<p>[Yale</a> not alone in Title IX probe | Yale Daily News](<a href=“http://www.yaledailynews.com/news/2011/apr/15/yale-not-alone-in-title-ix-probe/]Yale”>http://www.yaledailynews.com/news/2011/apr/15/yale-not-alone-in-title-ix-probe/)</p>
<p>That was the article.</p>
<p>I find the comments on this thread which are to the effect that Yale is no worse than anywhere else and that other places are worse to be red herrings and a digression from the real issues. The facts of the case will come out after the investigation is done, and anecdotal evidence is not probative. To say that Yale is suffering from its own liberality is somewhat ludicrous.</p>
<p>Saying that this matter is receiving publicity because there are feminists at Yale, is somewhat sexist in and of itself. When anyone thinks it is OK to call women “sluts”, then corrective education is needed, just to take one example. The possibility that other universities may be worse, doesn’t give a pass to anyone. Maybe Yale, because it is held in such high regard as an educational institution, can help in raising the consciousness of those who need their sensitivities raised.</p>
<p>The entire university does not have to be a seething mass of intolerance for there to have been Title IX violations. AND, now there is good company for Yale - Princeton and Harvard Law.</p>
<p>Years ago, at my old law school, a certain professor was the subject of gossip regarding his treatment of women students. During my years there nothing official happened, but eventually, quite a few people spoke up, and despite the initial finding by the Law school that no harassment occurred, he resigned, largely due to student activism. I am unwilling to “convict” anyone based on gossip, and in my own interactions with the professor nothing wrong or even a shade off ever happened. However, I do have my own opinion of the case based on the testimony of the various complainants, as well as other facts that I observed during my own time there. </p>
<p>I think it is good that bad conduct is outed. To allow it to continue just devalues the efforts of those who are law abiding.</p>
<p>^ while I agree that no, there is no excuse, and yes, problems should be dealt with and not swept under the rug I feel compelled to still emphasize that Yale is an amazing institution and that honestly, neither I myself or anyone I know has ever complained(within my hearing at least) or any kind of gender discrimination. Debate can and should happen on this thread, but please remember that although this case is going on, it is not reflective of the larger Yale community(and in my opinion, even a significant aspect of it). Keep things in perspective people.</p>
<p>Another mom of a daughter at Yale chiming in. She and her friends are not only “embarrassed” by this complaint but offended as well. In her own words: “The complaintants speak for themselves - NOT for all the women of Yale.” My daughter LOVES Yale and has never felt threatened in any way.</p>
<p>On the one hand, my daughter has had an excellent experience at Yale overall. On the other hand, she decided not to take one course that she might otherwise have taken, because of the reputation of the professor. </p>
<p>And DKE really crossed the line. Not funny. We got a prompt telephone call about it from my daughter, because she was bothered by the incident. I know that she signed a web petition, asking the Dean to take action. </p>
<p>I am not embarrassed about the complaint to the Department of Education. I do not think the environment gives cause for a student or prospective student to go elsewhere, but honestly I am uncertain that the environment at Yale reaches the level of gender-neutrality of my own [large, public] university, which has admitted women from the date of its founding.</p>
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<p>I hate to break it to you, but uttering the word “slut” has become quite commonplace among today’s young people. If you have access to your child’s Facebook wall and ergo their friends walls and photos, you will see girls calling each other sluts, boys calling each other sluts and boys and girls calling each other sluts. Uttering that word used to be grounds for a dad to take a shotgun to a boy’s front door, but now it is just another common, base adjective, just like “whore.”</p>
<p>I do not approve of its use, especially in the college campus context, but I think the complainants may have a tough time using that word as evidence of a hostile environment nowadays. Especially since the word is preceded by “We love our Yale …”</p>
<p>^No, sorry, sl<em>t, wh</em>r_, still no good, even if commonplace. I am not locked away in a closet, and I can tell you, even though it matters not, in terms of the issue, my child would not let these remarks or any type of cuss words, foul language etc. be posted on her facebook wall by others and remain there. These are derogatory terms. They are like using the N word to refer to African Americans, even if you don’t think so. This is exactly why action needs to be taken. Even you have had your sensibilities tainted. They can get experts to testify that this is derogatory, hostile, and perhaps a few other things. These experts could be psycholgists and law professors (I know of a few myself).</p>
<p>Could they get away with saying we love our Yale N----? Today? I doubt it. </p>
<p>Didn’t the Rutger’s women’s basketball team get up in arms when they were called H-'s by Imus? Just because it may be “cool” to speak this vernacular, doesn’t make it correct. N— was vernacular too.</p>
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<p>What do you mean by “corrective education”? Are you saying that using the word “slut” should be grounds for disciplinary action? What kind of disciplinary action? And should that action be publicly disclosed? Are there other such words that should be considered hostile and therefore grounds for discplinary action? Should Yale publish a list of such words and update it every year? How slippery is this slope? </p>
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<p>I agree with this one. But are you saying that Yale is covering up such bad conduct and allowing it to continue?</p>
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<p>Me neither. I think it is usually a good thing for any institution to come under scrutiny for such matters.</p>
<p>There are two ways to look at this:</p>
<ol>
<li> How does Yale stand relative to its peer institutions?</li>
<li> How does Yale stand relative to an absolute standard? </li>
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<p>I think there is an absolute standard set by Title IX. If Yale is in violation of this absolute standard then it doesn’t matter whether other institutions are the same or worse than Yale. Like getting a speeding ticket- sure, others may be driving faster than you, but you were the one the cop stopped.</p>
<p>Another thread on CC had a link to an article in New York (the magazine):
[What</a> Happens to All the Asian-American Overachievers When the Test-Taking Ends? – New York Magazine](<a href=“http://nymag.com/news/features/asian-americans-2011-5/index5.html]What”>http://nymag.com/news/features/asian-americans-2011-5/index5.html)
I advert you to the material on pages 6 through 8 of this article. The author, Wesley Yang, is claiming that J. T. Tran, aka “Asian Playboy,” spoke at a Master’s Tea at Silliman, in the living room of Master [Judith] Krauss, although it appears that the invitation was issued by the Asian-American Students Alliance, and not by the college directly. According to the article, Tran runs an organization called the “ABCs of Attraction,” which for a hefty sum, will teach young men who somehow missed out on the information, how to behave like an unusually boorish 16 year old. </p>
<p>The material in paragraph 3 of page 7 and paragraph 3 of page 8 is particularly despicable. I doubt that those things were said in Silliman. I don’t know that Tran actually spoke in Silliman at all. The article doesn’t say when this happened, although it gives the impression that it was recent. (Krauss has been Master of Silliman since 2000, apparently.) If Tran did speak at a Master’s Tea, what was Master Krauss thinking? </p>
<p>I favor free speech. I am committed to the idea that the remedy for bad speech is more speech. Was there an opposing point of view presented at the tea? </p>
<p>Ann Olivarius should take a look at this, as should DoE.</p>
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<p>Your daughter is offended because some female Yalies didn’t feel comfortable listening to a bunch of d-bags chant NO MEANS YES, YES MEANS ANAL/mock the Take Back the Night march/call Yale girls ‘sluts’? She’s offended because there are girls at Yale who feel that complaining to the school administration accomplishes nothing because their complaints are never taken seriously? (Naomi Wolf wrote an article recently about how the Yale administration stonewalled her when she tried to open a discussion on sexual harassment.)</p>
<p>She shouldn’t be.</p>
<p>‘LOVING’ an institution doesn’t mean getting offended when people try to solve its problems.</p>
<p>Let the DoE investigate and I am all for Yale using this opportunity to see what it can do to avoid embarrassing incidences like this in the future but DKE is an independent fraternity, not supported by Yale or using a space on its campus. Agree with VP above that there is a free speech issue here and if these students were publicly dismissed by Yale over these odious chants, the ACLU would be after Yale too at this point.</p>
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<p>This doesn’t seem to be an institutional problem so much as the problem of some inebriated frat boys. We’ll see what results from the DoE inquiry.</p>
<p>Nope, this was not a big deal. In fact, it was hilarious. As usual, the “Politically Correct” try to ruin everybody else’s fun. Parents, crazy feminists, and the administration all have their panties in a bunch for no reason.</p>
<p>Unless someone knows otherwise, “Asian Playboy” spoke at a Master’s Tea. I think those can be considered official Yale events. As I mentioned, I support free speech, and I re-assert that the remedy is more speech. So I’ll say again, I think that the material in paragraph 3 of page 7 and paragraph 3 of page 8, originating from “Asian Playboy” and cited in the New York magazine article by Wesley Yang, linked in post #70, is reprehensible. Do you think it’s all just good fun? Do you have a blonde, blue-eyed daughter?</p>
<p>did not read & no plans to read, but since you need a response I’ll vote “good fun”. “yes”. Plus I’m for free speech. Just not going our of my way to hear or read articles about (or written by) “Asian Playboy”. Not an area of interest, unless there are pictures that are reprehensible, then I’ll take a look.lol.</p>
<p>Yale has all sorts of people at Master’s Teas. They had Scooter Libby recently, for example. I don’t think it signifies endorsement of the viewpoint of the guest.</p>
<p>I agree that the viewpoint of the guest is not necessarily being endorsed at a Master’s Tea, but isn’t there an implicit message that hearing the guest would be in some way worthwhile? It seems to me that Scooter Libby passes that test while Asian Playboy doesn’t. </p>
<p>One could argue that it’s useful for a student to know that there are people who think like Asian Playboy, and at least a few people who are willing to pay him money for instructions, but does anyone arrive at Yale not knowing that?</p>
<p>Do the guest speakers come to Master’s Teas without having travel expenses or honoraria paid?</p>
<p>“All these websites make me feel vaguely totally creeped out, but the prospect of watching uber-formal Master K sit down to ask this expert seducer questions is too amazing to pass up. JT (born Jerry) will be focusing on the discrimination Asian men face in the dating scene, like he has at Harvard already, which should be interesting, although Im guessing that the most interesting part of this Masters Tea will probably be who shows up will there be any girls? Will it be people seeking advice? Are there any PUAs at Yale already?”</p>
<p>WOW now I’m change my vote…next thing ya know Yale will invite a rapper to read poetry.</p>
<p>[J.T</a>. Tran: Playboy, entrepreneur artist, love guru | Yale Daily News](<a href=“http://www.yaledailynews.com/news/2011/feb/11/jt-tran-playboy-entrepreneur-artist-love-guru/]J.T”>http://www.yaledailynews.com/news/2011/feb/11/jt-tran-playboy-entrepreneur-artist-love-guru/)</p>
<p>[The</a> Yale Herald Blog Archive Bullblog tip-off: get picked up at “The Asian Playboy” Master’s Tea](<a href=“yaleherald.com”>yaleherald.com)</p>
<p>An update on disciplinary measures and sanctions as a result of the DKE incident:</p>
<p>[Miller</a> announces DKE ExComm sanctions | Yale Daily News](<a href=“http://www.yaledailynews.com/news/2011/may/17/miller-announces-dke-excomm-sanctions/]Miller”>http://www.yaledailynews.com/news/2011/may/17/miller-announces-dke-excomm-sanctions/)</p>
<p>That article about DKE shows some of the limitations in dealing with this. The frat is essentially kicked off campus–but it’s already off campus. It’s not a Yale organization. Its national organization already gave it a mild punishment, and they are not likely to suspend it for five years. Maybe they’ll put it on “probation” to placate Yale. Yale can punish individual Yale students who participated–but they can’t or won’t tell us what those punishments are.</p>
<p>What Yale can’t do, in my opinion, is forbid Yale students from joining DKE privately if they want to. To restrict freedom of association like that would open up too many cans of worms.</p>