First, thanks to all who have posted in this forum. I have learned a lot from you. As seems to be the case with many here, this process has taken over our lives for the past year, and now it has come down to the wire, and my D is struggling to make a final decision. I just want her to be happy and challenged in a good way, and get the training and support she needs. Last summer, she did the pre college program at UArts and loved it - she learned a lot and met wonderful people, and was accepted to the MT program without having to audition. Meanwhile, she applied to 10 other schools, and was admitted to Emerson (BFA Theater and Performance), Point Park MT, Otterbein BFA acting, the New School, Pace (BA acting International Performance Ensemble), and was waitlisted at NYU Tisch. She opted not to audition at Marymount and SUNY New Paltz. She really liked Emerson, but sadly it is out financially, as is Point Park and New School (although Point Park is reconsidering their offer, I doubt it will change enough). Otterbein is not a good fit for her because of the location and less diversity among the students.
At this point, she changes her mind every day, or even every hour, between UArts and Pace, and other days she says she doesn’t like either of them. We have heard a lot of positive things about UArts (thanks @myloves ), and I would be pleased to have her close to home (we live in the Phila area). On the other hand, she has been hearing some negative buzz from people at a Phila theater where she is currently doing an internship as part of her senior year of high school, and is saying it has a bad reputation.
We had a very good impression of Pace, and she likes the idea of living in NYC (and so far, they have given us the best financial aid package!) My concern there is that the BA acting program is more narrow, and she won’t have the opportunity to take voice and dance, and we might have to pay for private voice lessons.
We are attending an accepted student’s program at Pace this weekend, and she is doing an overnight there for the Performing arts students, and then she has arranged to visit classes at UArts on Monday. I hope that these visits will make her choice clear.
I welcome any advice or input! Thanks.
In my opinion, I would worry less about what other people are saying about a school or its reputation. Instead, I see a big difference in these two options in terms of the degree, focus, and curriculum. One is a BFA in MT and one is a BA in Acting / International Performance Ensemble at a school that also has a BFA in MT and a BFA in Acting. Which curriculum appeals to your daughter and is more suited to what your D is seeking? Another thing is that your D already loved the program this past summer at UArts and says she learned a lot and so in some ways, it sounds like it could be a very good fit. Nothing wrong with the Pace option, but the programs she is admitted to are quite different in curriculum and focus.
We know a UARTS MT grad and a dance grad,both loved their experience and have both been working on tours. Aside from local and money, curriculum should really help her decide. Look closely at both curriculum and ask lots of questions. Best of Luck!!! And I agree with everything soozievt said:)
@soozievt , your points are all well taken, and I agree with you. They are two very different programs, and this fact is emblematic of my D’s struggle with what she really wants in a program. Until very recently, she was totally invested in MT but she has been introduced to more experimental theater and that appeals to her, and causes her to question her direction. Having said that, I think she really was hoping to be accepted into the MT or BFA acting at Pace, and I fear that she would feel that she was missing out with the BA program. As for the reputation thing, we have talked about how subjective this is, yet she is an impressionable 18 year old.
Based on post #3, it seems like PART of the reason your D might like Pace is due to her having desired to go there for one of their BFA programs. But she should think long and hard that while it is still Pace, she is admitted to a different program there (albeit a fine one). So, it is not simply the same as what she was thinking of when she applied there.
In terms of experimental theater, she should examine (by talking to current students and faculty), opportunities at both schools to be involved in experimental theater, original works, and student-created theater. See what those opportunities may be at each place.
While your D may be an impressionable 18 year old, you may want to discuss certain people’s biases when they say a school has a bad reputation. Talk to MANY people to get such feedback. When my D visited one of the tippy top MT programs (one she truly liked), one thing that wasn’t cool was that the students there who she spent a great deal of time with on two visits, put down NYU/Tisch to her when they heard it was a top choice of hers and she also was applying there. They were telling her not to apply, etc. Well, my D LOVED Tisch. It was a great program for her. She has done well since graduating, as have a large number of her peers there, some at the highest levels of the field. She has never run into her program having a “bad reputation” while in her professional career. Glad she didn’t listen to the kids at the other school (and my D could have been impressionable since she was 15 on one visit and 16 at her audition on campus).
I agree with everything Soozie said. And UArts seems to love her, a great way to start. The Pace BA programs do not have the reputations of the BFA programs. And yes, living and taking other kinds of lessons and dance classes in NYC will be very expensive. Maybe this is my bias because I loved UArts when we visited, but I think she’d have more opportunities in the “top” BFA program at Arts than a non-BFA at Pace, unless she examines Pace’s curriculum and she really is excited about that particular focus.
That is my feeling too @Calliene. I think UArts probably has everything she wants and needs, and that she would find the best home there. She just needs to get past the feeling that she is somehow settling for a “less prestigious” school, after being accepted into more “selective” programs. She is generally down to earth and quite humble, so I am hopeful that she will get there!
And thanks @soozievt for sharing your D’s experience with people bad mouthing NYU. In our case, the put downs are coming from her drama teacher at high school, himself a graduate of UArts more than 25 years ago, and some Phila people on staff at a theater down the block from UArts, who are telling her that most of their actors come from New York, not Phila. Meanwhile, she has heard about and experienced what a great theatre community Phila has.
It helps for me to have a sounding board, so thanks!
UArts does loads of experimental theater!
This is a funny statement to me. Yes, their professional actors may come from NYC. No surprise there. But those actors trained at a myriad of programs in the US. They didn’t necessarily go to college in NYC! When your D graduates UArts (if she were to attend), she too may land in NYC to live. She may audition for a Philadelphia theater while in NYC where many auditions are held even for out of state theaters. Then, when that Philly theater casts her, they can say she came from NYC! 
PS…I don’t think Pace is more prestigious than UArts. My kid applied to neither but I know kids who have attended both. I grew up near Philly myself.
You know UArts will naturally get the nod from me ;), but I do think that either place could be good for your D depending on what she wants and if she can get exactly what she wants from Pace’s BA program.
I think both schools have about the same acceptance rate (around 8%) for their MT BFA programs; I’m not sure about that for Pace, since my D didn’t apply there, but that’s going on hearsay. I don’t know how selective it is to get into their BA program. I do know that all of my D’s coaches (all very familiar with programs) are very enthusiastic about UArts, even encouraging my D to not let the fact that, last year, almost every person admitted decided to matriculate there because they were confident she’d receive the same quality training.
I’ll tell you this information not to brag at all, but to share about the opportunities I’ve witnessed with professionals (besides faculty members) at UArts: Many professionals were in the audience of The Material World (and the other recent Polyphone shows–which is all experimental theatre), including casting people, directors, professionals who originated roles in the play (people whose names you’d likely recognize), the professionals (playwrights, song writer, original director) who directed/music directed the show and brought their professional friends. These professionals, all known theatre people, came up and were completely enthusiastic and complimentary over the cast member’s performances. They actually sought out cast members and gushed over them. Anyway, the exposure this gave the cast is great, and I guess it’s not unusual for UArts. From that experience, too, my D got asked to participate in a show that will workshop in Philly and then for a weekend in NYC. It turns out that she’s not going to do it, but the exposure she and others have gotten with reputable professionals is evident.
UArts also brings alumni in to talk to current students. A few that they’ve brought in this year live and work in theatre in Philly, and are kept busy there, and, often, these people work in both Philly and NYC. In fact, my D has recently said that she may consider living in Philly post-graduation and working in both cities, which is quite different from her plan of only NYC, but that’s still a few years away, so we’ll see…
Something to keep in mind, also, is that programs often change a lot over the years. People who attended some programs even a few years ago may not get admitted now and/or perform the same post-grad, and vice versa. Some people’s perceptions of programs may be off. My D had to remember that when creating her audition list.
Ugh. I sound like I’m selling UArts–again. Sorry. I’m really not. I just am trying to paint a picture and give some facts and my perspective. Really, though, I’m all about fit for the student. UArts is not a fit for everyone; neither is Pace–even their BFA program. No program is. I have a feeling that your D will have a better idea of which she wants, if either, after visiting both, and, if she works hard and takes advantage of opportunities to the best of her ability, she’ll likely be fine at either!
@myloves , no need to apologize - it’s all good! The more informative reviews the better. And you are not the only person I know who feels very strongly about UArts. I regret not going to see the Polyphone shows - another theater mom said she saw A Chorus Line and really enjoyed it. We did go to see a very good play at the Wilma Theater recently that had several recent UArts graduates, including a young woman who was a teaching assistant in the summer program who is now my daughter’s friend. It was called An Octoroon, and was very innovative and the acting was top notch.
Sounds like a great experience and exposure for your D! I’m pretty sure there are a couple of student directed shows remaining this season that we can try to see.
@surrender my daughter also came down to deciding between a BFA in Acting and BFA in MT. One piece of advice that tipped her towards the MT program was having faculty invested in improving her voice and dance (not just acting) over four years. The alternative of private voice and dance is harder to manage with very little time. The more she looked at it the more she realized that she needed voice and dance to be part of her training.
@surrender I, too, would urge your D not to listen to the voices she’s hearing about UArts having a bad reputation. I have no idea why anyone would say that to a student who has applied and been accepted there. I know several grads of UArts and all truly enjoyed their time there, and felt that the training was very good. We had a dad who participated here for several years whose D attended UArts and also was happy there. He posted a lot of information about the program which you may want to search for, for a parent’s perspective, albeit a few years ago. His username is MichaelNKat. He was a generous contributor and I’m sure he’d be happy to correspond with you via PM if you want further information about after graduation experience. He also lives/works in Philly so is familiar with the theatre community there.
I agree with Susan that Pace is not more prestigious than UArts.
Good luck with the decision!
@surrender I’m a freshman MT at UArts and I can attest to the fact that we do a lot of experimental theatre, in class as well as within the official season. Alternative/experimental theatre is probably more available and prolific here than at most other BFA programs, especially for MT. Also, we got a theatre school head (she’s the one who directed An Octoroon!) two and a half years ago and the program has shifted a lot since. We even house the Pig Iron School’s MFA in Devised Performance. I wouldn’t rely on 25 year old information for any program. In the case of UArts, I wouldn’t even rely on 3 year old information. I don’t know anything about Pace so I can’t compare them, but it sounds to me like your daughter would fit in really well both in Philly and at UArts 
Thanks for taking the time to comment @MTVT2015 ! I feel like UArts has so many enthusiastic proponents, it must be an awesome place and community. My D is scheduled to observe some classes there tomorrow morning, so maybe you’ll run into her!
We spent Friday and Saturday at Pace, so now we have more information about that program too. I will write more later about that for anyone else who is interested.
@alwaysamom, thanks for your input! I did read Michaelnkat’s posts several months ago and he was extremely positive and forthcoming!
@surrender It seems like you and your D are doing your due diligence and that these visits and talking to many others will be beneficial.
@surrender I would love to hear about her experience at Pace. I asked my daughter who is a dance major there if she knew anyone in the International Theater Ensemble and she was like “are you kidding I have no idea what you’re talking about!”
@marg928, my daughter had a good experience at Pace, and is still considering enrolling in this program, but has not yet decided. We met the head of the program and several students who are passionate about it. The focus is on devising your own work as an ensemble with the guidance of a professional director who is brought in to work with the ensemble. This work is performed on theatre row in New York, and then taken abroad. It was difficult to get precise information about the actual travel component, but it takes place at the end of the sophomore year, and from what I could tell lasts for about 10 days and can involve multiple countries. The focus of the instruction while at Pace is also not limited to an American approach to acting, but includes techniques or styles used in Europe and Asia as well. It is hard for me to really capture the program in a few words, and the students seemed to be saying that they didn’t fully understand how it worked until they were in it, The major requires 40 some credits, fewer than a BFA, and students can take other courses in the school of performing arts to round out their curriculum, along with the liberal arts requirements. I found this video on You Tube which may give you an idea: https://youtu.be/zDw-MUTxxRc
Good luck!