<p>I don’t believe anyone ever indicated that size is an <em>inherent</em> determinant, but we’re all looking out for our own DCs. In our case, DC is coming from a history of small schools (current school, 5-12, 200 kids), so even 700 just for high school will be quite an uptick. For a kid coming from a large public middle or high school, even the biggest BS might seem cozier and stronger in community. As RGBG points out, it’s the differences in opinion here that enrich the dialogue…I don’t think anyone’s trying to shout you down, DA.</p>
<p>“shout down”? not at all! I said let’s agree to disagree, and I mean it.</p>
<p>Here’s why I don’t think school size matters in this particular situation (though I’d agree it does in others); larger schools have more teachers, more deans (I assume), more classes, more dorms…so, if anything, one would think that the bigger school would make it easier to get into a class of choice (as the school will probably run more than one section) and more dorms makes for more flexibility in choosing rooms. I’m curious about what the lottery thing was all about RBGG. At Exeter, the kids just draw lots by class and choose their own rooms. My kid drew the short stick but still had plenty of choices because of seniors graduating. Incoming students get whatever’s left over. What’s different at your dc’s school?</p>
<p>@cm: one gender picked numbers out of a hat, you know 1, 2, 3…all kids got equal chance to get first or last choice based on their holding; other gender picked an element off the periodic table, then by some secret formula (no transparency to double check process), got a ranking. Headmaster did agree that although fair?..it had to be transparent to all…and hey while we’re at it, why not use an identical process going forward?</p>
<p>@RBGG, I agree, the lottery should have been identical for each gender. Perhaps the new headmaster will not allow things like this to happen on his watch. Lets hope.</p>
<p>uh huh 
10 char</p>
<p>DAndrew, about school size… There is a school of thought about the most effective size of human groups, if one wants social cohesiveness. Apparently, Malcolm Gladwell wrote about “Dunbar’s Number” in The Tipping Point. Dunbar’s number is 148. [Dunbar’s</a> number - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia](<a href=“http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunbar’s_number]Dunbar’s”>Dunbar's number - Wikipedia) To cite from Wikipedia,
</p>
<p>Many small boarding schools have student bodies of 300 or so. Then there are schools which are around 600, and some around 1200. (Really generalizing here!) At any rate, as a school gets larger, you’ll notice attempts to create smaller communities within the larger community, such as houses or residential clusters. (You’ll also note a tendency to cluster around multiples of 300.) Sports teams may serve the same function, and at some schools, the schools may encourage the students to identify strongly with their grade. The schools may not do this on the basis of anthropological research, rather because it works for them.</p>
<p>I attended a “large” public high school, and did not feel lost. On the other hand, the school did encourage students to identify with their grade.</p>
<p>Periwinkle, thanks for supporting me (I read it that way anyway). My point is that both small schools and larger school (within reason in the context of its resources) can be excellent schools. I am against the notion that a bigger school is doomed to have problems such as the ones OP raised. There are solutions to the disadvantages of both small and bigger schools.</p>
<p>Probably generalizing that big schools or small schools are better at something is not accurate. It probably comes down to the people involved. In both large and small organizations, the people hand picked for certain jobs, in a school, say interfacing with parents and students is critical. This is probably why visiting the school and getting a feel for whether or not students are happy and how you’re treated by staff when visiting are so important.</p>
<p>Interesting post, Periwinkle. I’ve read similar studies in relation to churches. The creation of smaller communities within the larger community is key here, as you point out. So if I were a parent looking at schools now, I think I’d look less at school size and more at how much thought the school has put into creating those smaller groups: whether they switch dorms/dormmates every year, opportunities for team sports and other clubs, class size, student-adviser set-ups, activities/cohesiveness within each grade etc. </p>
<p>For example, I like the way Exeter’s dorms contain a mix of grades living together on each hall and that most kids stay in their dorms all four years–makes for a diverse but tight community. On the other hand, I wonder whether the arrangements for sports isolate kids who aren’t particularly athletic. In general, groups are there for just about any interest, but the kid has to be assertive and self-confident enough to join a group that inevitably already has a number of very experienced and talented members. </p>
<p>In a smaller school, might a student find it less intimidating to try out theater or the school newspaper, just because the club or group is more in need of new members?
On the other hand, larger schools give a kid more chance to find the groups that fit him/her best. Hate to drop the f-word again, but I think, once again, that it all comes down to personality and fit.</p>
<p>Differences between big and small schools are material, but not in a way where quality can be generalized. The differences live at the individual level, what a particular student needs and wants in an environment. One structural advantage of a small school is speed of problem identification and resolution. RBGG would have have had her questions/concerns asked and answered almost immediately in a school Thacher’s size (240). But at the same time, RBGG’s son would not have the same array of Physics courses available as a Hotchkiss or an Exeter. A parent needs to calibrate at least minimally their expectations of the administration according to the size of the school.</p>
<p>getting back to the beginning theme - my daughter’s first year wasn’t perfect - there was a major snafu having to do with a sport. Personally, I still think the school dropped the ball - made a choice that was convenient for most, but not for her. I spent some time on the phone complaining. Not sure that much changed - maybe a bit. Bottom line is that next year will be much better, but I view it as a lost year for her in that specific area. And I should also make clear that a sport is a way to be with friends, keep your head steady during the winter months, have a place to be cheerful when other things might not be going your way, etc etc. No Olympic wannabes here. </p>
<p>But here’s the funny thing. I think it’s a lost year. She doesn’t. She found the alternative, which was not as good as what was taken away, but certainly not nothing. And she got more out of that alternative than anyone else could have. So she thinks it was, perhaps not a win, but a major save, and she feels pretty good about it. </p>
<p>And the rest of the year was amazing for her - she found artistic groups to join, new friends, loved the classes, found herself. So…ok, not a lost year after all. </p>
<p>With regard to the issue of who gets placed in honors courses and why - not sure any of that is adding up for me. I think I understand that in some schools a new student is not accepted to honors science/math without also being honors humanities? Isn’t there a placement test or something similar that they could take, or that the parent could request? Was the student equally enthusiastic about going straight into AP or honors, or whatever it was? Tracking is such a double-edged sword - and we’ve been on the receiving end of some wierdness in a previous school, where the thinking was that your math ability equaled your humanities ability - go figure. That was a major fight, and not something I’d care to repeat. But my impression after recovering from the battle was that the math=humanities ability equation is not widely accepted. Was I wrong about that?</p>
<p>@rbgg, I’m sorry to see you contemplating forfeiting your deposit for next year. The boarding school decision initially requires that both parents and student are onboard 110%. IMO, economics aside, after the first year the student determines whether or not they really want to return. I’ve met very few who have chosen voluntarily not to return. I think the course issue was disappointing but IMO I question if it warrants pulling the plug on the school, especially since it all worked out in the end. Now I’m unsure which school you son attends and I don’t have the academic requirement data but I always thought the incoming freshmen very rarely get much say as to all the courses they will be taking their freshmen year. Maybe a change of advisors is warranted. As for the dorm issue IMO thats neither here nor there. Who cares if the girls formula is different than the boys. It is not something for a parent to take issue with and contact the school. Its always tough on parents and siblings but the student’s enthusiasm, excitement and desire to attend should out weigh the desire to stay home. Good luck with the decision. By the way, there’s nothing wrong with wanting to be home, a place where one can never get turned down.</p>
<p>In our particular case, my son has equal humanities and math ability. His SSAt scores were something like 91% verbal and 94% Math, and Science and Math and Humanities are equally strong subjects for him.</p>
<p>The school had to make some decisions re Science Honors placement and although we never got a straight answer, I think they had only so many spots and too many requests. They used both SSAT scores as a cut off for deciding who would get into Freshman Honors Physics. Once you’re in the honors track, you can keep going if you do well, so it was really about breaking in as a Freshman.</p>
<p>I told the dean that it didn’t make sense to base admission to Honors track Science on one score on one test on one particular day, when DS has always aced Science scoring second highest in his GRADE the year before (400 kids), and had state highest honors awards on both Verbal and Math on JHU CTY testing and had straight As in English/Humanities etc. But, I get it, this was the school’s way of trying to make the best choice for the greatest number of requests. Problem was, it didn’t meet DS’s need. He started in reg Physics. No one checked back with us to see if it was too easy, how he was doing etc. Luckily it all ended well when others dropped out and he moved up; but still it would have been better for him if his request for a challenge, based on his previous work in the subject matter and his love for Science could have been requested up front. Also, I know some will think irrelevant, but Mom was a Chemistry/Physics major English minor in college and Dad was Math who went on to get PhD in applied Math from JHU. The kid has great genetic loading for Math and Science and h/we didn’t want to see it wasted.</p>
<p>at Ops, yes student and parents were 110% on board for first year</p>
<p>Re second year: it is totally up to him but he is someone who appreciates his parents’ input in a four musketeers mentality</p>
<p>Of course, I’ll take free advice at any age. Again, good luck.</p>
<p>Just in regard to the discrepancy between procedures whether it be courese or room selection for boys vs. girls. </p>
<p>I think the schools which many used to be single sex at one time, now mostly all pride themselves as being coed, those that are on the issue of equal opportunity. If coed, yes, let’s have identical processes, not separate but equal. I know that phrase which sends shivers down my spine applies not only to racial equality but gender as well. Maybe some of us are more sensitized than others, but yes, I think girls and boys need equal opportunities and identical procedures in all things Boarding School.</p>
<p>Did you find out the rational behind this practice of applying different procedures for boys and girls? You talked to the headmaster right? What did (s)he say?</p>
<p>talking to my son, the boys and girls have different deans, but they both report in to the same supervisor; I would have thought they would have known better.</p>
<p>After a couple of phone calls with Headmaster, after his probe, he focused on the issue of fairness, first making sure this was accomplished, in support of his team, but intimated he wants things transparent and identical; he said he didn’t want to throw anyone under the bus, but he could see where I was coming from in what I was hearing from DS.</p>
<p>To have different procedures for room lottery or anything else for that matter for boys vs. girls seems to me to be an embarrassment for the school.</p>
<p>Classicalmama, I’m also a proponent of fit. In general, I think small schools and large(r) schools offer different experiences. In a small school, a student can try out different interests. In order to offer an array of clubs and extracurriculars, the school expects students to wear multiple hats–newspaper editor, actor, community service volunteer. Large schools offer more clubs, etc. They have to, because they have more students. However, as each school tends to have one newspaper, debating society, etc., the students must specialize in their strongest area, in order to reach the upper levels of the activity. </p>
<p>So, in a debating tournament, a large school would be likely to defeat a team fielded by a small school, because the larger school has a deeper pool of willing debaters, and those debaters must polish their skills to remain on top of the school’s team. In the long run, though, a small school may offer more opportunities for a student to explore new interests. The hockey player who breaks a leg skateboarding may explore debating while recuperating. </p>
<p>@RBGG, I think your concerns are valid. I think it comes down to the fit for the family, as well as the student. Honestly, I don’t quite understand why you feel the housing lotteries for both boys and girls should use identical methods. However, I accept that you feel that way, and the school’s approach to this issue (and, presumably, others) bothers you. </p>
<p>I would take the headmaster’s statement that 50 kids are waiting for a spot as a sign that his patience is fraying.</p>
<p>@DAndrew, you wrote,
</p>
<p>Most of the parents who research boarding schools are leery of schools which struggle to fill their spots each year. I also question whether the parents are the schools’ customers. After all, most of the established schools draw on their endowments to cover the costs of running the schools. Alumni and parents donate to the schools, in gratitude. I could argue that the schools’ primary customers are their future alumni. The schools will only know if they met their customers’ needs if their alumni return the trust placed in them by supporting the school in the decades to come.</p>