<p>"Would she have had the same responses with a Dickinson degree ? Perhaps, but I don't think so."</p>
<p>What's the basis for this opinion? (I never considered either school particularly noteworthy in NYC - - and I see that SJChessMom is talking about a more "local" rep.)</p>
<p>^^^ yes, NYC, just my opinion. From the "little bit" of matriculation data I've looked at over the last few years, of private NJ schools and New England prep schools, and some top public high schools in NJ,, seems like more grads matriculate to Muhlenberg.</p>
<p>^^^</p>
<p>The only problem with a "local rep" is what happens if you don't want to spend your life in New Jersey? I was born and raised there and hated the place. Every state has some small private college with a "local rep" but those reps often don't mean beans in another part of the country. I've lived in 11 different states, in different regions of the country, and have experienced this reality. Ever hear of Gustavus Adolphus College? Well, it's maybe the Muhlenberg of Minnesota. Great local rep with the natives; doesn't mean anything out here on the East Coast. By the same token, apply for a job in Minneapolis with your Muhlenberg degree and you might hear "Mule What?"</p>
<p>So, if you head to Chicago or California after college, which school's degree is better? Dickinson or Muhlenberg? Dickinson is definitely ranked higher by 2009 USNWR and has slightly higher admission standards. I'm not favoring Dickinson, mind you, we visited both and liked the campus atmosphere better at Muhlenberg. But, objectively, for people who don't think New Jersey is paradise and want no part of living there, which school is better to have a degree from?</p>
<p>Having lived in many other places, I think too many people think very provincially. Sometimes people assume what's known locally must be known everywhere else. It's simply not true. If you go to college in PA and want a degree known nationally, the two most WIDELY KNOWN colleges with respected degrees are U of Penn and Penn State. My wife grew up in Minnesota and has a Master's degree but she never heard of Lehigh University, or any of the LACs except Bryn Mawr, until we moved to PA. I grew up in NJ and never heard of either Muhlenberg or Dickinson until my kids started applying for colleges.</p>
<p>I'd love to know others' opinions about which college's degree, Dickinson or Muhlenberg, is more marketable NATIONALLY.</p>
<p>^^^ and, you could add Lehigh and Bucknell, in that category, too :)
Will be interesting to see what the 'national' perspective is on all of these regional schools.</p>
<p>FYI- while my screen name is South JerseyCM, just want you to know I have lived in PA, Vermont, Maryland, two places in Utah (ever hear of Utah State University-picked up another degree there) and two places in Montana, Billings and Missoula.
Ever hear of University of Montana, in Missoula (took a class there, too)?</p>
<p>So I do completely understand your perspective Plainsman, and will be interesting to what the rest of the country thinks of these small LACs :)</p>
<p>
[quote]
I should have been clearer--- I was talking about the street cutting Dickinson College in half.....not CHEW!! LOL, enjoy Mexico!
[/quote]
</p>
<p>OK... I feel better now, that I didn't miss something. I know they're planning on renovation work to the student union area and right outside of it.</p>
<p>Mexico was nice, except for the part right now where we're stuck in the airport because our United flight has been delayed... 2 1/2 hours... ugh.</p>
<p>Howdy teriwtt, care to chime in on the national reputation of Muhlenberg (or lack of) as a 'berg parent from Chicago suburbs?
Read Plainsman's post 327.</p>
<p>I'm a Muhlenberg parent who has to drive through at least 5 states to get to Chew St. If national institutional reputation were a make-or-break factor in college decisions in our family, though, I would have discouraged my D from applying to Muhlenberg or Dickinson. For that matter, have I'd have been negative about Williams or Pomona, let alone Bowdoin, Carleton, or Grinnell. Differences in national reputation and name recognition between schools once you get to the level of Dickinson and Muhlenberg are truly negligible. LACs simply aren't widely known outside their regions and the circles from which they draw their students.</p>
<p>But I think that the type of education that a student gets at strong LACs more than makes up for having to explain what and where Muhlenberg or Dickinson are. Employers are aware of the kind of education that students get at colleges like Dickinson, Muhlenberg, Gettysburg, and Bucknell. Typically, around 95% + of grads from such schools are either employed or in graduate school within a year of gradation. The rate at Muhlenberg for 2006 grads was almost 98%:</p>
<p>How</a> Muhlenberg Measures Up</p>
<p>LAC grads start out making less money than those with professional-type degrees like engineering, but catch up, and more of them eventually wind up in leaderships positions in the long run. And, in world where everything is changing rapidly, a liberal arts education is the best long-term preparation I can imagine. </p>
<p>For our family, it was much more about the quality of education and type of experience a kid is going to have than about reputation. And I can comfort myself with the knowledge that there simply are not many grads from selective LACs sleeping in boxes.</p>
<p>Plainsman -- I think that "nationally" most people think U Penn and Penn State are the same school. This, of course, drives students and fans of the Philadelphia Ivy nuts.</p>
<p>As for Gustavus, I think you are absolutely on the mark calling it "the Muhlenberg of Minnesota." It is a fine LAC with an excellent reputation regionally, but like almost all LACs it has little name recognition outside that region. </p>
<p>As for which is more "marketable," a degree from Muhlenberg or Dickinson? I'd rate them as even overall. Certain degrees will carry marginally more weight from one school or the other. I' haven't met a HR officer yet who consulted US News & World Report when making hiring decisions.</p>
<p>southjerseychessmom and marathonman88: we only have to drive in Illinois, Indiana, Ohio, then Pennsylvania to get there, so not quite five states!</p>
<p>Frankly, we would have never heard about Muhlenberg if it hadn't been for CC. But that goes for 95% of LACs that aren't in the Midwest. And honestly, I'd never really heard of Beloit College (yes, whip me with a wet noodle) until my kids started the college search. For a couple of years, I had no idea what Beloit College was about, other than a town we'd pass through on the way up to Madison sometimes. </p>
<p>I think you're right about prospective employers knowing there are more LACs than just outside their region, and many of those LACs are just as good, and better than those in their regions. But I will take this one step further; D1 graduated from Syracuse's Newhouse last May. Yes, some employers in the Chicago area are aware of Syracuse and Newhouse, but with Northwestern here, those are the students/programs they know more about, despite the fact that Northwestern's program is nowhere near the caliber (really, Medill is a different kind of journalism program than Syracuse's) that someone wanting to go into PR might want to get. However, regional issues be that they are, D did not have as much luck with Syracuse networking here in the Chicago area, and chose to move out to Boston after a few months looking around here. Boston is an entirely different story.... they know Syracuse Newhouse grads, and at almost every interview D has had, there is already one or more Syracuse grads already employed at that company. So it's not just the small LACs, as I don't think anyone would describe Syracuse as a small LAC... yet it sort of suffers from the same 'regional' biases. </p>
<p>H graduated from two extremely large state U's (bachelor's and Ph.D.). When he is in a recruiting role (he works in large pharma), he has usually preferred to look to those schools to hire as he still has contacts with the faculty and knows the reputation of the department. That means he usually (but not always) passes over the major public U in our state for hiring. It's just easier to start the hiring process by talking with the faculty who my husband has had past experience with, in getting referrals for future hirees. Over the years, as he has gotten to know more people in the field (through conferences, etc.) at other universities, he uses that knowledge, too, and isn't as limited.</p>
<p>While all this is just anecdotal, it does point out that there is no one and clear pros and cons list of attending well-known schools, vs. small LACs.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Plainsman -- I think that "nationally" most people think U Penn and Penn State are the same school. This, of course, drives students and fans of the Philadelphia Ivy nuts.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Guilty as charged, until about five years ago.</p>
<p>^Good point teriwtt. There are definite institutional differences at the level of the individual department and discipline when it comes to being connected to the professional world.</p>
<p>Another difference between Dickinson and Muhlenberg is cost. In 2009-2010, Dickinson will cost over $4,500 more a year than Muhlenberg. Muhlenberg has been recognized by Kiplingers Magazine as on of the "best values" in higher education.</p>
<p>Great input Teriwtt, and interesting perspective regarding Syracuse, too. </p>
<p>Perhaps a significant difference between these very similar LAC's is their relationship with grad or med schools, and that would play an important role in deciding where to apply.</p>
<p>I know Muhlenberg has well respected med school program, perhaps Dickinson has stronger pre- law, especially with the Law School nearby?</p>
<p>anothermom-w-q: oops! That's what I meant. I meant Chew St. cuts Muhlenberg in half not Dickinson. </p>
<p>Terwitt, MarathonMan, HudsonValley, SJCM: Thanks all for your comments and opinions. I agree. It probably makes no difference which of the two LACs my D would graduate from. Dickinson is ranked higher according to USNWR. However, as one of you pointed out, employers don't check USNWR when they decide who to interview, and we really liked our visit to Muhlenberg more than to Dickinson. Muhlenberg has another huge advantage: The campus is 8 miles (if that) from our house. My D could come home any time she wanted, and we could drop by and visit any time. And if she makes friends who came from long distances away and can't return home very often, our house will always be open for weekend, non-alcoholic, non-smoking parties and sleepovers, I guess. One of my SUVs does haul 8 passengers. :)</p>