<p>Hi. I am a senior at a preparatory school in Southern California. </p>
<p>By many standards I am a top student. My SAT is in the 99%, i have a strong GPA, and I am a full IB candidate. I have applied to many of the top 20 private schools. Most of the people around me, including teachers, counselors, and family members, expect me to attend a top private school (HYPS etc.) if I were to be accepted. </p>
<p>However, I am starting to rethink whether I actually want to go to one. I do not really associate with other kids who take the same advanced classes as me or are as academically inclined as I am. Most of my friends are either going to state school or a low UC. </p>
<p>I feel weird saying this, but I do want to have fun and party in college, as well as study and focus on academics. I do not want to go to a school where the majority of students are "nerds" and where there is not a big party scene. </p>
<p>For these reasons, UCLA and Berkeley have gone from being safeties, or good back-ups, to being my first choice schools. I feel these schools provide the dual qualities of being academically strong as well having a strong social scene. </p>
<p>What do you guy think of my reasoning and my conclusion?</p>
<p>I think you should go to the best place you can get admitted and that your parents can afford, or where the FA makes it affordable. And there, figure you’re going to find many playful people wherever you go, as there are some outrageously bright people who also know how to have plenty of fun, too. You’ll find them because they are plentiful everywhere including at “top schools”, and because that is what you are seeking to learn next. You can learn to connect your intellect with your social life. No need to choose between them as if a polarity. JMO</p>
<p>Were you able to actually visit any of the 20 places you’ve applied to, or is this just a group of thoughts?</p>
<p>I think that the atmosphere at Stanford might be more to your liking than you realize, from what I’ve heard about the place.</p>
<p>But I see nothing wrong with going to UCLA or Berkeley. Both are excellent universities.</p>
<p>If you hadn’t already applied, I would have suggested that you consider Penn, Duke, or Cornell, all of which I think might be your style. But you’ve already applied, right?</p>
<p>Just saw a logical fallacy in your OP! Are you getting the idea that these highpower schools are full of “nerds” FROM your friendship circle, which you describe as heading towards state schools or low UC’s? Maybe you’re adopting their self-defensive bias, when they don’t have the same range of choices as you? </p>
<p>Celebrate your friends’ destinations but find your own path, too. It’s a great quality to make friends from many circles, BTW, but make sure you’re not just taking on a prejudice not from your own research/thinking/experience/potential.</p>
<p>I also agree that UCLA and Berkeley are locations for finding a fine education, but there’s fun to be found all over the country. Are you getting cold feet to leave California? Is it something else bugging you, in other words?</p>
<p>What a shame that you have been made to feel that it’s “weird” to want to have a good social life in addition to attending a great academic school. Many folks, myself included, would consider it “weird” if you didn’t also take the social aspect of undergraduate life into consideration as you make your college selection.</p>
<p>It sounds like you are going to have some terrific choices when it comes time to selecting your college. There is absolutely nothing wrong with deciding to stay in state and going to UC Berkeley or UCLA. These are both superb places and promise a great blend of academics, social life, and athletic life. </p>
<p>If you decide that you want to leave California and get a different experience in a different part of the country, there are many excellent college alternatives that also offer fabulous combinations of academics, social life, and athletic life. The premier colleges in the country that can offer this marvelous undergraduate experience are Duke, Northwestern, Rice, Vanderbilt and Notre Dame (and of course Stanford if you decide to stay in state). The biggest downside, however, is that these are likely to be significantly more expensive than UCB or UCLA. </p>
<p>Anyway, your question shows that you’re on the right track. Good luck with your choice and have a great four years.</p>
<p>UCLA or Berkeley? If you choose a rigorous course selection at either one, you will be “well educated.”</p>
<p>You will get a lot of different points of view about “fit.” Seems you think these two schools are good fits. Who knows better than you? Who has to live with whatever decision is made? You.</p>
<p>Many posters may try to point out that you are “misunderstanding” aspects of HYPS. I suggest you weigh all this with a grain of salt. </p>
<p>Wait until you get someone who got accepted to HYPS and UCLA and/or Berkeley and chose not to attend HYPS AND regretted the decision. </p>
<p>Both your reasoning and conclusions seem valid.</p>
<p>It is the old “road not taken” issue, you decide where you want to go and live with the decision.</p>
<p>Where would you go if you had to pay for your own education - with any assistance from your parents or others? I say this not to be difficult, but my college choice became easier when I learned at about age 17 I was going to have to go it alone financially - it made it much easier to conduct a cost/ benefit analysis - and put the most important item in college first - the academic fit and how an education would further my goals. Everything else began to fall by the wayside. Not a bad question to ask, in my view.</p>
<p>ima, you seem to have a lot of conflicting emotions right now that are pushing you forward and pulling you back. Just about every parent and college student here will tell you that that’s normal and to be expected at a time of transition. Blasting off to the unknown, especially when it’s 3000 miles away and full of kids who are likely to be just as smart or maybe even smarter than you, can be pretty intimitading. </p>
<p>So. . . take a deep breath. Wait out the acceptances. When they come in maybe you could do some overnighting. If in the end you choose Berkeley or UCLA, who’s to criticize? They are wonderful schools full of wonderful kids many of whom end up healthy, wealthy and wise.</p>
<p>As for your under-achiever friends, they’ll still be your friends. Even if you’re wearing a Harvard sweatshirt. My son had a wide range of friends in highschool. Some were extremely achievement oriented and went on to top schools. Some were, let’s say, relaxed about their futures. They went to community colleges, joined the military, gap-year’ed, hung out in low level jobs. But when they get together during holidays, they’re still friends. Just because you may open a new chapter in your life doesn’t mean you have to close the door on friendships.</p>
<p>You should get a copy of the movie American Graffiti. You sound a lot like the protagonist.</p>
<p>PS, Kids *do *have fun at top colleges, even at the most selective.</p>
<p>I’ve not read the above posts yet, so this is an independent opinion: I think you’ll find great friends and be able to party as much as you want wherever you go. Despite what some think, and despite how rankings and marketing try to create brands and personalities of colleges, the actually differences on campuses are not that great because you have tremendous diversity at every college. I have taught at many, my colleagues have taught at many, and we all say the same thing. Most is faux differences.</p>
<p>Well I tried not to be too blunt in my post but what I mean by “fun” in college is basically partying and all of the things that it entails, which includes consumption of alcohol, girls, etc. </p>
<p>I am not saying that kids at top schools dont have “fun”, but I am not sure it is the same “fun” that I am seeking. </p>
<p>I always hear that college is the best time of one’s life. I am very intellectually curious, but I am not sure if I derive the same enjoyment from academics as other kids who attend top schools.</p>
<p>I don’t see why you equate being intelligent to not having any “fun”, even by your definition. Many top schools are “work hard play hard.” The inspiration for animal house was Dartmouth. Certainly some schools are known as more intellectual-- ie University of Chicago and Swarthmore, but at almost every ivy I’m sure that you can find the kind of fun that you want, possibly more so than at Berkeley. That being said, the UC schools are definitely top schools and its not like you’d be sacrificing academic quality by choosing them.</p>
<p>imathriver, can you spend an overnight on the campuses of your top picks? That may give you a better idea of the actual availability of parties, etc. I do not downplay that factor. It is part of fit. DD found plenty of parties at Rice and plenty of other things to do. Good fit for her. Found out in a couple of overnights. Not easy to find on just a day visit.</p>
<p>Try getting an overnight at some of the schools. Above all, don’t feel pressured by the people here to pick a school just because of name brand. You’re the one who has to live with your decision, not them.</p>
<p>I think that you are considering a very important issue, one which I wish my daughter had thought about more carefully. Quite simply, she went off to a very academically demanding, elite school where she has had a very rough time finding a good social fit. Academically, she has excelled. But midway through sophomore year, she has only one person at her school whom she considers to be a close friend that she can confide in. Many acquaintances, plenty to do – but it has been difficult for her to find people who share her social interests & inclinations. She is at an urban school so she also has friends off campus, and actually finds her social life revolving around her boyfriend’s campus 200 miles away. She considered transferring, but felt that any college that would meet her academic goals would have the same problem. In a word: she is at a place that is ideal for her academically, but not where she will find “her people”. </p>
<p>That being said: if your idea of fun is “partying and all of the things that it entails, which includes consumption of alcohol, girls, etc.” - it would be a mistake to assume you can’t find that at the elite schools. That isn’t my daughter’s problem: on the contrary, she was put off by the frat scene & the alcohol-drenched parties you describe. In her case, a more artsy-oriented school would probably have been a better social fit. </p>
<p>So I don’t think its a matter of people being “nerdy” or unable to have fun – my d. was also quite surprised to see how big a role sports & athletics played at her elite school, but that is something else that she isn’t really into – but it is valid to consider overall campus culture and whether it is a good fit for you. There is nothing wrong with deciding to turn down a prestige school simply because you can’t really see yourself being happy there.</p>
<p>Trust me, some of the top schools have excellent party scenes. For example, here (Princeton), one could go out and get stupendously drunk every night of the week with other very social, not at all nerdy people at the eating clubs, if one wanted to.</p>
<p>Don’t make the mistake of assuming that just because a college is very selective and has very smart students, it won’t have a great social scene and sweet parties. At the very least, every top college has lots of recruited athletes, many of whom are very social and know how to party.</p>
<p>Dartmouth, Penn, Princeton, Duke, and Brown have incredibly active social scenes. Just because a school is incredibly selective and prestigious doesn;t mean its boring.</p>
<p>Don’t get constrained by stereotypes. Not to make this too personal, but I was a gifted student, went to a top school, but I would not want my D to do the things we did. Oh if only I could feel more anonymous on here! While getting a PhD at a top 10 school, we worked hugely hard but also partied very hard too (and if use of drugs is a measure, our profs never stopped having fun). Come to think of it, I don’t know of too many PhDs who fit the nerd steretype.</p>
<p>LOL. High school was very different from college. In my high school and in my son’s high school the bright kids tend not to be the partiers, they didn’t drink or do drugs. Imagine my surprise to get to an Ivy school and everyone was drinking, dancing and smoking pot and not a few were doing other drugs. If you want it it’s there. But nothing wrong with Berkeley either - it’s a great deal for in-staters.</p>
<p>One thing to consider: I do think college is an ideal time to explore a different area of the country and stretch your wings a bit.</p>