or anybody else thinks is irrelevant. The decision ultimately belongs to the applicant.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>Why have you tuned this into a morality debate? This isn’t about morals; it’s about someone making a choice they feel is best for them. Welcome to the real world, people change their minds sometimes and you need to respect that.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>Actually Oxford isn’t the second oldest university in the world, the Sorbonne is I think. I’m not saying age plays no part at all, but it certainly is not pivotal to Oxford’s prestige.</p>

<p>Dionysus…whoa there do you have any ____ing idea what youre talking about?</p>

<p>(maybe because ur from London) your disposition for carefree violation of the Early Decision agreement is pretty sickening. I’m not here to bash anyone out, but have you ever seen the ED contract? It explicitly states that the student is obliged to attend. </p>

<p>If you are able to violate a contract like the ED agreement, what’s the point of any other contracts made in society? what is the point of a housing contract, leasing contract, ANY other type of contract? I thought you were joking when I read your first post and saw that you advocated just waving your hands as if you never signed the contract. </p>

<p>Its not about how good oxford of Columbia is. Columbia could be a community college for all I care, but once you sign that contract, you shouldn’t be able to violate it without some type of punishment. </p>

<p>Wow Dionysus, wow, just ■■■■</p>

<p>axelnofz, bro, why are you wasting your time writing all that on a low life like dionysus? Not worth it man.</p>

<p>I don’t give a damn what it says, it is IRRELEVANT if they can’t enforce it, which they can’t if the student in question opts to go abroad. Call me crazy, but I’d rather a student be happy and break ED than grudgingly attend and take the place of someone who really wants to go there.</p>

<p>If only more Americans respected international law as much as they do ED perhaps the world would be a better place.</p>

<p>If finances ARE an issue and Oxford is offering you more $ than Columbia, you can justify breaking the ED agreement.</p>

<p>“I don’t give a damn what it says, it is IRRELEVANT if they can’t enforce it”</p>

<p>You sound like a wonderful and entirely trustworthy person.</p>

<p>^ haha, pwoods, ur being too nice to dionysus.</p>

<p>haha dionysus, once again I have to ask you, do you have any f___ing idea what yourre talking about? usually I would respond with a few opinions and debate the points people make that I don’t agree with, but your ideas are so juvenile that I really can’t say much. I guess everyone whose reading your posts can judge on their own. Maybe its just me, but I can’t fathom in anyway way why anyone would advocate breaking the ED contract carefreely. </p>

<p>“If only more Americans respected international law as much as they do ED perhaps the world would be a better place.”</p>

<p>-low life comment. Way to throw in that last line there huh? I’m sure everyone can bring up a few comments on you brits, but don’t.</p>

<p>Your sad, man, and I truly, legitimatly, feel sorry for you. Please stop posting.</p>

<p>haha yeah i mean, i hate to join in on a pointless argument and make a useless comment like the following, but: a british person dumping on the US for not making the world a better place… hahahahaha classic. england f***ed up the world and lesser countries beyond belief for hundreds of years… just sayin’ lmao.</p>

<p>but seriously, yes, the ED contract is a contract that shoouldn’t be breached. however, if you cite legitimate financial reasons for attending oxford over columbia, then it’s all good. anyhow, the deadline for enrolling at columbia as an ED acceptee has already passed so there’s no point in keeping this thread alive lol</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>It’s very easy to question a persons intelligence rather than engage in reasoned debate, I only hope you don’t make a habit of it. To answer your question, yes I believe I know enough about ED; and perhaps more than most considering the amount of false information in this thread.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>I (foolishly it seems) presumed posters would recognise a tongue-in-cheek quip when they saw one.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>Really? :eek:</p>

<p>dionysus, the idea that you keep missing is that the idea of someone making a decision is irrelevant for someone who’s been accepted ED. he/she’s already made their decision. that’s the whole point of ED. if an international student is indecisive, they shouldn’t apply ED, even if they could escape the contract without penalties. it’s not ‘can’ one do this. it’s ‘does one have some form of ethics’. and columbia does care about one person breaking the contract (which is definitely not trivial), because if they allow one person to do it, it renders ED totally meaningless for everybody. honestly, i’m too tired to keep arguing with someone as stubbornly ignorant as you. you completely miss the point.</p>

<p>Folks, don’t listen to Dionysus. Maintain your integrity. Integrity is the result of what you choose to do (or choose not to do) when you know no one is watching or when you know you won’t get caught…but you want to be able to look at yourself in the mirror afterward. Why Dionysus believes that Oxford’s viewpoint is relevant when analyzing a contract between an applicant and Columbia is mind-boggling.</p>

<p>Folks, don’t let anyone tell you to whom to listen; form your own opinion, don’t let anyone tell you what to think. Why anyone thinks their opinion is right is astounding.</p>