<p>To be fair, Chicago, Swarthmore, Mudd, and all of the other selective schools have more than their fair shares of “grinders and strivers.” And the Ivies are different from one another… People don’t seem to notice that.</p>
<p>This thread is bizarre. I’m not sure how one can conclude that:</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>or</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Perhaps I’m too defensive after spending months deciding between an Ivy and some elite LACs…</p>
<p>I applied to and accepted an Ivy–Pton–because it cost nearly half as much as the state school and private school. While it seemed like the most “obvious” choice to everyone I know (who salivates at the thought of a Ivy), I spent nearly every waking moment in complete torment until the deadline. My private was pretty much one of my top choices but didn’t hit top 10 on USNWR or Ivy-status. Did that make it bad? No. Each college is good at what it does, it takes guts to recognize that the brand name doesn’t mean everything. Ultimately, finaid and a challenging science program drove me to my decision; it was still a very, very tough call.</p>
<p>There were at least 20 kids who were closet-Ivy-applicants and didn’t tell anyone because as much as they wanted to go, they couldn’t stand the pity if they didn’t get in. Some people IMO, wanted to get in to prove their smartness and worthiness to others–I had this same Ivy-mentality until I really dug into different colleges and stopped giving even half a crap to the crap that other people thought. And my high school can be horrible…kids talking smack about you or calling you dumb just because you didn’t get into a coveted Ivy. There’s some perpetuating myth that says “And on the fifth day, God declared all non-Ivy people stupid.” So I’d say a bunch of this comes from peer, family, and societal pressure, the idea that only Ivies are worthy of recognition. <em>shrugs</em></p>
<p>Yes, I’d like to go to an Ivy. Why? The Ivies are top schools in the northeast, close to where my family will be moving. So why not want to go to a prestigious school close to (a new) home? Individual aspects of each school may come into play in particular inclinations toward certain schools, but it doesn’t mean I shouldn’t want to go to an Ivy, does it? Of course not.</p>
<p>@aymiusa: if you don’t mind me asking, I’m curious as to what state you’re in.</p>
<p>@GMTplus7:
I actually don’t put too much stock in those recruiter rankings; there seems to be some size bias there (that is, recruiters are more biased to bigger schools as there are more kids there, but as a student, you may not actually get as many opportunities at BigStateU because there are more applicants).</p>
<p>However, 10 years out, Illinois grads at the 75th percentile earn more than the median Harvard grad (of those who didn’t go to grad school).
However you spin it, considering that only a small percentage of UIUC students could have gotten in to HYPS, that really shows that it’s up to the individual, not the school (assuming that worst-case, you’re smart/talented/hard-working enough to go to a good state school).</p>
<p>Ivy name travels far in places like Wall Street. The “prestige” can actually be pretty important.</p>
<p>I am applying to “only” 3 Ivies, I’d like to get into a top school, doesn’t have to be an ivy (MIT, Stanford, caltech), but I wouldn’t necessarily go to these schools because a state or smaller easier private school would probably make it easier (not to mention possibly less expensive) to get into medical school which is probably (not 100% decided yet) my end goal.
Not to mention that some less “prestigious” schools are better in the programs I’m interested in than the more prestigious ones (Berkeley eecs better at engineering than caltech brown Harvard Columbia). My parents may force me to take the more prestigious school if faced with this issue though </p>
<p>@dreamchaser50:</p>
<p>Actually, on Wall Street, it’s more the alumni network.</p>
<p>In any case, there are non-Ivy schools that have networks on the Street as well (including some publics) while some elite privates have very little presence on the Street.</p>
<p>I think we’re all a little hung up on the term Ivy. It’s not a desire to attend an Ivy League school that stands out but the desire to attend an elite institution. There are about 25 to 35 of these schools. In my mind there’s no difference in perception, quality or Prestige between Williams or Brown or Pomona vs Dartnouth, or Duke vs Penn. To claim that you decided against the Ivy League to attend Swarthmore just doesn’t mean much to me. They’re the same type of institution in student make-up financially and socially along with the quality of education. All 3 of my children have been admitted to Ivy League schools only one has chosen an Ivy but they still attended schools that we’re ranked higher than some of the Ivies that they were admitted to. It wasn’t anything against the Ivies it was simply a stronger affinity for the school they chose. Which had similar characteristics to the Ivies. Now if all things are equal financially and geographically and you choose to attend UConn instead of Cornell. That would be going against the predictive academic grain. </p>
<p>The Ivy League is an athletic conference. Period.</p>
<p>@PurpleTitan I’m in Michigan, but more suburban Detroit area. There’s probably 3 to 5 pretty good private schools flanking mine on all sides so I wouldn’t say there’s no competition application-wise…</p>
<p>I agree that choice of college has a ton of factors involved, finances, area, concentration, etc.; it’s just those kids who are hardcore HYPSM who literally live their lives for it and join 10 clubs just to get in that bug me a bit. But, I won’t deny them their opinions :)</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Not historically. U of Chicago used to be (as my dad says) “a place for eggheads”. Swat also has historically been a school for true intellectuals. And Mudders, well, they are just a different breed altogether, but you better be wicked smart if you want to succeed there, just elbow grease will not cut it. Now Chicago has changed in recent years, opened up the application and marketing process, and is a lot more like the “average Ivy” now, IMHO. And Swat has had their own challenges lately, but still is a pretty intellectual place. Everybody works hard at those three schools, but you have historically have had to have a lot of purse horsepower to get in the door to start with. Not so true at the Ivies, being a rich man’s son has historically gone a long ways in admissions there.</p>
<p>@Aymiusa,</p>
<p>The ironic thing is that while HYPSM do have more grads in various coveted industries, UMich will actually work just as well in getting you where you want to go in almost everything (the only exception is pre-med, where advising at many privates will be better than at UMich, and some privates don’t, though many do, have the curves in the pre-med science classes that kill GPAs). Maaaybe MBB consulting as well, though I believe at least 1-2 if not all 3 of MBB recruit at UMich.</p>
<p>OK, I checked. MBB hire from UMich as well.</p>
<p>@PurpleTitan I agree! What I couldn’t understand was why so many at my school couldn’t see that until after they had committed there. The way they put it, it sounded worse than swallowing fire or sometime. There were a couple kids through my years who decided to give up HYPSM for UMich, but these guys knew what they wanted from college in the long run. So it does happen and people will be happy. My main problem was the finaid for me…it was a little bleak even for in-state.</p>
<p>@aymiusa:
That’s how a lot of teens feel about their in-state flagship. Something that is rare/hard-to-get is perceived as more valuable than something that most of their peers can achieve as well, even if there’s little difference between A and B (because teens are at the stage in their life when they are forming their own identity, most are not confident enough not to be swayed by peer groupthink, and almost none are worldly enough to understand how good they have it to be in a state with a good in-state option (or compared to kids in even worse circumstances outside this country).</p>
<p>And I agree that if the money is the same/close/better, go with the best school that has the best fit/culture for you.</p>
<p>My dream is to get into the top 30 schools (and most definitely the Ivy League schools).
And time is running out…for preparation. </p>
<p>I think our culture really emphasizes prestige over fit in terms of choosing a college, and that’s a huge problem. We are told that we should attend the most prestigious and difficult to get into college that we can possibly get into, regardless of whether or not we can actually succeed and be happy there. We are falsely led to believe that the most prestigious colleges give the best education, and that’s simply not true. The ivies are a great fit for some, but not all students.
Personally, I wish that we didn’t put this pressure on kids by saying that the ivies are the ultimate college goal. I think I would be happier at another slightly less prestigious, yet fantastic, college , but I still feel quite stressed by the expectations. My family expects me to apply to an ivy, and, if I get in, I will be expected by my family and friends to go. Will I be happy there? I dont know, and for that reason a part of me hopes I won’t get in.</p>
<p>@dancingtocollege If you’re absolutely sure you don’t wanna go, tank your Ivy supplements without telling anyone.</p>
<p>Here is what happened to my D. It seems like a lot, but some of the schools had just one application where you pick several schools without extra supplements. </p>
<p>Applied:
NYU
UPenn
Yale
Swarthmore
Vanderbilt (legacy)
StonyBrook
Binghamton
Oswego
Rutgers
Syracuse
Quinnipiac
Morrisville
Macaulay Honors at Brooklyn College
Borough of Manhattan Community College</p>
<p>Accepted:
All</p>
<p>Attending:
Swarthmore</p>
<p>When she visited the Ivies, she just really wasn’t find of how cutthroat the environment seemed. And she also wanted to leave the tri state area, so she chose Swarthmore :)</p>
<p>My son fell in love with Yale. He loves the liberal arts focus, the residential college system, and the drive of the students.<br>
He starts in the fall.</p>