<p>Hello - I'm sure this answer must be buried here or at the school websites, but it's like looking for a needle in a haystack.</p>
<p>For the joint dual-degree programs, such as Tufts/NEC, Hopkins/Peabody, Columbia/Julliard..... I understand that you have to be accepted by both. </p>
<p>What I don't understand is this: is it all or nothing? </p>
<p>Do they evaluate independently of each other? </p>
<p>For eg, if you are accepted at Hopkins, and rejected by Peabody -- can you still attend Hopkins?</p>
<p>Tufts/NEC, Harvard/NEC, Columbia/Juilliard require separate academic admission to the academic institution, and a music portfolio or audition based admission to the conservatory. There then is a separate decision to allow a student to participate in the joint program. You can be accepted at both NEC and Harvard, and still not make it into the joint program. Note that these are beyond highly selective. Note also that these joint programs entail studying at two distinct unrelated unaffiliated institutions.</p>
<p>This is a bit different than Hopkins/Peabody, Oberlin College/Conservatory, URochester/Eastman. These are separate yet affiliated conservatory programs under the umbrella of a parent institution. There typically is one application with an additional conservatory app/audition. It is possible to be admitted to the conservatory musically, but denied academic admission to the university, yet still study at the attached conservatory, or vice versa be admitted academically but declined for conservatory admissions.</p>
<p>The parameters vary, and a thorough reading of the specific policies and procedures for each is required.</p>
<p>According to this article, the joint program receives anywhere between 80-130 applications, and NEC only plans to accept 4-5 DD students in a given year. And to answer your original question, yes it happens every year–folks accepted to both places, but not to the joint program. </p>
<p>Another potential landmine: getting accepted to one school in a binding ED, accepted to the conservatory via the spring audition, not accepted into the joint program, and then the applicant has no choice but to attend the ED school. I know of this happening to one applicant to the Columbia/Juilliard program.</p>
<p>Thanks N8Ma; I was less concerned with the idea of being accepted at both individually and not the joint program than I was whether or not Acceptance to School A would still be in effect if there was Rejection to School B.</p>
<p>for Columbia-Juilliard, Harvard-NEC, Hopkins-Peabody, Oberlin College-Oberlin Conservatory the applications to each of the colleges and conservatories are entirely separate (different forms, different essays, vastly different admissions criteria) and acceptance is also separate, so you could be admitted to one or the other or both and not being accepted to one will not affect acceptance at the other. It is very possible to be admitted to Columbia and Juilliard and not the joint program, same with Harvard and NEC. But Columbia and Harvard students can take private lessons - and Columbia offers free lessons from a list of adjuncts; Harvard may subsidize the costs of lessons for some students.
Oberlin has a nonbinding early decision option at the conservatory (not the college, which has a binding early admission option).</p>
<p>along the same line of questioning, now that I’ve done more research…</p>
<p>I see that for McGill and Butler (at UofT), the process is very clear: application lets you post a 2nd major choice; if you do not pass your music audition but your academics qualify you for admission, you will be evaluated for your 2nd major choice. If you pass your audition, but are not accepted thru school admissions, the school admissions decision will override the music decision.</p>
<p>NYU/Steinhardt is all or nothing, I think. I don’t think there’s an opportunity to be rejected by Steinhardt Music and accepted to NYU BA.</p>
<p>What about University of Michigan? This is a viable option for my DD with or without the music program. Does anyone know if an applicant can be rejected by the music department and accepted by the university?</p>
<p>I know this isn’t your main concern but just want to mention that for some double degree programs, such as Harvard BA/NEC MM, if you don’t get in for first year, there are opportunities to apply later.</p>
<p>Yes, you can attend Johns Hopkins if you are accepted there and rejected by Peabody-the same holds true for Rochester/Eastman, Oberlin College/Oberlin Conservatory and the converse holds true. You can attend Peabody if accepted even if you have been rejected at Hopkins. Although you cannot earn a degree from the school you did not gain acceptance to, you can usually take classes and either apply again as well as audition again.</p>
<p>It is my understanding that a Michigan applicant may apply for “dual enrollment” to the School of Music, Theatre, and Dance and either the College of Engineering or the College of LSA, and that a student may be admitted to one college and not the other. If a student ONLY applies to the School of Music, Theatre, and Dance and is not admitted to the program (s)he will not be admitted by default to the College of LSA.</p>
<p>Perhaps things have changed in 7 years…but when my kiddo was applying to college…students had to apply to UMich and be accepted academically BEFORE their music audition could even be scheduled. Is that still the case?</p>
<p>If so…then students could get accepted academically and then not get accepted into the school of music. Not everyone who auditons gets accepted as a music major.</p>
<p>@KatMT - thanks, but I am not asking about the Dual Degree program. I am indeed asking about admission to the LSA if denied admission to the SMTD</p>
<p>@Thumper - I agree. Since a student has to be admissable to UM to even be considered for SMTD, it seems reasonable that an applicant could be admitted to UM even after being rejected by SMTD. Not sure however, if it would require a 2nd application.</p>
<p>At any rate, I’ve written to UM for clarification.</p>
<p>I don’t know if things have changed since 2007. If a student applies to 2 different colleges, all you need to do is write an addition essay required by the second college/school you are applying.</p>
<p>Each school/college at UMich set its own admission standard. There is a possibility that a student may be admitted to School of Music but rejected by LSA or Engineer.</p>
<p>D’s friend applied to both Music and LSA (with pre-med focus). She passed the school of Music academic standard and was allowed to audition but was wait-listed at LSA. Unfortunately she did not pass the audition either.</p>
<p>Something to consider: what is the reason for searching for a dual program? These are generally extremely demanding, usually require 5 years to complete, and are not for the faint-hearted. I think sometimes they may seem like a good option for an “undecided” musician, but I just want to point out that in fact, all of the programs mentioned require a major committment.
As other posters have mentioned, parameters differ at different schools and I might add that there are also differences among studios and teachers, so finding a teacher who is enthusiastic and supportive of a dual degree is also something to consider.
Rice/Shepherd offer dual degrees in theory, but almost never in practice, for example.</p>
<p>RE post #19… I think you already contacted the school and found out the answer “straight from the horses mouth” … always the bast bet … </p>
<p>I inferred from my experience with students applying to UMich and from what was posted that students could apply to both LSA and SOMT&D and if admitted to LSA (but not SOMT&D) could attend LSA… however, a student denied from the SOMT&D will not automatically be considered for LSA. It is my understanding they must submit the separate application.</p>
<p>I do not know students who ahve done this with Music, but I do know students who have done this with Theatre and Musical Theatre.</p>
<p>@nycm: we were thrown into the BM research unexpectedly. As it turns out, the Dual Degree is not quite what DD is looking for. She is not undecided. </p>
<p>There are 2 issues at play:
If DD’s music teacher miscalculated her chances of admission to a BM program, we wanted her applications to also yield potential acceptances to non-BM programs (without having to process an unreasonable # of applications). </p>
<ul>
<li>Assuming she is accepted and attends a BM program, she wants to be at a school that would be a good academic fit for her even if she were not in the BM program. </li>
</ul>
<p>Her list is now a diverse range of options, and an almost-reasonable-number-of-applications, so we’re feeling confident she’ll have more than one option come April 1st.</p>
<p>I wish I could say that it was original, but I have seen the theory/practice quote attributed in various places to Albert Einstein, Yogi Berra and computer scientist / former Caltech department head Jan L. A. van de Snepscheut. That’s pretty solid company all around.</p>
… </p>