Duke vs. NW vs. Penn vs. WashU vs. Rice vs. UChicago

<p>Hey, please help me decide which seems like the best fit for me. I know that I should visit these schools, but the truth is that I can't visit * all * of these schools. Anyways, please tell me which seems like the best fit for me and why. Also, if any of these schools seems completely wrong for me, please let me know as well. Here is what I'm looking for:</p>

<p>** Strong Pre-Medical Program: ** great advising programs that can show me places for internships, research, etc.; great science classes/teachers that can really prepare me well for the MCAT's</p>

<p>** Competitive, but Not * Too * Competitive: ** i would definitely like to have super bright people around me that can push me to my best, but i don't want people to be cutthroat; somewhat laid-back atmosphere where people help each other out; i don't want grade inflation necessarily, but i don't want a school where there is tons of grade * deflation *</p>

<p>** Nice Surrounding City: ** i know that i won't leave campus every single weekend and go out, but i want the possibility to go out to a great city... it doesn't have to be a * big * city, but i want to be surrounded with numerous opportunities to experience things like sports, great restaurants, and maybe even a museum or a broadway show every once in a while</p>

<p>** Pretty Good Social Life: ** i'll be honest... i'm not the biggest party man. however, i really like hanging out with friends, but i don't want to have to go to hardcore parties every weekend in order to have fun. i'd like to have social places where i can simply relax and chill with friends</p>

<p>my biggest concern is Durham… i hear it’s not amazing and some have said it’s dull?</p>

<p>I definitely want to recommend Northwestern. The Honors pre-med program is astounding. The people there are competitive, but the atmosphere is really friendly and not cut-throat. The campus is just absolutely beautiful. Its surrounding city is Chicago, and it’s so much cleaner and more beautiful there compared to NYC, which is extremely dirty and crowded. And honestly, with so much to do in the campus as well as the city, not a lot of people resort to partying, drinking, or shooting up strange drugs.</p>

<p>Duke has a solid pre-med program too. And I’d look in to see what UPenn and UChicago has to offer in pre-med as well. Overall, these three schools are phenomenal. And concerning rankings, they are higher than Northwestern. But honestly, it all comes down to which places you are actually granted acceptance.</p>

<p>Strong Pre-Med:
Penn, Duke, Rice, and WashU have the strongest premed programs here (strongest defined as renown, acceptance to med school, etc)</p>

<p>Competitive but not “too” competitive:
Northwestern, Duke, and Penn meet this description (WashU, UChicago, and Rice are all known for being grade deflated and very competitive)</p>

<p>Surrounding City:
Northwestern, UChicago, and Penn win here (Duke’s Durham is the worst)</p>

<p>Social Life:
Penn, Duke, Northwestern (Chicago and WashU, on the contrary are known for a lack of social life)</p>

<p>Based on this brief analysis I would say that your order of satisfaction with these institutions would be:</p>

<p>Penn
Duke/Northwestern
Rice/WashU/Chicago</p>

<p>If city wasn’t a big factor I’d say go with Duke but I think Penn is clearly your best choice here.</p>

<p>I’m from Chicago, lived 5 minutes away from Northwestern, went to Duke, UPenn was my second choice, and visited Wash U twice (played in tennis tournament in Forest Park at least three times). (Never been to Rice so I can’t talk much about that). I’d say all are great choices and anybody saying one is a clear choice is biased. </p>

<p>Being from Chicago, I thought Durham would be a big negative, but honestly there is more than enough to do around campus and the city. It’s not like it’s in the middle of nowhere like Dartmouth or Cornell - it’s in a triangle of 1.5 million people. It’s not dull at all. There are plenty of great restaurants, bars, clubs, theaters, performances, etc. I will say, though, that it’s definitely beneficial to have a car or know somebody that does (I didn’t, but plenty of friends did). You spend the vast majority of your time on campus, so I personally would rather have a nice campus while sacrificing the surrounding areas. And getting to a place 15 miles away only takes 15 minutes! It’s amazing! Unlike Chicago, where going 8 miles on the L or driving on the Stevenson takes like 50 minutes. So, while stuff is more spread out, it’s quite easy from a time perspective to get there (assuming you have access to a car; there’s also a Robertson bus if you want to go to Chapel Hill, which is a great college city). </p>

<p>Oh, and by the way, in Chicago and Philly you can’t even get into a bar until you’re 21. So, while there are hundreds of possibilities in those cities, people underage often just party on campus anyways so it doesn’t make any difference. Unless you have a fake…or are a senior. In Durham, since it caters to a college population, anybody can walk into a bar/club. They just don’t get a wristband so can’t order alcohol, but can still partake in everything else. Evanston is the same way - all bars are 21. There was one (The Keg) that would often let in people underage, but it got busted. Chicago bars don’t need college clientele and would rather have people buy a lot of liquor. A bar in Durham can afford to let people pay $5 to get in so that they can hang out/party with other friends. (I realize major cities aren’t just for bars though, and offer other amenities, but just thought I’d point out this fact that often gets overlooked).</p>

<p>Having said that, I’ve been to downtown Evanston probably 1,000 times and I’d definitely say it’s a better city. Evanston and Durham do have some major similarities in that they’re like two cities in one - one “city” is fairly wealthy with a lot to do and one area is poor and run-down. In Evanston, though, the nice area is pretty much centered around the lakefront where Northwestern’s campus is since that’s the prime real estate so it’s more expensive to be there. And downtown Evanston is in that area too so it’s easily walkable. The “bad” part of Evanston is pretty much all west, so I guess Northwestern students aren’t as exposed to it since it’s not in their immediate vicinity. Durham, on the other hand, is more spread out and its areas aren’t as well defined. Southpoint mall is nice but is in a random location and there are some great restaurants in Durham as well as a new Performing Arts center. There are more “shady” areas closer to Duke’s campus so that’s why it gets the reputation, but if you choose your spots, Durham is quite a nice livable city with a lot of charm. Both cities are very racially diverse.</p>

<p>Based on people I know (which is at least 15) at Northwestern, they don’t go into Chicago very much at all, but I guess it’s nice to have the option. I’ll also say that it seems like Northwestern students are more stressed out since they have exams so often - due to the quarter system. Every time I talk to one of them, they have an exam coming up! Also the fact that they get out in June is terrible in my mind - I started working in a lab under a Northwestern Medical School professor at the very beginning of May for a summer. A Northwestern student finally joined me in mid-June. I was able to work for a full 18 weeks (and get paid), while the Northwestern student got 10 weeks. (I realize they start a lot later too, but getting out earlier gives you the advantage in the job/internship hunt). The quarter system (getting out so late and so many exams), people seeming stressed out, and it being 5 minutes away from where I lived led me to eliminate Northwestern from my list. But some people might like the quarter system and I can’t deny it’s a good college city.</p>

<p>UChicago seems to be like the oddball on your list. It’s certainly a great school, but is a more “intellectual/independent minded” atmosphere and not as pre-professional. It’s more like Columbia in that regard. I’d say Duke/NW/Penn are fairly similar in their student body leanings/social atmosphere. I don’t know enough about Rice but I’d imagine its residence setup makes a significant difference (some may find it just what they were looking for while others may not). Wash U also has a nice academic/social blend, but I’d say it’s perhaps a bit more cutthroat from a pre-med academic perspective. Frankly, I’m not a fan of St. Louis either - I found it worse than Durham, but that’s just my opinion.</p>

<p>UChicago is located in a small pocket of a decent area in the midst of the south side of Chicago, which is pretty crime ridden and dangerous. As applies to any major city, you need to be smart, but going to UChicago doesn’t mean you’re in a great area with things within walking distance. I wouldn’t walk three blocks off campus - not good. I would MUCH MUCH rather be at Northwestern from a “where to live” perspective and ignoring academics even if you’re into cities. Getting to downtown Chicago from UChicago is about the same time as it takes to get to Lakeview/Lincoln Park from Evanston, where a lot of good bars and restaurants are located.</p>

<p>Penn is similar to UChicago in that it’s located in a more dangerous area of a major city, but I honestly like Penn’s situation a LOT more than UChicago. It’s campus is great and Philly is pretty accessible. The student body is also a lot more social/pre-professional which was appealing to me personally. </p>

<p>The reason I chose Duke over Penn was because of campus pride/unity/sports. Duke basketball really brings a sense of community to the school and people have great pride in their institution. There’s nothing like coming together for a common cause, plus I love basketball. I thought UPenn was also quite solid in this regard for an Ivy League school, but it’s not on Duke’s level. Northwestern is also decent as they have Big Ten sports, but having gone to Northwestern basketball and football games, it’s nothing like Duke basketball at all. Not a “everybody must go as a campus event” type deal. But having those sports at NW is certainly appealing in my mind. UChicago is weak in the school pride/sports department (much like Columbia), but the intellectual atmosphere does foster a sense of community if you can find your niche; it’s just not as natural as the other schools. I’d think Rice would be similar to UChicago in this regard due to the residential colleges, but again, I don’t know as much about it. Wash U is somewhere in the middle on this - no big time sports to bring the campus together but the campus layout is conducive to a sense of community. And Duke basketball connects you to the university for LIFE. You always feel a part of the school because basketball brings it to the forefront of your mind. Also Duke’s BME being so good also was a factor in my decision. ;)</p>

<p>Another thing that I personally didn’t really consider, but I’m glad Duke was positive in this regard is weather. I honestly think it’s almost as important as the surrounding city. While Chicago is great in the late spring/summer/early fall, in the winter, it’s like people go into hibernation. And you are in school for basically the entire winter while not being there in the summer. Durham is crazy hot in the summer, but throughout the school year it’s beautiful and people are out and about more. You’d think it wouldn’t make much of a difference in the quality of life/happiness, but people are MUCH more likely to walk around campus/community when it’s nice out and it leads to a more enjoyable experience. I love Chicago as a city, but in the winter it just sucks. Maybe it’d be different if I was in college, though, as I guess at least people can hang out indoors more often.</p>

<p>Really, though, all these places are great choices. You can’t go wrong. I was attracted to the academic/social balance of Duke and a beautiful campus with a great basketball program and sense of community, but others might prefer the more intellectual/quirky atmosphere of UChicago. I think NW/Penn/Duke are more similar, while Wash U/Rice/UChicago are the other grouping.</p>

<p>I think the differences are actually probably more exaggerated and most people would be happy at any of these fine institutions. Sorry for the length. Let me know if you have any questions. Good luck!</p>

<p>Could you comment on comparing premed at Duke, UNC Chapel Hill, URochester REMs and Brown PLME? Thanks</p>

<p>thanks! the more informed, the better. plus, i’m actually a HUGE basketball fan as well.</p>

<p>I spent a year at Rice before coming to Duke for its environmental science program (it wasn’t quite strong at Rice). That being said, I think Rice would be a great fit for you, as well as Duke. Rice is in Houston, which is the nation’s 4th largest city, and it is not too far away from downtown or uptown. There is a shopping area, called Rice Village, within walking distance from campus and a metrorail line that you can ride for free to Downtown Houston or to Reliant Park (where the Houston Texans play and also where the major concerts are). It is also next door to the world’s largest medical center that has 20+ hospitals/medical institutions, and none of the medical centers at any of the other schools (including Duke’s) can compare with the TMC. So if you want research opportunities and internship opportunities in the health sciences, there are plenty through the Texas Medical Center. Rice also does not have Greek life; instead, it has a residential college system, which, in my opinion, is more inclusive than Greek life. Most of my friends back at Rice have been quite happy with their experience there. I highly suggest visiting and applying to Rice, since it seems to be a great fit for you. Additionally, Rice is more generous with merit aid (which is why I went to Rice in the first place) than all the other schools you are considering. Good luck, and you can PM me with any questions about Duke/Rice.</p>

<p>bluedog, i am exploring similar options as HogwartsHopeful, WashU and Duke being my top two. (I’m from Chicago too, so washu is the best location-wise). Did you major in BME? (you mentioned program strength at Duke). Can you please comment more on your experience in that respect? Was the premed presence in BME classes overwhelming? I want to go into engineering, not medicine. Any other comments would be appreciated!:)</p>

<p>@kate225. Yes, I majored in BME at Duke. It was definitely a great experience and Duke’s program is top notch. However, be prepared to be challenged - it’s not an easy major to say the least. Also, it’s definitely an engineering major so if you’re expecting biology, then major in biology. One thing I find really great about engineering at Duke is the opportunity for research. I just got a letter that noted that 95% of Pratt students participated in engineering research either through a summer internship or on campus. 95%! That’s just ridiculous. (I conducted research in an assistant BME’s professor lab on campus, by the way). At a lot of schools, only the top students get that opportunity, but it’s really widespread at Duke which most definitely gives you a HUGE advantage when applying for employment upon graduating. </p>

<p>The pre-med presence in the BME program at Duke is not overwhelming. You don’t really notice a difference between the pre-med students and non pre-med ones (I wasn’t pre-med). Duke BME is about 1/3 pre-med. I’ve heard Hopkins is much higher and Wash U might be too. (Supposedly, Hopkins curriculum is more physiology-focused than Duke’s, while Duke is broader is applying engineering principles and practices. Haven’t examined Wash U’s curriculum, but a friend of mine is getting his PhD in BME there now and seems to enjoy it). I’m definitely glad I chose to attend Duke - perfect blend of academics/social life/athletics in my mind and a great program to boot. </p>

<p>Another thing I didn’t consider when applying, but ended up being a huge positive, is the massive amount of recruiting done at Duke by consulting/finance firms. Going in, I thought I was 100% dedicated to engineering for my career, but things change…Duke having such a pipeline in those industries ended up being a great thing for me. (Ended up with 3 non-engineering job offers). Those types of firms love analytical minds; and engineers often exhibit those qualities. From what I’ve heard, Wash U isn’t quite as heavily recruited as Duke from these firms (especially by East Coast firms), but you could certainly make it work as it’s a great school. Also, their presence in the Midwest is strong. So, I’d say just keep an open mind as your interests might change so don’t be too fixated on a particular program and look at the larger picture. </p>

<p>Wash U is a great school, too, although they annoyed me greatly by sending me two pieces of mail a week! Come on, save some trees! :wink: Plus, at least at my school, all the very top students who applied there as more of a safety got waitlisted, while those near the top but not the very top got in. Their admissions practice is just odd in my mind and people tend to think they play games to increase yield/decrease acceptance rates…although that has no bearing on the quality of the institution once you enroll so I guess it shouldn’t affect anything. I ended up not applying to Wash U, but hold it in very high esteem. Visit both and see what feels right. If you have any other questions, feel free to PM me.</p>

<p>bluedog, thanks so much! all of this info. is very helpful. after i see if i’m actually in, i may have more questions so i’ll keep you in mind!</p>

<p>Four family members are Duke grads-one recent BME. Youngest child passed on Duke (and Harvard) and was BME at Rice. For my money, and it was my money, he received the best education in an environment that is unique due to the residential college system and research opportunities for undergrads.</p>