@nocreativity1
I am serious. Contact the school and new president if you want to know what their plan is. Don’t expect random people on this thread to know.
@dadof2d So I assume that means you couldn’t find any news stories or public announcements from the school describing a path to financial stability, any expressions of positive student experience in the school newspaper or hard data that depicts positive student outcomes? Should I also believe you weren’t being facetious with your initial wording
" Earlham has selected a new president and she started on July 1. Perhaps you could share your opinions with her. I’m sure she will be anxious to hear from you."
When people don’t like your message and the facts are on their side the normal response is to respond with facts. When people don’t like what you are saying but the facts are not on their side, they tend to attack the commentator personally , offer distractions such as calling the President and not offering facts of their own.
Please anything you can point to factually much appreciated as the intent of CC is for these very types of discussions. CC provides readers with insights, experiences and opinions on specific colleges. The school has remained extremely tight lipped about their intentions in spite of being publicly “called” out by their board of trustees chairperson and having a president resign after less than a year. Reaching out to the new president for comment will produce nothing and I suspect you know that.
@Dadof2Ds You previously started a thread entitled “Does anyone have any current information about Sweet Briar?” and followed with “does anyone have any news stories about Sweet Briar”. Thankfully no one responded to you dismissively by suggesting you contact the colleges President.
I am suggesting my request for Earlham info and news has no less merit or potential ability to help inform undecided candidates than your thread for Sweet Briar. I continue to encourage you to provide your researched insights, news stories and opinions on Earlham.
“So I assume that means you couldn’t find any news stories or public announcements from the school describing a path to financial stability, any expressions of positive student experience in the school newspaper or hard data that depicts positive student outcomes?”
What? That would be an erroneous assumption. Others have offered positive information about Earlham to you in this thread and in other threads, and you dismiss it out of hand or ignore it.
I repeat “Your concern over an unsustainable financial model is admirable. Earlham has recognized that it is unsustainable, and is working on changing it. That is how things work in the real world of organizations. Demanding explanations from random people on the internet will probably not quench your thirst for information. May I suggest that you contact the college directly with your questions and concerns.”
No one on this forum has the information or the means to answer your questions. It has to come from the school officials or others very close to the situation, not random people on the internet. Again, I am serious - reach out to the college. They may or may not be willing or able to share the information that you seek, but they are the only ones that can give you the information.
Concerning my request for information about Sweet Briar, Sweet Briar is mentioned very little on CC and I was hoping to get some current information from students or parents, as it may be a candidate school for D22. I received some very good information via pm. As with Earlham, I am rooting for the school - I really hope Sweet Briar’s reorganization is successful. I did have specific questions about finances and information in the CDS, which I asked the school directly. And yes, they did answer my questions. Funny how that works.
@Dadof2d A question… In the absence of the school supplying an answer to how they plan on creating a sustainable financial model, would you send your child to Earlham? Clearly you wanted that answer for Sweet Briar so I was wondering if you would require the same transparency and clarity from Earlham.
I understand that the situation the Earlham will take time (years) to work through, and I sincerely hope that the new president will be able to take them in a positive direction. I expect that by the time D22 is selecting a college, Earlham’s future will be more clear. I have no idea if Earlham will make her final list or not, but we certainly aren’t removing it from consideration now for its current financial troubles.
However that doesn’t answer my question.
If a clear plan that as you point out would take years isn’t in place would you send her? Alternatively would you risk sending her without knowing the steps to be taken and whether or not they would impact her experience?
We both wish for the best and know there needs to be changes made. The issue is would you take the risk of not knowing the changes? I suspect not but anxious to hear your direct response.
@dadof2d My question in #66 was respectfully asked of you (sorry I didn’t tag you). Rather than the more convenient (not everyone has the luxury of waiting until 2022) question you choose to answer, how would you advise current students and parents who will be reading this assuming Earlham doesn’t offer a plan publicly… should they also ask the President before applying as you suggest I do?
In light of the Chairwomen of the boards statement that the financial situation is unsustainable, the prior Presidents resignation in less than a year and the absence of public comment from the new president to address the ongoing financial deficits, students apparent didisatsfaction given the school paper articles I referenced, and a 64% graduation rate would you want your kid to apply “currently” to Earlham in the absence of clarity on how the economic challenges were going to be addressed?
As you referenced in the “real world” answers take time, but in the real world the risk of uncertainty is one students don’t need to take given the numerous alternatives available to them at more financially secure and transparent schools.
My advice to “contact the college directly with your questions and concerns” was aimed at you, not anyone else. I am not advising any parents or students, but replying to you. I am sorry you are having a difficult time understanding what I am saying.
I will try one last time:
Again, no one on this forum has the information or the means to answer your questions. It has to come from the school officials or others very close to the situation, not random people on the internet. Again, I am serious - reach out to the college. They may or may not be willing to share the information that you seek, but they are the only ones that can give you the information.
As for us (not providing advice for anyone), Earlham’s current issues would not keep it off our list for admission in the near future.
@Dadof2d thanks for being so patient and responding. I must say I am surprised that the current lack of clarity wouldn’t prevent you from having your daughter apply. Particularly given your awareness of what transpired at Hampshire college…
https://www.hampshire.edu/news/2019/01/15/january-15-2019-letter-from-president-nelson
You will recall that after the departure of their President, Hampshire announced they would seek out a strategic partner and not rrecruit a freshman class in pursuit of “a thriving and SUSTAINABLE future”. Similar language and chain of events to Earlham in some ways…
You commented:
“What an unfortunate turn of events for Hampshire. It appears that the current President and Board have committed Hampshire to a path that will ensure its closure, not ensure its future as a functioning college.”
“I agree that the President and Board know more than we do, but it is not helpful if they are not communicating it.”
“I have questioned the low retention rates with parents and students at Hampshire”
Lastly your empathetic words in responding to a father whose daughters college experience was destroyed having not demanded answers to the financial future of the schools she applied to resonated with me…"I’m sorry for you daughter. What a rocky ride-hopefully she will find another school that suits her. "
I respect your willingness to look past some of the Earlham warning signs (particicularly given your prescient concern regarding Hampshire’s retention rate) but we will have to agree to disagree. I would want answers before applying.
One last disclaimer I am not suggesting Earlham is going the way of Hampshire. I am however agreeing with the schoolsChairperson that the status quo is not sustainable and would need to understand the path forward before sending my kid there.
@Dadof2d I wanted to perhaps further the discussion by answering a question you had previously asked about another school…
“Perhaps the real news is that Forbes gave them a “B” financial grade last year. How do you go from a B rating to closing the doors in a few months?”
Forbes provides a static matrix evaluation. This means they take current operating numbers and utilize ratio analysis juxtaposed against a matrix of the entire universe of colleges. They neither look in detail at the school or take a going forward approach. This is simply designed as a “moment in time” glimpse for non financial professionals.
Moody’s on the other hand goes into name specific detail, is forward looking and regulated to be truthful to the best of their ability. Moodys withdrew its rating of Earlham in 2016 “For business reasons”. Given that the issuer of municipal securities (in this case Earlham) normally pays for a Moody’s rating, the likelihood is that Earlham refused continued coverage based on Moody’s fulfilling their fiduciary obligation and downgrading Earlham debt several times.
Prior to the withdrawl of rating Moody’s released the following statement…
"Moody’s Investors Service has downgraded Earlham College (Earlham) to Baa1 from A1. The outlook is negative. The downgrade to Baa1 reflects deepening operating deficits which are expected to last for an extended period of time as the college invests in repositioning itself to address fundamental student demand challenges.
SUMMARY RATING RATIONALE:
The downgrade to Baa1 from A1 is driven by Earlham’s challenged student demand, with declining net tuition revenue since 2009 leading the college to a position of fundamental financial imbalance. As the college works to implement its strategic plan that invests in its campus facilities, academics and the student experience, expenses will continue to grow. We now expect increasing operating deficits in the medium term, with declining deficits throughout the decade and potentially longer depending on the success of the college’s repositioning efforts. Sustaining the college’s rating at this time are significant expendable financial resources, providing it with an extended period of time to address current challenges. Our rating factors in some decline in financial reserves to fund the plan, but we also note that the college’s rating is increasingly vulnerable to financial market losses since its resources are the primary credit positive. The negative outlook reflects the possibility of further credit deterioration should operating losses or declines in liquidity be even greater than currently expected.
CHALLENGES
*Total net tuition revenue has declined by over 22% since 2009 with tuition discounting rising to nearly 60% as the college faces a challenging market environment.
*As it attempts to distinguish itself over the next several years, educational expenses per student, which are already up by over 20% over the past five years, are likely to climb further.
*With limited revenue growth in the near term, and an outlined strategy relying on investments with plans to implement cost reduction initiatives, Earlham’s operating deficits will be larger than previously expected and are now expected to extend through the end of the decade.
*Earlham’s historic balance sheet strength could erode as it uses supplemental endowment draws to fund its strategic initiatives if investment returns cannot offset the draws.
*The college has a high age of plant at nearly 22 years (Moody’s calculated) although recent capital investments underway (largely funded by Series 2013 bonds) should help campus facilities and recruiting. However, the college reports low deferred maintenance needs for the campus and the calculated age of plant will be lower when the new buildings come online.
*Although the strategic plan is approved and being implemented, it will take time for any measurable results to emerge."
This is all verbatim from the release.
Many of these problems have persisted and worsened. Most troubling this was several years ago and the existence of a strategic plan is mentioned. Clearly that plan has failed. The question of what is next persists…
This was Moody’s official outlook: “The negative outlook reflects continued concerns regarding Earlham’s operations and cash flow and the need to access either internal or external funding to bridge the deficits. The negative outlook also incorporates the expected challenges the college will face to both achieve at least stable enrollment and net tuition revenues.”
Hope this helps you understand the difference between financial credit rating analysis and a magazine seeking to sell copies.
@Nocreativity1 but… you aren’t sending your kid there, and you don’t actually KNOW anything about the school. So, I just don’t get why you hop on every Earlham thread with really negative things to say about it.
You keep quoting the same info on a bunch of different threads, and moving on to the next thread ignoring the information that has been presented to you on the last one.
Anyway… you seem to be able to look up and post the info that you feel will be perceived negatively… so it seems to me that maybe you could bring the same skills to looking up the data that you are missing.
I actually created this thread so hardly “jumping on”. Please feel free to provide more up to date info or data. Go right ahead.
The Moody’s report, common data set, and news releases I have provided are all the most recent available I believe. Rather than questioning my motivations please provide hard data, stats or news rather than ad homenim attacks, speculation and opinion based on your kid going to the school.
Do you question Moody’s description of the dire situation?
Do you question the Journal Of Higher Education?
Do you question the voice of Earlham students as embodied in the campus newspaper?
Do you question the raw data of CDS and the trend it suggests?
Do you question the letter of their own Board of Directors description of unsustainable?
Do you question their own financial disclosure of on going deficits?
These are my points of reference versus my kid told me…
Rather than question my motivations please provide the unbiased reader with actual source material… The thread is entitled Earlham in the News. Let’s see you news I have offered mine.
Specifically where is Moody’s investor Services wrong? You erroneously brought Moody s up; “solid financial rating from both Moody’s” so let’s hear it? No hyperbole or wishfulness answer Moody’s concerns please.
Earlham isn’t hiding the challenges it faces. However, the new President just started and the College – faculty committee and Board – are working on curricular and financial plans. Those take time, so I’m not sure what more the College could do right now to satisfy this desire to see immediate changes. Continuing to beat the drum about “the sky is falling” is unfair to the College which is trying to work through these challenges in a deliberate, consensus-building way. Others have responded to you about various components of your observations, including the trends in international students, graduation rates etc. I live in Indiana and our high school sends low income, 1st gen kids to a Earlham where those kids’ and their families’ lives are transformed by the opportunities at Earlham. So I’d suggest to prospective families that they do their research, ask Admissions about the new President, the Board role, the faculty committee. And listen to the answers. I think they will find that Earlham is working diligently to address the challenges it faces.
If you want an example of a school which seems to be sticking its head in the sand about the challenges it faces, you might take a look at the Oberlin board.
@BB just to clarify in response #35 you state “Earlham has a solid financial rating from Moody’s”. You base your confidence in the school in part based on this incorrect assertion.
In reality Moody’s withdrew their ratings having down graded them twice and publishing a long list of financial and business model concerns. I provide the Moody’s report unedited in post #70.
Rather than assailing me perhaps you can address the concerns Moody’s raises? Also given that you used a theoretical “solid” Moody’s rating as encouraging for prospective students, how if at all does the reality of this damning assessment by Moody’s impact your view?
Also just saw you attacked another @ucbalumnus on another thread for being critical of Earlham. Why do you discourage any and all people from expressing their independent views? Just because your kid goes there doesn’t preclude others from having an informed opinion.
@Midwesternmomofboys "Earlham isn’t hiding the challenges it faces. However, the new President just started and the College – faculty committee and Board – are working on curricular and financial plans. "
Fully agree that changes are coming and the school does great things for kids (and particularly 1st gen, low income, etc…).
My point continues to be no one knows what those inevitable changes are. Unfortunately none of the options will have anything but a negative impact on an educational experience or are assured of success. Do they eliminate some of the dozen plus majors that have fewer than 5 annual graduates, do they fire staff, cut class offerings, continue to allow facilities to deteriorate as out lined in the schools paper, lessen financial aid. I don’t know and neither do you.
Something has to change and no option is pleasant to contemplate. So if you aren’t already at Earlham why would you take the risk of joining the community without at least contemplating the possible changes.
I am being repeatedly criticized for raising awareness of the situation and the inevitable change that is coming by people who want to ignore the financial realities because their children are already there. My concern isn’t for you and I am thrilled you are happy… unfortunately the kid graduating in 2028 will not have had the same experience as your kid and you owe those kids the honesty of that reality.
This thread has turned into a debating platform so I will close it.