Duke, Notre Dame, Williams, or free ride to state school...desperately need help!

College Search & Selection
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<p>I thought I had made a decision, but I haven't. I'm still stuck between four different schools for different reasons.</p>

<p>I'm an intended English major and I plan to go on to law school a year or two after graduating from college.</p>

<p>I've visited all four schools, and I'm still stuck.</p>

<p>Texas A&M is offering me a full ride with the Terry Scholarship, I would be in the Honors program, and would be given lots of opportunities outside of the classroom.</p>

<p>Williams is the number one LAC, offers a year at Oxford, small class sizes (which I love), a small, but not too small community and campus, a program in NYC, and tutorials. I loved the people when I visited, but I really worry about the weather, being from a very warm place. </p>

<p>Duke...it's the highest ranked of the schools I am considering, and gave me the best financial aid by far, I visited campus and liked it, but I just don't know. The campus was beautiful, the weather was nice, but I'm honestly scared it'll be cutthroat and a little too wild for me. Something just doesn't click either. I don't find myself excited about it.</p>

<p>Notre Dame gave me relatively good financial aid, I LOVED the people and enjoyed all my time there. The size of the student body is perfect, I like the religious presence, single-sex dorms, and I felt completely at home and comfortable on campus. I'm also scared of the cold here though, and the long, gloomy winters. </p>

<p>I think as of now my top two choices are Williams and Notre Dame, but I worry about the cold and about maybe missing the opportunities I might get at Duke. My plans (which I'm pretty sure won't change) include going to law school, and I want to go to the place where I will be best prepared for a legal education at a top law school.</p>

<p>My high school counselor is all for the state school along with most of my teachers, but then again, they don't really know about Williams. </p>

<p>I've been stressing myself about this decision, and any input from you all would really help me....</p>

<p>Thanks! :)</p>

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<p>Notre Dame. It’s a great school and will provide just as many opportunities as Duke. Plus, the alumni network is amazing. And don’t forget about the football.</p>

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<p>Still, Congratulations on some good choices. My son is a graduate of Williams, and though he had an outstanding experience there, it’s not for everyone.</p>

<p>I’d say winters would be more severe at Williams than at ND. How you react to the weather often depends on having (or developing) something that you like to do in the snow.</p>

<p>Williams’ program in New York may be phased out so your shouldn’t make that a determining factor.</p>

<p>I can’t imagine any opportunities that Duke could offer that you wouldn’t get at Williams or ND. You already have three other good choices. If Duke doesn’t feel right, let it go.</p>

<p>Williams may not get a lot of recognition from neighbors or relatives outside of the Northeast, but it is very well respected by graduate and professional schools. Williams kids do very well in law school admissions.</p>

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<p>My parents are still very in love with Duke due to Duke Engage and the mentoring opportunities (which I think I could get at Williams anyway), and they seem to think that I will have an especially difficult time in the winter as we rarely see weather below 50 degrees, even in the winter.</p>

<p>Thank you for your replies!</p>

<p>Oh and another concern of mine is how big partying and alcohol is on campus, I didn’t drink at all in high school or go to any rowdy parties and I don’t plan on doing it in college. I know it will be anywhere I go, and possibly more at Williams, but I just want to know which school it’s more prevalent at and/or what kids do instead.</p>

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<p>still, for someone who leans toward the quiet life you’ve certainly chosen four very social schools! :slight_smile: </p>

<p>In my opinion – remember I’m a parent not a student – Williams reputation for wild partying is greater than reality. Yes, kids do drink, some more than is good for them or their neighbors, but there is also a critical mass of non-drinkers and light drinkers. There are many activities on campus that do not include drinking – sports, movies, lectures, performances, just hanging out with your friends. </p>

<p>This is perennial topic on the Williams board. You might ask the question there.</p>

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<p>still undecided: My S had a guy from Southern California living next door on his frosh hall. He SoCal guy adjusted well and had no difficulty with the weather.</p>

<p>Your post makes me feel that you want to go Williams, your parents favor Duke, and your counselor and teachers favor the Texas In-State.</p>

<p>I don’t know how much importance you want to accord all these voters. Are your parents dead set against Williams? Is money a factor?</p>

<p>Neither of my kids chose the college I think I would have chosen, but they each chose well for themselves.</p>

<p>If weather is all that is stopping you, I do know of warm weather kids who have adjusted well. If you don’t think you’d enjoy cold weather, that’s another story.</p>

<p>And then again, there maybe other intangible factors keeping you from Williams. I say it that way because it sounds to me as if you want to go.</p>

<p>Good luck in making your choice.</p>

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<p>If your financial aid at Duke is need-based you can negotiate with Williams to improve your package. I heard the director of FA at Williams say they are definitely open to negotiation if you have better need-based aid elsewhere.</p>

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<p>My parents definitely agree that the decision is completely up to me, but I’m just stuck between Notre Dame and Williams. I love them both and I’m having trouble deciding, and I’m not going to go to Duke or A&M unless I have a complete change of heart. I’m going to ND or Williams.</p>

<p>Electronblue, I talked to the Financial Aid office at Williams while I was there and they asked for a copy of my Duke letter, I gave it to them that same day, and they got back to me the next day…but it was still way below what Duke had given me. I don’t know if I should ask what happened, because on the revised email I received it said “based on your circumstances”…except I didn’t ask for a review based on my circumstances, I asked for it based on the fact that Duke had done way better and I wondered why Williams was asking for so much more.</p>

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<p>Go to the free state school and save your money for grad school.</p>

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<p>Williams has an exceptionally strong English program.</p>

<p>Williams has representation at Harvard and Yale Law Schools that rivals that of Harvard, Yale, Princeton, and Stanford (and Amherst).</p>

<p>You’re right that the Oxford Tutorial System at Williams makes it a compelling choice, a unique academic experience… and you’re right to be afraid of the New England weather… Be very afraid.</p>

<p>Duke isn’t the highest rank school you’re considering. With regards to student preference, Williams is overwhelmingly preferred. Notre Dame is the most prestigious out of all three schools. The athletic, drinking, and hook-up culture at Duke is insane. However, good financial aid, if money is a concern for your family, should lead you toward Duke.</p>

<p>I personally recommend Williams, since you’re already so fond of it and you’re intent on heading to law school. Notre Dame second, Duke third.</p>

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<p>I am assuming your parents can afford every option, because it would be silly to take out loans to go to Williams and (especially) Notre Dame over Duke and Texas A&M</p>

<p>Also, A&M is actually pretty decent in your field.</p>

<p>If money is no object and you can do it on mommy and daddy’s dime. I would go to Williams over Notre Dame all day every day.</p>

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<p>^ I hope you are joking about Notre Dame because it certainly is not the most prestigious of the three. The two most prestigious here would be Williams and Duke. Though both Duke and Notre Dame are known for awesome school spirit, partying, and sports, Duke is also known as a research and academic powerhouse with excellent programs in sciences, medicine, politics, etc. Notre Dame, though no doubt having excellent programs, does not have very many distinguished fields and, as a result, derives most of its “prestige” from sports fans and enthusiastic alumni.</p>

<p>Williams is a fantastic school. However, it is very isolated and can get boring/drab at times if you are not 100% into doing everything on campus for four years. Notre Dame is definitely not much better than this either and Duke would probably be stronger with Durham accessible and Chapel Hill a quick drive away.</p>

<p>I, personally, would cut out Notre Dame and narrow it down between Williams and Duke and possibly UT for financial reasons. Williams because you seem to connect with it and it is a stronger school than Notre Dame, and Duke because of the financial aid and research opportunities available.</p>

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<p>If it were a full ride to UT Austin and not Texas A and M, I would have said the answer is obvious. Sorry no insight here.</p>

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<p>I disagree and say winter in Southbend is a frozen hell hole, a lot worse than Williams. But to be quite honest, weather really shouldn’t be a big factor. Look at the academics, community, people, size, etc. not just weather.</p>

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<p>Only consider schools that you feel fit you. If Duke didn’t “click”, it didn’t click. It’s okay if it’s not for you. Unless finances must be your #1 priority, take Duke and A&M off the table. </p>

<p>Duke is <em>not</em> the highest ranked of the schools you’re considering. Williams is actually more prestigious than Duke, so if you were considering Duke mainly because you’d thought it was more prestigious than Williams, you were incorrect. Williams is elite. It’s one of the top schools in the country. </p>

<p>It sounds like Williams and Notre Dame are your true top choices. </p>

<p>Notre Dame is a great school, and certainly the best Catholic college in the US, perhaps in the world. It’s not quite as prestigious as Williams, but that’s not going to matter. It’s still really, really good, very well ranked overall, and being the #1 Catholic college is a big deal. It means the name has serious pull, and devoted alumni. </p>

<p>I have no doubt that you’ll be well able to get into a top law school from either school. </p>

<p>The weather in either place will take an adjustment at first, but there will be plenty of people from warm weather places at both schools. You can moan and complain with each other, try to take the edge off that way :lol: Spring and fall will be glorious, though. Really stunning, and you’ll find winters a lot easier to deal with if you get involved with something that is unique to the location in winter; something you can’t do in Texas, for example. Take up skiiing, learn to figure skate, learn to speed skate, join the curling team, learn to snow shoe, go sledding - do something active that takes advantage of your location, and makes winters more fun. This can <em>really</em> help, and it gives you something to look forward to in winter.</p>

<p>In my opinion, winter at Notre Dame is a bit harsher than that where Williams is located. Both have winter, yes; but there’s more sun in New England in winter than there is in Indiana, and less wind.</p>

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<p>Notre Dame garners the respect of middle and working class families as well as the respect of wealthy and powerful ones.</p>

<p>Many elitists in academia may not take it seriously, but that doesn’t change the matter that its reputation transcends social class.</p>

<p>You wouldn’t condescend to it in the same way you would look down on Penn State if you were comparing it to UPenn. This is Notre Dame we’re talking about.</p>

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<p>I agree that if you’re young and fit, weather should not be a factor. Will you avoid winters for law school where most of the best are in cold places and future jobs? You have two very top schools in Williams and Duke. Either will prepare you well for law school and give you great job recruiting if you want to work first. Both are known for their party cultures. If this is offensive to you I would choose Duke as it’s larger size gives you many more social options. But the bottom line is go with your gut.</p>

<p>Kwu, there have been many posts lately saying school like ND and NYU are prestigious based on how many people have heard of them. Does that really make sense to you? The average guy on the street will not be hiring you or deciding if you’ll get into grad school.</p>

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<p>With regards to NYU, are we talking about Tisch and Stern, and finding work in New York City here? I’m pretty darn sure that one would have superior success with employment in NYC if one were a graduate of either of these schools of NYU.</p>

<p>ND has a very strong and loyal alumni network. Is your implication that Wall Street is the impregnable bastion of the Ivy League, and that graduates of ND wouldn’t fare well there? You’re probably right, though fad-mags like Business Week have been singing praises of Mendoza.</p>

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<p>Duke didn’t give you the best aid if another school is offering a free ride. And if something about Duke seems wrong to you, you probably should not go there. Also, for me, free beats not free, especially since you think that Texas A&M is also offering a lot of opportunities outside of the classroom.</p>

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<p>A&M honors degree with no undergrad debt is the way to go if your family is not well off. You could end up really regretting the $300 per month student loan payment (for 20 years!) someday. Believe me, Notre Dame and Duke are on the top of my short list if i had to do it over; they are amazing institutions… But we all have to start being realistic about our financial futures and college debt is a great place to begin.</p>

<p>If money is not an issue… Go Irish!</p>