<p>
You do both. It’s not an either-or thing. You repeatedly take kids from Scarsdale because there are consistently a number of highly accomplished kids coming from there.</p>
<p>
It’s a 25% admit rate over the past 4 years according to the data published on the Boston Latin website at <a href=“http://www.bls.org/ftpimages/314/download/College%20Admission%20Decisions,%202010%20-%202013.pdf[/url]”>http://www.bls.org/ftpimages/314/download/College%20Admission%20Decisions,%202010%20-%202013.pdf</a> (excluding waitlisted). Yale, Princeton, and MIT are all in the same ballpark with an admit rate of 20% +/- 2%. However, the admit rate for Stanford is far behind at under 9%.</p>
<p>FYI- to attend Bostin Latin the student must be a resident of Boston proper … the burbs do not count (there are many ways around the residency requirement like renting an apartment in town and not living in it or a minimal amount).</p>
<p>More on Boston Latin …
I think this response undersold the level of hook of a lot of Boston Latin students. Killer academic backgrounds and stats … a lot of first generation college kids … a lot of of kids from lower SES families … a lot of ethnic diversity. One stop shopping to find relatively hard to find backgrounds of academic high achievers.</p>
<p>Yes, exactly. Which means that you may or may not admit (say) 5 kids from Scarsdale every year. Depends on the students and depends on the adcom and their specific goals for this year and depends on how many kids-from-upper-middle-class-areas versus kids-from-nowheresville they may have already reviewed by the time they are reviewing Scarsdale High. Which means … it becomes not-so-smart to assume that “your” high school will always “place” at the same level. </p>
<p>So back to Hat’s question about my S and his 18% chances – well, yes, his chances were boosted by being a legacy and going ED. But they were also “un-boosted” (if there is such a word) by being from the greater Chicagoland area and being a Nice Earnest Upper Middle Class Jewish Boy, which are also groups that are a dime a dozen at NU. So how could I have, in good faith, really counseled him to treat the process as though he had super-high chances? It wasn’t being mean, and it wasn’t a reflection on him – we were very encouraging to him. But we wanted him to be realistic and know that he was swinging the bat and he might or might not connect, so have excellent Plans B, C, D, E and F in place.</p>
<p>
It’s a lot easier to find that diamond in the rough if somebody else has been polishing it for a few years.</p>
<p>Pizzagirl, if “your” high school is a BLS, yes I think you can expect a similar level of “placement” year after year. See post 162 and post 134 where I tried to reason why that was the case. You are right that the school community may have different needs in different years so there’s virtually no single “profile” that is guaranteed to work every year, but apparently Harvard managed to find a good number of desired candidates from BLS pool every year.</p>
<p>I may have understated the level of “hook” that a typical BLS admit has. I just wanted to point out that the hooks involved are typically academic in nature, not legacy or faculty kid status as was previously suggested. As far as I remember, no recruited athletes, either.</p>
<p>to be val or sal, you needed to have multiple AP classes because of the way the weighting system worked at the time. AP was 5x, Honors 4x, regular 3x weighted. There was no chance to be val or sal unless you had a lot of AP classes. I think I sat for 8 APs, even 20 y ago.</p>
<p>SAT II (achievement tests back then) were expected. </p>
<p>There was opportunity to participate in activities where it was possible to get national recognition - I remember math & science competitions; language competitions; debate. Those were the activities in my sphere of knowledge, I’m sure there were others. </p>
<p>So I also agree that BLS does a good job polishing.</p>
<p>As has been mentioned, there is plenty of SES and racial/ethnic diversity at the school; although I remember a lot of asians (I am asian myself, so these were my friends). I think from the batch accepted to Harvard my year, there were quite a few asians, at least one jewish student, irish, and our class president was black. </p>
<p>I knew people who “cheated” and didn’t actually live in Boston proper, but these were a minority of students and this was frowned upon by other students. </p>
<p>I also agree with Blossom - Harvard does have its favorite schools in MA. Cambridge Rindge and Latin is such a favored school. But I would guess that other high quality publics in MA have a slight edge over a similar public in another state. I knew quite a few folks from Brookline; Newton; Framingham; Lexington; etc. who ran in my same circles in high school that ended up at H.</p>
<p>As for the Harvard accept rate - i am shocked - it looks like a quarter to a third of the class each year applies. Still, a 25% accept rate is pretty high. And I bet not many schools will have a quarter of their class apply to Harvard. It’s interesting, I think Harvard has the highest apply rate of the elites on the list - although probably not surprising.</p>
<p>Back in post #131, Pizzagirl mentioned a comment that I had made on another thread about IMSA (illinois Math and Science Academy) students and admissions at Northwestern.</p>
<p>I don’t have a connection with IMSA either. I believe that one of QMP’s 7th grade classmates moved to Illinois for 8th grade, and went to IMSA. She went to Harvard.</p>
<p>My information on IMSA comes from their web site and from posts by annasdad–so consider the sources for what follows. </p>
<p>In any event, IMSA is a public boarding school that offers very rich opportunities to high school students who are interested in science and math. There are 17 elective courses in mathematics and 22 in science, including 7 in physics. This is a better curricular range than the great majority of high schools in the US offer. More than 50% of the faculty have Ph.D.s, which seems pretty remarkable to me. Admissions is by application, with about 230-250 students admitted each year from 600-950 applicants. While IMSA only admits residents of Illinois, I believe that they try to recruit fairly broadly from across the state. Their incoming students, who take the SAT in 8th or 9th grade, have an average CR score of 611 and an average M score of 678–at the time of application to IMSA. There are many opportunities for extracurriculars. Of the 195 students in a recent graduating class, 55 were National Merit Semi-Finalists. So, all in all, I think it is safe to say that IMSA is a powerhouse of a school.</p>
<p>There is no doubt a lot of self-selection that occurs among the applicants to IMSA. A very strong interest in math and science is needed, for enrollment there to make sense.</p>
<p>I understood from annasdad’s post that Northwestern had recently reduced significantly the number of IMSA grads that it takes. Assuming that this is true, I really have no idea why the change has been made.</p>
<p>It seems to me that admissions staffers ought to have a baseline level of respect for the applicants. To suggest that perhaps NU was “kind of bored” with the applicants (as in post #156) does not seem to me to correspond to the minimum level of respect that I would hope all applicants receive, no matter how low their true chances. To suggest that the admissions personnel wanted to “cleanse the palate” (also in #156)? Perhaps they are confusing their job with wine-tasting.</p>
<p>I wouldn’t suppose that IMSA students, nor students from New Trier, are actually all that similar in ways that really matter–even if they are superficially similar.</p>
<p>I do feel sorry for an IMSA applicant to Northwestern who wanted to go there to study nano-technology. The “plenty of other good colleges” argument is much weaker in this case than it usually is.</p>
<p>Anyways, sorry to rehash the whole BLS / Harvard relationship issue. looks like this has been discussed already at :</p>
<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/harvard-university/715657-what-high-school-communities-does-harvard-favor.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/harvard-university/715657-what-high-school-communities-does-harvard-favor.html</a></p>
<p>The article that discusses what Harvard’s stated polices are regarding geographic preferences is also linked.</p>
<p>Just to add: I don’t think that Northwestern “owes” admission to IMSA students, nor that NU has to admit any particular number of IMSA students. But since NU has a highly selective public school in the state, which offers an unusually rich curriculum, it would make sense to me for them to admit quite a few IMSA students. The number of students admitted to NU each year is large enough that I’d think they could take most of the students who had done well at IMSA and applied to NU.</p>
<p>The one element of IMSA’s FAQs that puzzles me is that the average SAT CR/M scores of the 8th or 9th graders who are admitted are 611/678, while the average scores of the graduates in a recent year were 659/713. The increase seems way too small to me, since there should be a 2 to 3 year time lapse involved, with corresponding intellectual growth.</p>
<p>“Boston-area only, Boston public high schools that are underserved, or Massachusetts overall?”</p>
<p>Boston area. Suburbs included. I don’t know what kind of radius they use, but they’re not talking about Williamstown.</p>
<p>QM, it is not “disrespectful” to IMSA applicants to not be admitted, any more than it is “disrespectful” to any other applicant to not be admitted. Your radar for taking umbrage is tuned a little too high. And I recognize you feel very sorry for super bright kids not admitted to their very first choice college, but that’s simply the reality of the numbers.</p>
<p>“The number of students admitted to NU each year is large enough that I’d think they could take most of the students who had done well at IMSA and applied to NU.”</p>
<p>And then Evanston Township HS thinks the same way for town/gown relations. And then New Trier thinks the same way since it’s a nearby powerhouse affluent. And then the Latin School of Chicago thinks the same way since it’s a prestigious private. And then Stevenson High thinks the same way because hey, it’s just like New Trier but further west. And then Whitney Young magnet school thinks the same way. They all can’t have “their” spots written in oak tag ready to go!</p>
<p>Pizzagirl, I wasn’t saying that it was disrespectful to an IMSA applicants if the student was not admitted. I was saying that it was disrespectful to an IMSA applicant if the reason the student was not admitted was that the admissions office was “kind of bored” with IMSA students, as you hypothesized in post #156. In practice, I doubt that Northwestern admissions operates in that way. </p>
<p>If you take all of the National Merit Scholars at Evanston Township HS, New Trier, the Latin School of Chicago, Stevenson, and Whitney Young + those at IMSA, what fraction would apply to Northwestern? Even if it is 100%, what fraction do you think would be Northwestern’s actual yield? How many students is that, total, and how many does Northwestern admit? I suspect that there would be room for all who wanted to come. The group of schools that you have mentioned sounds diverse to me, just as a first impression, with the exception that everyone is from Illinois.</p>
<p>*Your radar for taking umbrage is tuned a little too high. *
Not aiming this any anyone, but it’s a common problem from looking at admissions from the outside. (Several recent thread show that.) All you have to go on is the number of admits and some detail from results threads (or what we know locally.) Or stats. Or our own views of what makes a kid worthy.</p>
<p>There are many math-sci academies, many of them with diverse demographics. Also, many high schools where the recent performance of their attendees to that college can provide some reference point. I never mean to suggest BLS exists as some isolated absolute- instead, I believe there are a number of reasons an H might like to deal with BLS.</p>
<p>lookingforward, I was objecting to a hypothetical reason for rejection that Pizzagirl gave (the admissions staff being “kind of bored” with applicants from a particular school). If there was any umbrage being taken in this specific case, it was with regard to a rather frivolous reason for rejection. I have to assume that does not actually happen in practice! But now I have started to wonder whether it might happen subconsciously? You may be able to assure me that even if applicants seem like “much of a muchness” they are still regarded individually, and with due respect.</p>
<p>Perhaps a way to integrate some of the divergent views in this discussion would be to say the following:
The most selective schools exhibit patterns and preferences in their admissions decisions that can give some very helpful indicators of whether a student is a reasonable candidate for those schools BUT because the schools use subjective criteria, and can change them at any time, students shouldn’t over-rely on those patterns and preferences, and should have a well-thought-out plan that includes reaches, matches, and true safeties.</p>
<p>Thus, we all know that the BLS val who is also a URM, an Intel winner, and a 2400 SAT scorer, has a very, very good chance of being admitted to Harvard.</p>
<p>But he’s well-advised to have some other applications ready in case he still doesn’t get in to Harvard.</p>
<p>Also, it’s amusing to me to reflect that Oxford and Cambridge have not grown “bored” with Eton in 500+ years.</p>
<p>Hey, Hunt, you are interrupting my taking umbrage at being misinterpreted! However, I think your point in #177 is very well made.</p>
<p>Q, I know. I think you are trying to understand. I think we are all limited in how much we know about the final decisions. When one looks at this from the distant end (who got in, who didn’t,) one misses the intricacies of the process, itself. Same, when one looks at the supposed upfront worthiness and the final result- without getting under the crust, you don’t know.</p>