<p>Money is definitely a concern and going instate for mich would save some money but idk if duke would be better in terms of job prospects?</p>
<p>Both are great schools. Very similar. Great academcis and athletics. Duke is a little bit better academically, but if U mich would save you money id go with umich.</p>
<p>These are both fine choices and, for a Michigan IS student with financial concerns, a tough choice. If you are fortunate enough to be accepted to both, then compare financial packages and judge whether the extras of Duke are sufficiently important to you in making your decision. </p>
<p>I would contend, however, that they are not that similar in many respects (overall size, class sizes, overall strength of student body, IS/OOS student mix, locale, type of town, weather, etc). AA is a better college town than Durham although many Duke students will also frequent nearby Chapel Hill as part of their social life. I would agree that sports plays a prominent role on both campuses, although the football scene at Duke is far inferior to what you’ll find at U Michigan.</p>
<p>University of Michigan- Ann Arbor</p>
<p>Are you sure about the cost difference? I just hate to see anyone rule a place out early, before they know for sure what any potential aid/scholarships might be.</p>
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</p>
<p>They’re not very similar at all. The only good athletics team Duke has ever had was their basketball team and I don’t think it’s been doing too hot lately.</p>
<p>Gloed, what are you thinking about majoring in? For something like engineering, I definitely would not go to Duke over Michigan, for example.</p>
<p>Gloed. Go to Michigan. It is not worth the extra money to go to Duke if it puts you in a huge amount of debt. Imo, In terms of notoriety, the advantages that Duke has over Michigan is nominal. Also if you are a fan of rankings, Duke and Michigan are peers academically according to USNWR. The biggest difference is the student body, where the overall scoring averages of Duke students are higher than those at Michigan.</p>
<p>
A recent ranking of academics/athletics puts Duke (#8) not too far behind Michigan (#4).</p>
<p><a href=“http://elite50.stack.com/top50.aspx[/url]”>http://elite50.stack.com/top50.aspx</a></p>
<p>
Probably not. </p>
<p>
Agreed. This is a pointless conversation until you have both financial aid packages in hand. The private universities on my list ended up considerably cheaper than my flagship public university, so don’t assume anything.</p>
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<p>I thought he/she meant similar in something a little more meaningful than a one dimensional ranking. In terms of culture (medium-sized private vs big 10 public), weather and location they’re completely different.</p>
<p>^
Obviously. The link was in reference to the claim that basketball was Duke’s only strong sport, which is patently untrue (e.g. lacrosse comes to mind).</p>
<p>Oh yes the very popular sport of lacrosse. I watch it on tv every chance I get.</p>
<p>
Don’t be hatin’. At least Duke doesn’t have to resort to bragging about its cricket team like Haverford does. ;)</p>
<p>LOL. I see cricket more than lacrosse. Well crickets at least.</p>
<p>Psh, Duke lacrosse is forever tainted - even though the trial worked out in their favor, I live in one of the country’s most highly recruited areas for lacrosse, and few people hear of Duke lax without cringing.</p>
<p>It will take some time for people to get over it. I know the Fab 5 controversy effectively killed Michigan’s BB program for years. It’s just starting to get back into prominence now.</p>
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<p>When I think great athletics, I think athletics you can really get into with your fellow classmates like football and basketball. There are few sports other than those two that can bring together an entire campus and are truly fun to watch with friends. I’m sure Duke has about 500 different teams, and maybe they have great Judo champions or something (not to knock people who practice martial arts) but it’s not exactly a spectator sport. In this light, I believe Michigan (come on, Michigan football is huge) is a better pick for that.</p>
<p>Not to mention Michigan hockey. Also huge!</p>
<p>You might find some of the following comparisons to be useful:</p>
<p>O B J E C T I V E D A T A </p>
<p><strong><em>STUDENT BODY</em></strong><br>
UNDERGRADUATE ENROLLMENT<br>
Duke 6394 U Michigan 26083</p>
<p>NUMBER OF IS STUDENTS (% OF STUDENTS)<br>
Duke 959 (15%) U Michigan 17736 (68%)</p>
<p>% OF FEMALE/MALE STUDENTS<br>
Duke 50%/50% U Michigan 50%/50%</p>
<p>% OF WHITE, BLACK, ASIAN, HISPANIC, INTERNATIONAL STUDENTS<br>
Duke 58%/10%/19%/6%/6% U Michigan 71%/6%/12%/5%/5%</p>
<p>% OF STUDENTS IN FRATERNITIES/SORORITIES<br>
Duke 30%/42% U Michigan 15%/17%</p>
<p>% WHO PARTICIPATE IN STUDY ABROAD<br>
Duke na U Michigan na</p>
<p>AVERAGE HIGH/LOW IN FEBRUARY<br>
Duke 54-30 U Michigan 34-19</p>
<p><strong><em>RETENTION & GRADUATION RATES</em></strong><br>
FRESHMAN RETENTION RATE<br>
Duke 96% U Michigan 96%
-% OF STUDENTS WHO GRADUATE IN 4 YEARS:<br>
Duke 86% U Michigan 70%
-% OF STUDENTS EXPECTED TO GRADUATE IN 6 YEARS:<br>
Duke 93% U Michigan 81%
-% OF STUDENTS WHO DO GRADUATE IN 6 YEARS:<br>
Duke 94% U Michigan 88%</p>
<p><strong><em>FACULTY RESOURCES</em></strong><br>
-% OF CLASSES WITH <20 STUDENTS<br>
Duke 70% U Michigan 44%
% OF CLASSES WITH 20-50 STUDENTS<br>
Duke 25% U Michigan 38%
-% OF CLASSES WITH 50+ STUDENTS<br>
Duke 5% U Michigan 18%
-FACULTY/STUDENT RATIO<br>
Duke 8/1 U Michigan 15/1
% OF FULL-TIME FACULTY<br>
Duke 97% U Michigan 92%</p>
<p><strong><em>STUDENT STRENGTH</em></strong><br>
-% ACCEPTANCE RATE<br>
Duke 23% U Michigan 50%
-TOTAL SAT/ACT RANGE (Middle 50%)<br>
Duke 1340-1540/29-34 U Michigan 1220-1420/27-31
SAT CRITICAL READING RANGE (Middle 50%)<br>
Duke 660-750 U Michigan 590-690
% OF STUDENTS SCORING 700+ ON SAT CRITICAL READING<br>
Duke 60% U Michigan 23%
SAT MATH RANGE (Middle 50%)<br>
Duke 680-790 U Michigan 630-730
% OF STUDENTS SCORING 700+ ON SAT MATH<br>
Duke 68% U Michigan 43%
% OF STUDENTS SCORING 30+ ON ACT<br>
Duke 72% U Michigan 45%
-% OF STUDENTS RANKING IN TOP 10% IN HS CLASS<br>
Duke 90% U Michigan 92%</p>
<h1>OF NMS FINALISTS IN 2007 (% of entering students)</h1>
<pre><code>Duke 90 (6%) U Michigan 62 (1%)
</code></pre>
<p><strong><em>FINANCIAL</em></strong><br>
COST (Tuition & Fees) FOR OOS & IS<br>
Duke $37,525 U Michigan $32,401/$11,111
USNWR 2009 FINANCIAL RESOURCES RANK<br>
Duke 11th U Michigan 35th
ENDOWMENT SIZE (PER CAPITA undergrad and grad)<br>
Duke $450,360 U Michigan $184,494
% OF UNDERGRADUATES WHO WORK PART-TIME<br>
Duke na U Michigan na
% OF STUDENTS WHO RECEIVE FINANCIAL AID<br>
Duke 39% U Michigan 40%
% OF FINANCIAL NEED MET & AVERAGE SIZE OF PACKAGE<br>
Duke 100%/ $31,014 U Michigan 90%/$11,014
ALUMNI GIVING %<br>
Duke 40% U Michigan 18%</p>
<p>S U B J E C T I V E D A T A </p>
<p>USNWR 2009 RANK<br>
Duke 8th U Michigan 26th</p>
<p>USNWR PEER ASSESSMENT SCORE<br>
Duke 4.4 U Michigan 4.4</p>
<p>USNWR 2009 RANK EX-PA<br>
Duke 6th U Michigan 37th</p>
<p>RANKED BY USNWR FOR EXCELLENT CLASSROOM TEACHING<br>
Duke YES U Michigan NO</p>
<p>Acceptance rate of Michigan for 2008 was 42% in 2008. Just one of I’m sure many incorrect data points that is presented here as fact. If you like to look at rankings, just check out USNWR rating numbers of departments. One by one in more cases than not, you’ll see Michigan listed ahead of Duke over and over again. Of course hawkette won’t ever point out those statistics. They make Michigan look like the great school that it really is. “USNWR 2009 RANK EX-PA”, lol. Like that doesn’t show prejudice? By the way hawkette, the OP is instate for Michigan, so the OOS tuition comparisons are meaningless.</p>
<p>rjko,
USNWR reports data on a lagged basis. In order to guarantee an apples-for-apples comparison, the numbers reported are accurate for the year when data is available for all schools. If you’d like to present other data points to substantiate your argument in favor of U Michigan, then please do so. (Hint to rjko: ad hominem personal attacks do not buttress your argument.)</p>
<p>Many people object to the USNWR ranks, both by category, subject area and for PA scoring. As a result, I have tried to avoid posting specific ranks and will let the reader see the objective data and draw his/her own conclusions about its importance. </p>
<p>USNWR Ex-PA scores are presented above in the section marked “Subjective Data.” That is where they belong along with USNWR rank, PA score, and Assessment of Classroom Teaching Excellence.</p>
<p>I have presented both the IS and OOS tuition rates for U Michigan. The presentation of data will likely be reviewed by other than the OP, many of whom could be OOS applicants.</p>