<p>I know that there is another thread about this but I read through it and didn't find many personal opinions, more historyof the eating clubs. Can anyone tell me what they think of the clubs? Are they like country club-ish or more like frats? Or does it depend on which one you want to join? Are they expensive, really inviting or intimidating? Thanks for the info.</p>
<p>my personal opinion is that the clubs are very good, on balance. they provide a central, reliable social scene every weekend, at no cost to students and their friends. on any given thursday or saturday, all of the clubs will be "on tap" and many if not most will have some form of entertainment, whether it be dj, live band, or just house mix. most will be open to anyone with a princeton ID, and the rest will be open to student members and those with guest passes (easily obtainable from such members). most students, after determining their favorite clubs, divide their time on a given night between those few clubs, depending on what's going on. with free beer, it's easy to overdrink. but with safeguards at the doors, and club officers responsible for all goings-on inside, people are very responsive to problems. contrast this to social scenes at other schools, which consist largely of room parties featuring hard liquor and with little incentive to address problems. as for your other questions, the clubs are neither country-clubish nor fratlike, in that they are all accessible to all students and they are all open to both sexes (contrast this to harvard's all-male final clubs). they are more expensive eating options than ordinary meal plans, because the fees cover entertainment costs and general upkeep as well as meals, but the university offers financial aid to cover the difference. rambling, but i hope this helps!</p>
<p>Just want to say that f. scottie's comments echo almost word for word the ones I hear from Princeton students.</p>
<p>While the "Eating Clubs" have their on-campus detractors, the student body is generally self-selecting on the topic, in that potential applicants or potential matriculants who are uncomfortable with the concept generally choose not to apply, or. if admitted, choose to matriculate elsewhere.</p>
<p>Scottie's chronic efforts to compare the dominant role the "EAting Clubs" play with respect to social life at Princeton with the impact of the miniscule anbd relatively low-profile "secret societies" at Yale or "final clubs" at Harvard are highly dishonest and utterly without merit, as he well knows.</p>
<p>"Scottie's chronic efforts to compare the dominant role the 'EAting Clubs' play with respect to social life at Princeton with the impact of the miniscule anbd relatively low-profile 'secret societies' at Yale or 'final clubs' at Harvard are highly dishonest and utterly without merit, as he well knows."</p>
<p>there's no question that the eating clubs play a central role in princeton's social life. i've never denied that. in fact, i've argued in several threads that the very pervasiveness of the clubs is a good thing, because it doesn't segment a small group of "haves" from a larger one of "have nots." i fully understand, moreover, that harvard's final clubs and yale's secret societies play smaller roles in the social scenes of each school, though i'd hardly characterize their impacts as "miniscule" [sic]. i think both institutions are "worse" than eating clubs, because they pick their members, rather than the members picking them. only students (male students at harvard) deemed "worthy" by their senior peers are "tapped" for inclusion in these societies. at yale, the rest of the students never set foot in a society's tomb, and at harvard, the rest of the students face obstacles in doing so - it's my understanding that women still cannot enter certain rooms at final clubs. this, i believe, creates a sharper division between haves and have nots than at princeton, where any student with a pen or pencil can sign into one of the five clubs that practices a non-selective admissions procedure. a student can also "bicker" a selective club, for which the overall odds are much greater than 50/50, and if they happen to fail, they can still party at that club the remainder of their time at the school. even if they don't join any club (and a fraction of upperclassmen don't), they can still participate fully in the club social scene. now, while i personally wish that the remaining bicker clubs would drop their selective procedures, i can certainly understand why they retain them. simply put, people like to pick their mates, whether its roommates, teammates, or clubmates. still, i think the system is fairly egalitarian, and certainly serves princeton well. 98% of freshmen return for their sophomore year, 97% graduate, and a national-best ~60% give money to the university in any given year.</p>
<p>Guide to the eating clubs: <a href="http://www.princeton.edu/%7Eppf/guide.html%5B/url%5D">http://www.princeton.edu/~ppf/guide.html</a></p>
<p>Btw, Byerly, your impression of the clubs seems to date back to the days when Harvard house life (and not just the finals clubs) was cliquish and elitist.</p>
<p>Don't be absurd.</p>
<p>You seem to have adopted Scottie's patented "best defense is a good offense" approach.</p>
<p>Fortunately the Princeton administration is taking firm steps to marginalize the "Eating Clubs" rather than listening to you guys.</p>
<p>I give them 3 cheers for their effort.</p>
<p>Everyone has a different opinion and obviously there is no right or wrong answer. I visited Princeton and as I said in another forum it's something unique and something makes Princeton stand out. I spent a day there, talked to few people and stuff and although it wasn't perfect, I enjoyed the setting. I was talking to this cute girl and after a while she asked which dorm I was living ... its was funny afterwards but I left myself a mental note that if I get in- she's the first girl I ask out!
I don't know anything about this whole Princeton type or anything but the eating clubs- are one of the things that drives me towards Princeton! Princeton people, Princeton setting, Princeton smell, Princeton everything all adds up into something very darn sexy! Thats what I like and thats what I'm after!</p>
<p>Nothing is perfect, not even Harvard. If Harvard defined the word perfect then why doesn't every school rename themselves Harvard. Copy harvards curricullum, copy harvard's architecture, clone every proffessor at harvard?</p>
<p>Everyone is different and the same applies to colleges. There is no right and wrong and if you don't like it I don't like it then there's always Harvard right?</p>
<p>EDIT: this is gonna be funny- I'm waiting for all the opinions on this forum to start argueing AGAIN ... :p</p>
<p>Here's a letter that appeared in the September 14 edition:</p>
<p>"When I talk to promising high school seniors about where theyd like to attend college, first choices are often Brown, Harvard, Yale, Dartmouth, Bowdoin, Amherst, Williams, Swarthmore, Penn ... There is a pattern here. Obviously, many thousands apply to Princeton, which is just as selective as the most selective of these, and I may hang out with a crowd whose culture does not embrace Princetons reputation. But clearly, the eating-club scene is the number-one culprit for many students who shy away from Princeton.</p>
<p>Some may claim that Princetons reputation in this regard is unfair, although I dont think so. Ask yourself this question: How many fantastic and diverse students might Princeton attract if it werent the only major college in America (and perhaps the only college in America) where the majority of students take their meals and socialize at clubs? As Bob Levetown 56s letter (July 6) points out, this isnt necessarily because these students want to, but because the University has yet to create an attractive alternative.</p>
<p>In the end, I believe the best thing that Princeton could do for itself, and especially for how the world perceives it, would be to take effective measures to end its romance with the eating-club system.</p>
<p>JEFF PIDOT 69
Hallowell, Maine"</p>
<p>Byerly, I think it will be great when Princeton offers fuller options for students who are and are not interested in the eating clubs. </p>
<p>However, the letter above is misleading, since only upperclassmen eat in the clubs and undergrads have long had access to a very nice alternative -- the dining halls in each residential college -- as well as, more recently, to the Frist campus center. </p>
<p>And although it is true that many prospective students are turned off by the eating clubs, part of the problem is that there is a phenomenal amount of truly fantastical misinformation out there about them, thanks to the Net, certain novels, etc. Their reputation is quite different from the experience many students have of them. </p>
<p>Even in freshman year when friends of my d's from other, similar schools visit her on the Princeton campus, they were amazed at how many students she knew and what a broad range of friends she had made. The Street -- the whole area around and in the eating clubs -- is a social center for the whole campus, where students congregate and move from one club to another. Friends at other schools said Saturday night tended to be small, private groups in dorm rooms. Ironically, for all their supposed "clubbiness," the eating clubs bring students together.</p>
<p>From the new report on residential college dining halls:
Another goal of the task force is to increase access to the residential college dining system. Recommendations include a closer working relationship between the residential colleges and the eating clubs, increased hours of operation for residential college eating venues and a more diverse menu to support students with special dietary needs. The task force proposes shared contracts to allow students to take meals in both a college and a club, while encouraging the clubs to offer social memberships to students who dine in the residential colleges.</p>
<p>The report cites initial discussions between members of the task force, the administration and representatives of the eating clubs about developing new working relationships. "We believe that a truly significant opening has been forged here, an opening that can be exploited to the advantage of the colleges and clubs alike, but also one that could lead to generally improved relations between the clubs and the University, to the benefit of all concerned," the report says.</p>
<p>So the "Eating Clubs" and the University need to "improve their relations"? Interpreting these releases in order to understand what they are REALLY saying is like reading the official proclamations of the Central Committee of the Chinese Communist Party!</p>
<p>Agreed! Bear in mind that the eating clubs represent 70 percent of upperclassmen...as well as generations of alumni who maintain an affiliation with them both socially and financially.</p>
<p>Yes. The University is obviously walking on eggshells here.</p>
<p>Sorry for disturbing the argument here, but
Princeton beats harvard 27-24 in football :)
And according to what i have seen since i have come here, everyone seems to love the eating clubs, they are a nice social get together and a very good place to party at, so even if anyone did have any negative feelings before coming to princeton, it should have gone by now.</p>
<p>I am a prospective and I visited an eating club, Tiger Inn, this week. While I think it was a bicker club, the kids there were still really nice and the building was awesome. One of the girls also said they're pretty lax about what eating club you go to: she said she and her friends were in different eating clubs, and would compare menus for the day to see who had the best food (and then go eat at the best one, haha).</p>
<p>Here is a link to Princeton's own work on the future of the clubs, residential colleges and the whole eating thing. </p>
<p>Download the Report of Dining and Social Options</p>
<p><a href="http://www.princeton.edu/%7Evp/cpuc/%5B/url%5D">http://www.princeton.edu/%7Evp/cpuc/</a></p>
<p>The University appears to be looking at some tweaking of the present system. My feelings are is that they are intending to make 4 year colleges the norm in the future which may eventually wind up affecting the future of the clubs. I really think the current administration is opposed to the elitism of some of the clubs but is uneasy to speak publicly on the issue due to alumni concerns. Who can blame them with the generous support the alumni are famous for. If the younger Princeton Alumni see the clubs being detrimental to campus life the clubs may become less important. It will be a slow process one way or another.</p>
<p></p>
<p>I think the administration is on the right path. Having gone to school there myself 30 years ago, and now with a freshman D, I really believe they are keeping the good parts of the clubs (i.e. central place for socializing, wide variety of options, history, tradition) and merging them into a broader social fabric established with the residential colleges. The idea of a 4 year college, where an eating club is an option but not a requirement, makes enormous sense for Princeton. The place will keep its intimacy and now will provide an alternative social path with community for those who don't choose clubs. Tilghman is no dummy.</p>
<p>Perhaps Tilghman and Malkiel would eventually like to see the phasing out of the eating clubs. Many Forbesians become unhappy towards the end of their sophomore year as leaving the Inn dooms near. Creating more Forbes like experiences may prove successful at Princeton. How will the clubs survive if they don't have enough members as 4 year colleges become the prevalent system?</p>
<p>After people have better options and stop eating there, the places will no doubt seek to survive by being "drinking clubs" rather than "eating clubs" - which is probably closer to the truth anyway.</p>