Dual degree?

Does anyone know if it’s possible to receive two degrees from SEAS and Wharton? Is the only option to do a specialty program (Jerome Fisher) or can you get two degrees just by fulfilling the class requirements?

You can do an uncoordinated dual degree as you describe. It would require more classes though than M&T. Note that you also need to be accepted to the second school to pursue the dual degree; you would apply either at the end of freshman year, end of sophomore fall, or end of sophomore spring.

You can do a so-called uncoordinated dual degree between SEAS and Wharton, where you will essentially get the same degrees you would as an M&T. That said there are considerable advantages to doing M&T vs doing the uncoordinated dual degree:

  1. As an uncoordinated dual degree candidate you have more credits you need to take to fulfill the requirements of both schools. As an M&T many requirements are double-counted.
  2. The M&T office provides great assistance and counseling for academics/ internships and given the small number of M&T students, there is a lot of individual attention each student gets.
  3. The alumni network is extremely strong, super accomplished and given the small number of alums it is a very tight-knit community that can help a lot during recruiting and later in your career.
  4. Prestige/recognition. In elite schools circles and top business circles the prestige a program like M&T carries is quite significant.

Thanks for your input!

The reason why Im hesitating to apply to M&T (and why I didn’t when I first applied to Penn) was because the thought of studying with the same kids in the same classes for the next 4 years of college was a con for me. I’m in an advanced program in high school with the same 80 or so kids and the only thing I regret is not having met more people in other classes (I know it’s not the same in college with all the different clubs I can join etc but I would still be spending the majority of 4 years with the same people) Of course, I think M&T is an incredible program but I looked through the description and it’s just not for me.

Do you guys know the odds of getting into the second school to apply for an uncoordinated dual degree after freshman year would be? Do you know anyone who has been through this pathway? If I were to minor in Entrepreneurship Engineering, would that fulfill some of Wharton’s requirements so it would make the transition after freshman year easier?

You wouldn’t be taking the same classes with the same people from M&T. I believe there’s only one class (MGMT 237) that the M&T students only take together. Other than that one class, you’d be taking the same classes as regular Wharton and Engineering students, with those students. Yes, I know uncoordinated dual degree students (there are many of them). I don’t think you can minor in Entrepreneurship Engineering if you’re a Wharton/SEAS dual degree, but I can be wrong on that.

@jasli98 you wouldn’t be taking the same classes with the same kids all the time. M&T doesn’t have special classes that only M&T students take. Would would be taking the same classes as all the people pursuing the same engineering degree as you, and the same classes as other wharton people. There might be one class that all M&Ts have to take to together, if any at all, not sure.

As for internally applying for the dual degree, the ideal situation is to apply to wharton first and then either at the end of your freshman or sophomore year apply to do a dual degree with SEAS. The reason for doing that instead of getting into engineering and then applying to wharton is that you need at least a 3.4 (more like a 3.5+ to have a good chance) to be accepted to wharton and 3.5 is not at all easy to get as an engineering student, especially because all the introductory science and engineering classes are curved very harshly. On the other hand your grades as a wharton student will most probably be quite better and on top of that you will need only a 3.0 or better to be accepted to a dual degree with engineering as a wharton student.

Would it be too difficult to transfer into M&T after freshman year, or is applying and being accepted into the uncoordinated dual degree easier?

I was already accepted into the engineering school, which is really where my interests lie. I can’t apply for dual degree as an incoming freshman, right? When I choose my courses, are there any required courses I have to take in order to be accepted as a dual degree student at the end of freshman year, or I can just take the required courses for SEAS students?

I am aware that if I do decide to do uncoordinated dual degree, there is a possibility I will have to take another year to fulfill my credits requirements. But is there a way I can extend the maximum number of credits per semester so I can graduate on time?

You can apply to M&T at the end of your freshman year but it is ridiculously competitive, think 3.8+ GPA, which for freshman year engineering is insanely high. You can also apply for an uncoordinated degree with wharton in which case a 3.5+ and a very well articulated interest in business in your appliction, maybe also business related clubs, extracurriculars at Penn, would give u a good chance. (Wharton clubs are open to any Penn student so you can join).

All that said , I would say do not stress about it too much. Even if you are not accepted to the uncoordinated dual degree, you could pursue a second major in economics in CAS or simply pursue your engineering degree and take as many wharton/econ classes as you can fit in your schedule. You will have essentially the same recruiting opporunities etc. There are so many engineering kids who do very well in business recruiting and get jobs at top firms with amazing salaries. According to a forbes ranking, Penn SEAS salaries are higher than Wharton’s.

So try for it but don’t get too caught up in this whole thing.

Lastly, yeah with the uncoordinated degree the load is considerably higher and you might need to take an extra semester/year. Generally, as long as you keep you GPA above a 3.0, you will be able to get permission to increase your course load beyond 5.5 c.u.

@Penn95 and @WhartonPenn2017 thanks for your advice! I’ll be sure to keep your responses in mind when I decide my course list next year