<p>there is nothing wrong with having an EFC of $0. I had that and am now going to one of the top schools in the country will just about all of my college expenses being for for. Rich kids really don't benifiet from the PELL Grant, also if you go to school in a state that offers to pay for you tutition if you have a good GPA then you are really set. I guess the only thing that you will have to worry about is buying your book, which can be very costly, ($500 for me this semester), I only have to pay $320 every semester to go to school.</p>
<p>"there is nothing wrong with having an EFC of $0. I had that and am now going to one of the top schools in the country will just about all of my college expenses being for for. "</p>
<p>Most people can't get into those schools.</p>
<p>"also if you go to school in a state that offers to pay for you tutition if you have a good GPA then you are really set."</p>
<p>Not really. Even if you're living at home, you still may have to pay up to $1,000 a year for books, plus paying for transportation costs, and fees related to your education. Depending on how poor your family is, you also may need to contribute toward rent, food and utilities.</p>
<p>I have a EFC of $0. It really depends on the school. For example, at my school (Cal Poly, which is a highly ranked school in my field [computer science] an excellent value for California residents), I have a package of grants and loans that covers my entire expected costs (tuition, the cost of on-campus room and board [although juniors and seniors don't live on campus], books/supplies, transportation, etc.). If you are a science, engineering, or math major and have a 3.0 or better GPA, you can get a SMART grant, which could go up to $4,000. Plus, Stanford and Harvard has free tuition for people whose families make $40,000 or less per year.</p>
<p>I say, go for it. Don't let your EFC stop you from attending a good college. But when you get your acceptance letters back, along with financial aid details, shop around. Some schools will give you a very small loan burden, while others will have you knees deep in debt by the time you graduate. I am fortunate to have just a reasonably small loan burden.</p>
<p>Now, you're not going to live luxuriously with an EFC of $0. Off campus housing costs could be prohibitively expensive in some places (make sure you research cost of living before you choose your school), and you're not going to afford the costs of a car on financial aid (make sure you find a school with an excellent transit system). However, you'll live reasonably fine during your college experience, just enough for you to worry mostly about academics and less about other things.</p>
<p>Families with a low or zero EFC that can manage their needs and wants on their income are blessed, blessed, blessed. Much more so than those with high EFCs and high incomes that cannot.</p>
<p>I know both sorts of families, and believe this firmly. Having more money gives you more choices, but that does not mean you make wise ones. There are many foolish ways to spend your money. Those who can manage their money wisely are much better off than those who do not. I have known well to do families that have fallen apart largely due to money problems. And a child from a family who has a large EFC has a challenge before him, if his family is unable or unwilling to help him financially with college. Though income is a great predictor of achievement in education, there are pockets of people who do not have much in that way, but have put education as a high priority in their lives and achieved far more than those with much higher incomes. Having supportive and able parents is probably the greatest factor for kids being successful, and a low EFC can an advantage in such a family. Do be aware though, that poverty is a major problem in this country, and is a factor that features prominently in many of the troubles we see with children. When you come from a household that cannot provide the essentials, it is difficult to parlay that low EFC into any advantage. Statistically that is the case. My hat goes off and I bow deeply to those famiies who have managed to raise their families well with little money.</p>
<p>Do you live in New York State ? If you do , you will get the additional State grant ( TAP ) of about $5000 for an EFC of 0 .</p>
<p>My D did not go to instate school when we were in the very low EFC range for her base year. She went to an out - of - state private that wanted her enough to match what the State would give her for financial aid . She got a great award package that left her with minimal loans and she pays about $6000 out - of - pocket from summer jobs .</p>
<p>One thing to watch out for is that apparently some universities do not accept community college credit. Our D (who goes oos) wants to take german over the summer and the local state u doesn't offer it in the summer. Her advisor said, well, is there another school nearby and she said we have a community college. The advisor told her not to bother 'cause the univ. doesn't accept cc credit.</p>
<p>otoh, the local state u does accept cc credit (symbiotic relationship with the cc for state political reasons), so lots of local kids whose test scores or finances keep them from going to state u go to local cc for two years and then transfer.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Plus, Stanford and Harvard has free tuition for people whose families make $40,000 or less per year.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Not true:</p>
<p>Stanford specifically states in its FAQs regarding their low income initiative:</p>
<p>Does the new policy affect my student contribution or self-help expectation?</p>
<p>A. No. Students are still expected to contribute from their prior-year earnings (50% of after-tax income, minimum $1,700 for freshmen, $2,100 for all others) and from their own assets (35% of the current total value). Students are also expected to cover a self-help (student loan and/or work-study job) expectation of $5,500 for 2006-07. Some students from lower-income families will have a lower self-help expectation.</p>
<p>Harvard states:</p>
<p>You will also have non-billed (out-of-pocket)nexpenses for books, personal and travel expenses — costs which will vary depending on your own
style and habits. For purposes of determining your eligibility for financial aid, we are using a combined book and personal expense allowance
of $2,795.</p>
<p>Student Contribution</p>
<p>We normally expect that incoming students willnearn money for college expenses by working during the summer. We believe a reasonable goal for
this summer in most cases is $1,500, or approximately $150 per week during the summer vacation period. (Summer expectations for upperclass
students are higher due to a longer summer working period.)</p>
<p>If you are not able to save enough from your summer earnings
to meet part or all of the expectation, it may be possible for you to borrow an additional amount.</p>
<p>I was an EFC $0 kid in the late 70s/early 80s -- the oldest of five, first one in college, dad in the military overseas, the rest of the family in the States. </p>
<p>Parents refused to help -- I was dropped off at my local state uni, given $50, and told "you're on your own." I had a $1500 outside scholarship in hand, and got a job within my first 24 hours on campus, which got me through the first two quarters. It took me that long to get my parents to consent to completing the FAFSA. They had spent years telling me to focus on getting into college, telling me to do activities vs. working for pay; my mom went back to work with the purpose of contributing to college expenses, but when the time came, the rug was pulled.</p>
<p>It took years to come to peace with my parents' lack of communication about what was feasible and what I needed to do to prepare myself. Lesson learned: Talk to your kids about money. Early and often. Open those channels of communication.</p>
<p>I then got the max Pell Grant, which got me through spring and summer. Meanwhile. I was working 20 hrs./wk. on-campus -- freshman year at the school cafeteria, soph and junior years as an RA. The school did <em>not</em> give discounts to cafeteria workers for the student meal plan, nor did they reduce/eliminate R&B for RAs -- which is probably why they had a hard time retaining people! Even with a zero EFC, I did NOT get work-study. </p>
<p>My solution was to go independent -- an option which is no longer available to undergrads. I stayed in my college town over the summers and worked. By junior year, my independent status qualified me for some GSL (now Stafford) and NDSL (need-based) loans, so I was able to give myself a little cushion.</p>
<p>What colleges consider as an acceptable personal allowance doesn't begin to cover what a student without parental support must provide. Bus fares home (I didn't own a car until I was 24), toiletries, a modest phone bill, books, clothes (I didn't own a swimsuit or jeans until I went to college), food on weekends when the cafeteria was closed... There was an unmistakable financial and economic divide between me and my classmates. A $75 phone bill was enough to knock me for a major loop. My checking account balance was perpetually in the single digits. I never bothered getting one of those new-fangled (!) ATM cards because I never had $10 to withdraw.</p>
<p>It is tough, don't kid yourself, but it is doable.</p>
<p>
[quote]
One thing to watch out for is that apparently some universities do not accept community college credit. Our D (who goes oos) wants to take german over the summer and the local state u doesn't offer it in the summer. Her advisor said, well, is there another school nearby and she said we have a community college. The advisor told her not to bother 'cause the univ. doesn't accept cc credit.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>A very fair amount of Universities are not into allowing students to ping pong back and forth from the University to Community College and back. I do not find that really fair, because there are some academic subjects which one can get behind in if you do not figure out a way to carry things on during the summer.</p>
<p>But, if your child saves their course materials from their most current German course, they can practice during the summer and do review. I think that is easier to do with a language, because of how there are cool internet resources for languages, than for math...but that is just me. </p>
<p>German is a really cool language and I am sorry that your child cannot study over it at Community College during the summer time. But, they can practice! </p>
<p>
[quote]
otoh, the local state u does accept cc credit (symbiotic relationship with the cc for state political reasons), so lots of local kids whose test scores or finances keep them from going to state u go to local cc for two years and then transfer.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>I think you bring up a very good point with the transfer articulation agreements. It is also neat if the University has a transfer center of some sort. You can do a little networking if the University has a transfer center and sort of double check things.</p>
<p>
[quote]
One thing to watch out for is that apparently some universities do not accept community college credit. Our D (who goes oos) wants to take german over the summer and the local state u doesn't offer it in the summer. Her advisor said, well, is there another school nearby and she said we have a community college. The advisor told her not to bother 'cause the univ. doesn't accept cc credit.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>there is a big difference between </p>
<p>taking classes at a community college then transferring to a 4 year school (if you transfer with an associates, all of your credits are transferrable however, they may not all be applied to your degree; some will be used as electives) </p>
<p>and </p>
<p>being matriculated at a one college and taking courses at a community college over the summer, on a leave term, etc. </p>
<p>In the second case, your home school would have to grant you permission and give you a permit to take the class at the community college (and some do say no). This can happen for a number of reasons ranging from the depth and breath of the courses to number of credits (it is not unusual for a student to take a course at a community college if they are going to get the same number of credits and the cc course is considered to be easier) . Many school will not allow you to take credits in your major at another school unless that school is part of an exchange program with the home school.</p>
<p>the concept of being able to carry credits from school to school is can also happen at 4 year colleges and graduate programs.</p>
<p>I suggest you look at UVA. Sure, admission standards are high, but if you are admitted, they have a wonderful financial aid program...particularly the caps on loans.
"HOW AccessUVa WORKS
The financial aid plan assists students and families through four key components:*
Meets 100 percent of demonstrated need for all admitted undergraduate students.
Replaces need-based loans with grants in the financial aid packages of low-income students — those whose family income is equivalent to 200 percent of the federal poverty line or less.
Caps the amount of need-based loans offered to any student at approximately 25 percent of U.Va.’s in-state cost of attendance over four years, and will meet all need above that amount with grants. All students, regardless of state residency, will receive the in-state cap level.
Student Financial Services offers additional one-on-one counseling to admitted students and their families, assisting them in the financial aid application process and presenting them with financing options outside of need-based financial aid."</p>
<p>you guys are idiots, finance has nothing to do with admissions.</p>
<p>having a 0 efc us a good thing. don't litsen to them they are just bitter, because we get more financial aid then them.</p>
<p>I'm going to speak from the perspective of a student at BC. BC is one of the few schools in the nations that are "need-blind" when it comes to admission. And overall, it's pretty generous for student of low EFC. However, BC, along with many need-blind instutions, has its own definition of EFC. NOT ALL SCHOOLS use FAFSA's EFC. A close friend of mine has an FAFSA's EFC of $2000, but an BC's EFC of $22,000.</p>
<p>Schools of moderate endownment ($1 bil+ for universties, $500 mil for LAC) can afford to be generous with their financial aid for low-income, but very few schools have this kind of endownment. Furthermore, although your ability to pay isn't an important factor in admission, but to say it's is zero (remember, these are schools of moderate endownment) is a bit too optimistic. Most of the students who were admitted with substantial financial aid tend to be very competitive students, placing well above the 50% margin in SAT and GPA. If a college is going to invest five-figures into your education in term of grants (not merit scholarship), it wants to make sure that the money goes to students who have most potential and credential.</p>
<p>In conclusion, having a low EFC only benefits competitive students who are applying to well-endowned schools.</p>
<p>P.S. My EFC was $400.</p>
<p>0 efc got my friend full ride even health insurance to swarthmore. he will pay for the bus/plane ride to swarthmore. if you have 0 efc in nyc you can qualify for MANY MANY programs/scholarships that can practically pay for your college education (not only SUNYs but also private colleges *cornell, columbia, nyu, syracuse, union, skidmore, just to name a few). idk, but i would love to have 0 efc.</p>
<p>it all depends on the school.</p>
<p>circuit,
man have you got it wrong!
If a college is not NEED BLIND then they can/and in most cases WILL consider financial status when deciding wheather to accept a student or not. Not many colleges, except thoise with huge endowments, can afford to offer free tuition to low income students.
And many of the posters here, particularily sybbie, know more about the ins and outs of financial aid than anyone, including yourself, so be a little more respectful of those who freely offer their wealth of knowledge to others on this site.</p>
<p>
[quote]
if you have 0 efc in nyc you can qualify for MANY MANY programs/scholarships that can practically pay for your college education (not only SUNYs but also private colleges *cornell, columbia, nyu, syracuse, union, skidmore, just to name a few). idk, but i would love to have 0 efc.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Students in the situations that you describe, as reddune states also tend to have great academic records, or have met the very stringent guidelines to be admitted to a HEOP program at schools such as syracuse, some of the SUNYs and union. Even then there is no free ride because loans (both stafford and perkins loans are part of the HEOP financial aid package). So while that "0" EFC may be "free" on the front end, there is a strong possibility that the student will graduate with debt (if student takes 4 years to graduate they will have a minimum of 19,000 in subsidized stafford loans. if they also get the maximum amount of perkins loans, you are talking about $40k of debt for your "free" education).</p>
<p>Alos remember that the number of HEOP slots are very limited and there are not enough spaces for all eligible students -HEOP is not just for NYC student, but for eligible students living in NYS so the pool potenitally can be very large.. For example: barnard HEOP program only takes 24 eligible students a year. at some schools it is 10 there are less than 50 at some of the SUNY schools).</p>
<p>a 0 EFC means that the government will not require you to pay anything on there end, that means you will get the absolute maximum number of awards from them. at least in NY thats how it works, my EFC is 1300, if my efc was 0, I would simpoly just get a bigger Tap and pell grant.</p>
<p>Circuit,</p>
<p>Remember that individual mileage may vary.</p>
<p>If you are a student at CUNY or SUNY (commuting) school your maximum pell and tap most likely covers the cost of you going to school so you don't have to take out loans . </p>
<p>However a "0" EFC at a school at ST. Johns Univeristy, who no longer participates in HEOP the maximum pell and tap will still leave this student with a lot of debt.</p>
<p>columbia gives full rides without loans, cornell doesn't make you take out loans for first year. having 0 efc is a good thing. your sats/act/satiis/cssprofile/collegeapplications get all waived and that alone = can take place of the loans you have to pay.</p>
<p>
[quote]
columbia gives full rides without loans, cornell doesn't make you take out loans for first year. having 0 efc is a good thing. your sats/act/satiis/cssprofile/collegeapplications get all waived and that alone = can take place of the loans you have to pay
[/quote]
</p>
<p>This is all great but the real trick will be getting in. Remember coming from NYC they will not be at a loss for great applicants (at a school like columbia, demonstrated interest is big especially for those living in NYC.
So if you have not been to an information session, taken a tour, taken the opportunity to sign up and spend the night, have lunch with a student, living a train ride away it will be a virtual kiss of death). </p>
<p>In addition, you are also in the pool with the kids from stuy, tech, bx science, hunter, top magnets like NYC lab and Harris all which send a large number of students to Columbia (this is a good time to know what kind od track record your school has). Now throw elite prep schools in the mix and then the students from LI and westchester county and hte pool is really big really fast and there are not enough spaces for every student to be admitted.</p>
<p>If you have the time, sign up and attend the college planning weekend at Barnard college (go to the sunday session as they will have reps from both cornell and columbia). I would also suggest attending the admissions case studies workshop</p>
<p>good luck to you</p>