Several people in my town are sending their kids to these “pre-college programs” at selective colleges, because they feel that this will give their kids a leg up in the admission process for that particular college. One parent I know had apparently done this herself at Brown (albeit 30 or so years ago) and is convinced that this is what got her into Brown in the end.
Obviously the kid still has to have the stats - but can these programs really make a difference when it comes to admission?
No, and the colleges state that upfront. For example, this is what Harvard says:
http://www.summer.harvard.edu/programs/secondary-school-program/frequently-asked-questions
So it’s certainly better than lying on the beach all summer, but it also a very expensive proposition.
I am told that it doesn’t help. I do know that these programs are academically rigorous and great for kids who want to learn more than K-12 typically offers.
Depends on the school, no? I think CMU considers it a way to show interest and they suggested that they look upon this with approval in the presentation I attended on campus. But I too know parents (alums) who sent their kids to the Brown summer program and were surprised and hurt when the kids were not admitted. My S went to a summer program at Cooper Union, enjoyed it, and learned something (if not a huge amount), including that he was not that interested in applying to Cooper. Of course its a terrific school, but very small, which really sunk in over the course of the summer.
The kid will likely get a bigger tip from the legacy. And Brown alumni offers free college advising services for Brown alum children and I bet she could get the inside scoop. The landscape for selective college admissions has completely changed in 30 years and the sheer number of applicants is daunting.
I don’t think those programs give admissions boost at that particular college. And they only are helpful as an activity that reveals your interests and show you make efforts to learn and grow from the program itself. So I’d say I would like to see the student build on the experience and activities done before and after are part of the usefulness of that, in so much as that they got something out of it beyond a trip to the dream college. And rather than a list of random things I did, or plunking your money down and showing up to one bought and paid for experience after another. You can build the same type of deeper engagement a number of ways without the cost. Some students are able to do research at a local college for instance and I do not think it means diddly squat that the local college is a 3rd tier directional and not Brown, if the student is making opportunities happen and learning to work in a lab or doing fieldwork with a researcher that is an excellent opportunity.
I think the right way to look at these programs is from learning rather than college admissions.
A lot of these programs aren’t really run by the schools themselves - the program just rents out space on campus for the summer (and gets to use the school name, letterhead, and signature of some dean or other). That’s not to say they’re not good programs, but the affiliation with the school is very loose. If you have the money to spend on a summer program, I would look for one that’s a fit for your child’s interest rather than one at a particular school.
I look at these programs as rather expensive summer camps. What you get out of it is the experience not any tangible benefit concerning admission, scholarship money (although Rose Hulman does offer scholarship money to those who complete their engineering summer camp and subsequently are accepted to and choose to attend RHIT) or college credit. I agree that they can be useful in introducing a young adult to life on a campus and perhaps assist them in determining whether a particular field or career path might interest them. Writing a check for several thousand dollars to attend a summer camp at … school will mostly just provide that institution another income stream rather than benefit you or your child in admissions.
My D went to the Brown summer thing and loved it. The students formed a Facebook group and still keep in touch. For the heck of it we calculated the Facebook group’s ultimate acceptance rate to Brown undergrad (they chatted a lot during the college application process). I recall it roughly mirrored somewhere between Brown’s overall ED and RD acceptance rates. Maybe 3 out 16 or something like that were accepted - I wish I could remember the exact numbers. I do recall about a 50/50 mix of ED/RD applicants.
My D LOVED the experience, and actually got some college guidance from it. The head of her particular program who was not a Brown Prof , but from another university, helped her develop a fantastic list of colleges suited to her academic interests and personality.
Yes, my son went to a pre-college program. He is a bright kid, but doesn’t have the stats of some kids on this site. However he was accepted to University of Maryland Engineering. The only difference I can find as to why he was accepted and other students were not, is that summer engineering course. There were kids from all kinds of backgrounds there this past summer. He loved the diversity and working in group projects. He learned a lot from the other kids. If you have a program available in your area this summer, I would apply.
Also, I should mention that this course gave him exposure to different types of engineering disciplines. While he isn’t sure what area to declare in engineering, he now knows what areas he isn’t interested in pursuing.
Depends upon the program and the school. I’ve known some very disappointed folks whose kids did very well at some programs for multiple years, got great recs from those teaching those programs and were on the faculty of the college, with kids having the stats to be in the running for admission, still not get accepted. For the highly selective school, for the most part, it doesn’t help other than to show academic interest.
Would echo what Inogo said. Very important to find out if it is run by the school or outsourced. Sadly, many of the outsourced ones feed on this notion that parents will feel that it will give their kids a leg up. I found that the ones run by the school were actually much more reasonably priced, led by professors at that University, and served the purpose of giving the student a better idea if they would fit in at the school and want to pursue that major.
I agree not to go to these programs for admissions help. Participate in them because your kid will benefit.
The only advantage I see admissions wise is that your kid will have seen the campus and so can write a better “why College X?” essay. He will have more details to offer.
I have heard that the PAVE program gives Vanderbilt applicants a little boost - but who really knows?
I’ve also heard admissions officers say flat out that summer programs on campus do not give applicants a boost for college admissions.
I think the benefit is more to the student clarifying objectives and getting to take interesting courses that high schools don’t offer.
D has done 3 of these programs. First at Brown, in neuroscience. She enjoyed it so much she designed an independent study research project with a prof at our local LAC the following falls and got HS credit for it too. The following summer she did an engineering program. She learned she didn’t much want to be an engineer, but she did like the school that hosted it. She returned to Brown the next summer and took a course in epidemiology that excited her so much it became a focus for college essays, classes she chose to take in HS senior year, where she applied, all of it.
Brown does run their own program and the profs are sometimes full profs, sometimes grad students, sometimes both. Brown is also particularly generous with low income applicants (who apply ASAP after the app opens) which is very unusual in the summer pre-college world.
She also keeps in touch with friends she made there and all are at top colleges now, though not necessarily Brown. That doesn’t mean the program helped them get in, rather I think it says something about the type of kids who choose to take on a college course over the summer rather than just hang out.
Carnegie Mellon, yes, but UChicago no.
If college admission is the real objective, students would be best served to spend the summer working on their applications (or test prep) in earnest and parents MUCH better served by investing the budgeted sums in hiring competent advisors. There might a handful of notable exceptions among summer programs, but most are simply answers to gullible parents who have more dollars than common sense. If you have to pay for the summer program, chances are that it is a money grubbing affair.
The key is to recognize that success depends on the efforts.
Common sense is often common but rarely sensible.