I’m really devoted to music and don’t mind more to my schedule to get a degree in music. If you just drop the pre-med idea, is it a good idea to go into Biomedical/Aeronautical Engineering, accounting, and music? Thanks! @compmom
Thanks! I am devoted to music and definitely don’t mind adding to my schedule to get that music degree. If you just drop the pre-med idea, is BME/Aeronautical Eng, Accounting, Music a good idea or possible? Thanks! @compmom
@SDave03 that still seems way too ambitious if not impossible to me, but it will vary by school. At many schools, those 3 majors would straddle three different schools (School of Engineering, School of Business, School of Music) so you’d be looking at a TRIPLE degree and each of those schools would have its own set of required course sequences in addition to the major coursework, and there will be very little overlap in requirements between schools. Honestly, even just a double degree in Engineering and Music can be tough to do in 5 years, simply because both have a lot of required course work, including courses that have extra hours in labs and rehearsals that may meet at the same time or overlap. There may not be enough hours in the day or enough course sections to be able to create a schedule that works. At some campuses, the engineering school and music school may not be proximate (e.g. Peabody/Johns Hopkins, Eastman/U of Rochester) so travel time between two campuses can add to the scheduling challenge.
I would recommend looking at the course of study and requirements at a few schools of interest, especially those that are accustomed to such students and are likely to support the student doing a double major/degree, like Michigan, Northwestern or Peabody/JHU to get a feel for what’s required. Google “double degree (school name/school of music name).” Call or email target music schools and engineering schools if you have questions or to ask if double degrees are possible (and how long they usually take) or discouraged. Even at schools where it is possible, some individual studio teachers at top music schools might strongly discourage it because they don’t feel double degree students will have enough hours in the day to practice to meet studio standards. Every school/prof may have different policies so you have to do your homework. I’ve noticed that many of the students I have observed who went into double degree programs with music had a previous history with the studio professor (summer program, etc). I’m sure it might help if a professor has had an opportunity to observe a student’s music skills and work ethic up close so they could be confident a student could handle the demands of a double degree. Some of those students I know ended up dropping one of the degrees at some point and focusing on one or the other.
Also keep in mind that for double degrees, you will need to apply separately to the music school and engineering school (for example) - your audition needs to be up to the standards of the music school and your stats and course rigor needs to be up to the standards of the engineering school. You need to be accepted by both schools in order to do the double degree. For schools where both the music school and engineering school have low acceptance rates, that may not be easy.
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Thanks for the info! So a college nearby (Montclair State) and NJIT has some programs where you can get a degree in engineering alongside a degree of education. Now, if you were to do that and accounting, I guess there might be a slim possibility. IF you have a certificate of education (like the option of the engineering and education), is that certificate valid for, say, you teaching music? Even if you don’t have a DEGREE in a music field? Minoring in music is a good option, but you wouldn’t receive a degree fr that, would you? I apologize I’m taking your time a lot! @classicalsaxmom
See if you can do engineering and music at Montclair State. It has the Cali School of Music http://www.montclair.edu/arts/cali-school-of-music/ and also has music education.
I don’t see the point of doing the sciences and music AND accounting and it really will be too much for the time available. You will have to make some decisions.
Other double degree schools include Oberlin, Lawrence, Bard, Ithaca, Hartt, but there are many more.
Rather than trying to do everything at once, think about what you can do now that will keep as many doors open as possible for graduate/professional school when you have a better idea of your career preference.
For example, you can do a dual degree b/t engineering and music, or engineering major, music minor, and complete your med school requirements along the way. Nearly all premed requirements would be necessary for a biomedical engineering degree. If you get to the end of undergrad, you can apply to med school, a graduate music program, or an MBA program with that background. But you don’t have to have an undergraduate degree in each field to pursue it as a graduate.
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Thanks! Does a minor give you a specific degree or do you get any credit for it? Thanks! @BassTheatreMom @compmom
Not sure what you mean. The degrees are BA, BS or BM. Then you would say a “Bachelor of Science” in biomedical engineering with a minor in music, I believe.
You can enter grad school in music if your audition (or portfolio) is good enough. You can do undergrad while completely tabling the med school idea and then do one of the many programs geared to students who need to do the prerequisites after graduation. You can also do accounting in other ways.
There are many ways to go here and they are all flexible.
Relax about the future a little- think about doing what you enjoy and are good at- and let things happen 
A minor is not a degree, it’s a specific set of classes in an area of interest. Less than a major, but more than just a sample - usually about 6 classes. The courses you take in a minor are for credit, and it would be indicated as compmom described.
I had an undergraduate degree in Speech Communication and Rhetoric. I decided after college I wanted to be a doctor so I went back and took my med school prerequisites and then went to med school. So as compmom says, that’s very doable (and also common). But if you are doing a biomedical engineering degree, you will find you have most of the prereqs anyway. And you have to consider your financial situation - if adding time to get those prereqs would be a financial hardship, it would be worthwhile working them in with your undergraduate degree.
You don’t have to have a specific degree to get an MBA, a masters of music, or a medical degree. I agree with compmom - study what makes you happy and see what doors open from there.
Just found this little gem and it is really helpful. I see Jennifer in S20 while he may think Howard to be more in his vein (I might be the annoying Uncle there, lol.) thank you @compmom
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Just reread this essay and am newly impressed with its helpfulness and thorough coverage of options.
One thing that came up recently is that it does not really include double majors with one major being music and the other an academic subject. He does cover a double major within a BM with, say, oboe and theory.
I’ve always appreciated this essay and like the revised version as well as the original. Thanks, compmom, for getting in touch with David Lane and insuring that the essay lives on here.
Another case not covered in the essay is one like my son’s. Of the examples in the essay, he is most like Alexander. There was never any doubt for him that he wanted to continue both rigorous academics and conservatory level music studies. He wound up doing the Tufts-NEC dual degree program, graduating with a BS in Cognitive Brain Sciences at Tufts (where his honor’s theses was on music cognition) and BMus from NEC in both music composition and music theory. So double major and dual degrees. He also performed A TON on violin throughout his 5 undergrad years in the Tufts Orchestra, the NEC Chamber Music program, and in a series of concerts each year put on by the dual degree students. He also worked for the Tufts music dept. 3 of 5 years and was asst. conductor of the Tufts Orchestra for his last 2 years.
He continued working at Tufts for 2 post grad years and then applied to Ph.D. (or DM) programs in music composition. The depth and breadth of his musical experience combined with the strength of his scores made him a strong candidate even without an MM. He’s now finishing up his 4th year of a Ph.D. in music composition at UChicago, where he has continued to immerse himself an as many aspects of music as he can squeeze into his schedule. He’s not doing much conducting these days but he is playing in 5 chamber groups, TAing the music theory sequence, has and will teach additional music courses, and works for the music dept., all in addition to composing.
One thing he’s learned about himself along the way is that he’d rather teach in a university or liberal arts setting than in a conservatory. He likes working with people who have a passion and talent for music but also broad interests, as he does.
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I read this thread for the first time back in the fall when my son was preparing his applications and prescreens. It has been extremely helpful.
S is passionate about music, practices 6+ hours a day and wants to immerse himself in music and be surrounded by other serious musicians in college. He has received national recognition for his playing but is unsure if he wants to be a professional musician. He knows he wants to keep playing music forever.
S is also strong academically. Good grades taking a challenging course load with many AP classes. He doesn’t have a particular passion about any academic subjects but likes psychology and is entertaining the idea of getting a PhD in Psychology after college.
He decided to focus his college search on strong academic universities which also have good music schools. He also applied to schools that had good jazz programs with no stand-alone music school.
He now has a full result set at University of Michigan and does have the opportunity to pursue a dual degree with a jazz studies BFA at the School of Music Theatre & Dance and an undeclared major at the school of Literature, Science and Arts (LSA). He also got into the LSA Honors program. S thinks he would like to do the honors program. I am afraid the extra rigor will be too much to juggle with the time demands of the music program. I have heard of people that do dual degrees in more challenging subjects than Psychology, so it may be possible, but I also want him to have enough time to be social and enjoy himself.
I would appreciate hearing thoughts from those of you who have been through this either first hand or with your children. Thanks!
My D did a BS at a school that had a curriculum to follow for two concentrations (music and theater which are listed on her diploma). It would be more similar to a double major than a double degree. Her advisor was familiar with the degree and made a few calls to get her in classes. I think the success of these programs depends partly on the support at the school. However don’t confuse support with giving you a break. Regardless the expectations are high. And hopefully no theater parents read this…but the expectations in that discipline compared to music were “different” (as we politely say in MN). One was more free form (although students worked very hard) and the other more exacting. So it worked in the end. My D had friends who did arts admin and music or ballet…and that seemed very doable too.
I would also suggest being “flexible”. If he gets there and it’s too much, that’s fine. Freshman year is typically a bit easier; and still early enough to do changes. If he enters and finds it very challenging right away he will know it. He may look at his non-dual degree buddies and think…why don’t I just do what 90% of my friends are doing. There is a LOT of switching around Freshman year. Suddenly parental opinions matter less. The teacher, studio and classmates have an increased influence … which is a good thing. They really do know more.
I didn’t know if my D would stick with music. As a vocalist she had only studied music for 3 years…and she had a preference toward theater/MT. So she chose a large school where she could have other opportunities if she wanted to switch. We just took it one semester at a time early on. She figured it out … particularly with support and an empathetic ear from her teacher.
My son was in a similar situation (see my post #15 on this thread). He had the passion and talent enough to have considered pursuing music professionally, but he wasn’t sure whether he wanted to be a career musician. So, like you, we had looked deeply into a double degree route. Shortly before his college application process, however, he made up his mind to continue to pursue music but not professionally. That saved us all the effort, time and funds required for prescreen and live auditions all over the country. My son’s now in his second semester in college. In looking back, he feels he’d made the right decision. He’s happy with the decision to pursue music through his college orchestra and another ensemble while on pre-med track. That combination is quite a load, but he’s still able to pursue his other interests, such as joining the college intramural volleyball team and other clubs. And dating for the first time in college! During the winter break when he came home, he told us how our decision for him to take a gap year, too, became so instrumental in his successful and fulfilling semester.
In retrospect, I’m now less inclined to recommend a double degree route. I think a double degree route can be helpful for those who are still sitting on the fence well after high school and into college. As I stated in my post #15, though, the answer’s really in the heart of each individual. Expressing just for my son’s case, we’re very happy that he’s discarded a double degree option as early as we did.
Just reiterating that young people who follow the route of TiggerDad’s son, that is, pursuing a BA or BS, DO sometimes end up with a career in music, including grad school all the way through doctorate. It takes talent and hard work, but a BM isn’t the only way to progress.
For those reading this in the future, it can sometimes-not always- be better to pursue that BA or BS in a school without a BM program in case the best opportunities go to the BM students (but there are exceptions).
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What compmom is pointing out could be a significant factor in making one’s decision. You can major in psychology, rather than going for a double degree, and apply for a grad school in psychology or audition for MM in musical performance later, provided that the instrument skills have been kept up with. My son can change his mind during his college years and audition for an MM degree should he chooses to. While he’s pursuing a pre-med, he’s not only involved in the orchestra and another ensemble but he’s also taking the college subsidized private lessons.
Thank you for sharing your perspectives. S does have some options at schools where he can pursue a BA or BS and that are known for having good music programs. He has met some of the faculty at those schools and came away impressed. For him, it comes down to wanting to be surrounded by talented and passionate musicians and he’s afraid he won’t find enough of those types of students at a non-audition music program in a liberal arts school. That’s what is driving him to pursue the dual degree. He wants to be able to play with the best musicians while also getting a broad based education that could set the groundwork for a future career outside of music.
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“For him, it comes down to wanting to be surrounded by talented and passionate musicians and he’s afraid he won’t find enough of those types of students at a non-audition music program in a liberal arts school.”
There are many passionate and highly talented musicians who choose not to attend conservatory music schools but instead choose colleges that do not have the school of music or offer a BM degree. My son’s surrounded by highly talented musicians, one of them, in fact, is performing at the Carnegie Hall tonight. This is a girl who had a solo debut with the New York Philharmonic at the age of 13. She chose not to attend a conservatory but instead a college that doesn’t offer a BM degree. My son told me, however, she plans on going to a conservatory for her MM degree after she graduate.
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There are also students who do attend a conservatory or school of music for a BM degree and later do grad school in an academic area, or a professional school like nursing, law, business or med school. I think the point is that there is flexibility in choosing a path for musicians. For those who aren’t inclined to “sequence” in this manner, but want to pursue both music performance and an academic subject at the same time, double degrees are a great way to go, given the extra year to make it all work.
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