EFC $6K - but aid packages incl $25K or $35K parent loan?

Paying for College
1

<p>First child in college. She applied to 9 school. First 2 financial aid awards received. </p>

<h1>1: $25K in aid for a school that is $50K (includes a $19K scholarship, and $6K in student loan).</h1>

<h1>2: $43K in aid includes a $33K parent loan</h1>

<p>Sort of shocked by this as our EFC on FAFSA was $6K, our combined income for a family of 4 is under $70K. I've emailed the two above universities, asking about appeal but don't expect them to really bridge the gap (it's a BIG gap). One of the 9 we're waiting on is an Ivy (long, long shot). She's been admitted into 6 of her 9 so far (she's a dancer and the process is via audition).</p>

<p>Is this typical? Makes me sick to my stomach. She's a kid who has worked very hard, and has gotten in to some very hard-to-get-into programs...but we absolutely cannot carry a $100K loan over the next 4 years.</p>

2

<p>First, are any of these schools in state public with need met? If not, you don’t expect much aid to cover the CoA. Second, for most students, the final cost is much higher than their EFC even after government grant/loan and scholarships.
You should look up the financial aid profile of the schools.</p>

3

<p>I don’t have any idea if it’s typical, I just wanted to say I’m very sorry you have to deal with this.</p>

4

<p>Most schools don’t meet need, or ‘meet’ it through loans. It is a shock to the parents, but if you want to go to ‘that’ school, you have to pay for it. I received the first financial aid estimate and it said ‘Your OOP is $0!’ and I was thrilled until I looked just above that statement to see that it included $30k in loans for me and $5500 for my child. No, not exactly free. (But she is going to that school, without loans, because we found scholarships).</p>

<p>Many parents expect their good students to get more in scholarships/grants than they do. They have all worked hard, but in the US higher education is not free to those who work hard, and it very much limits choices if you can’t pay. One of my daughters had many more choices than the other because she had an athletic hook and top grades. Her chosen school costs twice as much as her sister’s, but my out of pocket is less than half of the ‘cheaper’ school because of scholarships and grants.</p>

<p>You should check if there are department scholarships available (I’m assuming the $19k is a merit scholarship for academics) for dance, or outside scholarships from her high school, any civic organizations in your area (Rotary, Elks, American Legion). You need to start chipping away at the amount in the gap. My daughter has a big merit aid scholarship, a big athletic scholarship, but 3 little ones that also help, and she’s still looking for more of those. Other daughter just has 3 little scholarships, but she’s hoping to get a few more.</p>

5

<p>Yes, it’s typical. For a lot of schools, the EFC is expected to be paid out of pocket with the family’s own private means, be it savings, 401k money, 529’s, or private bank loans (non PLUS.) All financial aid from the school can consist of scholarships, grants, work study, student loans, and, yeah, parent PLUS loans. </p>

<p>People forget that admissions people at universities view the student working hard to primarily get into the school, only. Financing is another ballgame, especially if the student is OOS or applying to a private school. Also, fine arts in a lot of universities are, unfortunately, low man on the totem pole for funding. My daughter is also a dancer, but she decided not to pursue it for a host of reasons, one of them lack of funding locally (she didn’t want to go out of state.)</p>

6

<p>Thanks - I wish we had 401k, 529s or money in savings. We don’t. We scrape by and do OK. </p>

<p>She is waiting on a host of local scholarships she applied for locally. Is there still time to find more at this point? None of these are in-state. Only In State we are waiting on is UMass Amherst. She has the Abigail Adams scholarhip, but that’s only free tuition (not “only”, but if you understand how they structure tuition/fees - you know what I mean). Of course, this is the absolute, it’s “better than staying at home and not going to college at all” place. :slight_smile: This stinks. I don’t even think we’d get APPROVED for a Parent Loan of $30K a year for 4 years - on an income less than $70K. There is no way we’d be able to make the payments. It’s like a second mortgage.</p>

7

<p>Good luck, it’s not usually a good idea for a Parent to take on $100,000 in PLUS loans …not to mention if your D is a dance major her income is not necessarily going to be high enough to handle any contribution toward a Parent loan in addition to any loans she needs to take on. Hopefully your local public will come through and meet your need better and an EFC of $6000 for income of yours is not bad, but it does indicate there are not many assets to tap. Many people find their EFC to be 20-30% of their income. Many publics still try to do their best to meet need for in-state kids. </p>

8

<p>Gaps between EFC and awarded aid are quite common. There’s not a school out there that promises to meet need as defined by the FAFSA for all students. Are the gaps usually as large as the ones you’re facing? I don’t know.</p>

<p>I hope UMass comes through for you. Are there some other in-state options or smaller schools where you can apply at this date? I’ve been hearing ads on the radio for colleges with an April 1 deadline, but obviously I don’t live anywhere near you. </p>

9

<p>There are other things you can do too if grants/scholarships don’t come through. A non-working parent can get a job, or the parents can get second jobs (not as easy if there are younger children at home). My grandmother did that for my uncle in 1957, so it isn’t a new idea. You could sell things you no longer need, and while I realize a garage sale is not going to yield $30k, you might get spending money out of it. You can look at that $60k bill from the college and see where you can cut down. Are there cheaper meal plans, cheaper dorms, used books, not taking a car to school. From the stats you posted, you’ll likely get a $2500 tax credit which could help in the spring if you are on a payment plan. Is your daughter willing to give up the ‘extras’ to go to a more expensive school? No spring break vacations, no weekend ski trips, having to work during the summers and maybe the school year? </p>

<p>My daughter knows that if she doesn’t keep her grades up or she doesn’t want to play her sport anymore, she can’t stay at her chosen school because those scholarships keep the cost of the school competitive with a state school. I don’t have that much money, I’m not willing to take out loans, and I don’t want them to have loans either. We found schools we can afford and that will challenge my kids but that will still allow them financial breathing room. Some people don’t mind loans, but I do. Some people don’t want their kids working during the school year but I prefer that to loans. You have to decide what you feel most comfortable with.</p>

<p>It is a shock when you realize how much you are expected to pay. Take a drink of water, chart out all the schools, costs, and how you will pay, and then weigh the facts. How much debt are you willing to take on? How much are you willing to give up? How much is your daughter willing to work? Ask each school for more, but when you have the final numbers, cross off the ones that just won’t work financially and move on.</p>

10

<p>It all depends upon the schools that are on your daughter’s list as to how well they will meet the family need. The vast majority of schools do NOT meet full need, and not a one guarantees to meet need as defined by FAFSA EFC. That EFC figure for kids looking to go away to school is the absolute minimum a family has to pay before becoming eligible for any federal aid like grants, work study or subsidized loans. </p>

<p>Did you run NPCs for each of the schools on the list? See what the schools’ own calculators say they are likely to give you. If you come up with something similar as your DD’s packages on the two schools from which you’ve gotten awards, you can see that you could have done this up front and not gotten so surprised. If the calculators come up with better numbers than what was offered, I would certainly use this info when appealing the awards. You are absolutely correct that the Parent Loan is not an award. It’s a suggestion of where you can borrow the money for about 8% a year if you even qualify for the loan which is not an auto approve. I strongly feel it does not belong in the financial aid packages making it look like the school is giving you something when it absolutely is not. </p>

<p>Do run the numbers and see what the ivy aid results are. Are any of the schools PROFILE schools? Though they tend to meet need better, they define their own need, not use the EFC, and you can see what a fairly generous school (the ivy) expects you and your DD to pay.</p>

<p>But, yes, the packages you’ve seen are typical from those schools that have large gaps between what they can provide in aid and what the EFC is. They do not meet need most of the time. </p>

<p>Merit awards are great, but many are for just one year, and be aware the costs tend to go up each year. Also upperclass housing is often more expensive as they tend to be suite style and apartments, not the dorm room doubles. If there is plentiful safe, cheap housing off campus, some savings can be realized, but that is not often the case if the school is in a high rent area.</p>

<p>When all of the packages arrive, make sure you look at what the bottom line cost, minus loans and workstudy is for each scool. Your DD will be eligible to take out $5500 in Direct Student loans for each school, so strip them from those packages that include them as you can add them back in anywhere, and work study not guaranteed all of the time and she can work most anywhere. Look at what the bare bones cost is for each option. Then look at which ones are doable with work and loans that are available.</p>

<p>UMass looks like the best deal so far. Does the Abigail Adams award also include fees? Mass colleges have very low tuition but high fees. If the award covers tuition and fees, that means the Direct loans, summer and part time work on her part could cover a lot of the room and board with you pitching in to meet the gap. Otherwise, start looking at local state options. </p>

11

<p>If the colleges do not guarantee to meet full need, then this can, and does happen. If you didn’t complete a CSS Profile, then your student did not apply to a school that guarantees to meet full need (well…Princeton has it’s own form instead of the Profile). The FAFSA EFC should then be viewed as the minimum you would be exoected to pay each year.</p>

<p>It sounds like your daughter applied to some private universities, or perhaps OOS public universities.</p>

<p>Is UMASS Amherst affordable with the scholarship she will receive?</p>

12

<p>Did you and she run the net price calculators on each school’s web site before applying? If not, you may want to do that now to get estimates of what you may get.</p>

13

<p>She actually did apply to a few that had the CSS Profile. Those admission results are released March 26/27 and April 1st. As for UMass Amherst, COA is $24K, Abigail Adams is tuition only (no fees - and the fees make up the majority of the price). Have no idea about what our package would look like. The OOS universities were private. It’s the dancer catch-22. These are very, very hard to get into - only admitting a handful of kids each year - they are conservatories in a larger university setting. But we have never been in the same financial bracket as many others that dance around her, and have had yard sales, bake sales, sold stuff, took 3rd jobs etc to keep DD dancing. Her situation is a bit different from the average college-bound kid. But like anything else, it comes at a price. Hoping that we will get better news from the others we are waiting for. </p>

14

<p>It sounds like your daughter has applied to dance programs in conservatory settings within universities. Most of these programs give their aid based on the strength of the audition (relative to all those who auditioned this year). It is a very tough seat to be in (our son was a music major…so I do understand). At this point, you will just have to wait and see.</p>

<p>I will say…in our experience, there was not a lot of need based financial aid in the fine arts. And merit was very competitive.</p>

15

<p>Yes, thumper1. This is the exact type of program she has gotten into. So it’s wonderful that she’s been admitted to 4 of the top programs in the country - but a real bummer if we can’t swing it. I so wish we could just write a check. :)</p>

16

<p>In all likelihood, even if you get approved for $30,OOO in PLUS loans the first year, you won’t be the second year, not with a 70,000 yearly income. So the option you described just isn’t feasible.
What happened is you’ve been gapped - these schools don’t “meet need” (even if need is defined in various ways, for middle class and lower income families, these tend to have the best packages) so they can just offer whatever they want to offer in the financial aid package, and then it’s not their problem whether you find money to attend or not. :frowning:
Hopefully the other schools will come through - it sounds like these are “meet need” schools (women’s colleges, NESCAC, Ivy League all have their dates around then so I assume one or two of the schools you’re waiting on are among those.)</p>

17

<p>Yeah - that $100K is not even in the realm of possibility. It’s like a 2nd mortgage! Yes, the others are “meet need” schools (like 100% of need - Ivy - a very, very long shot, a few long shots). She got in to Fordham/Alvin Ailey, but we haven’t seen any financials from them yet. It just stinks for it to be soooo close for her after all these years. Fingers crossed that one of these schools comes through with something for her. I’m sure we are not the only family waiting like this. Although many of the boards I read about these dance kids make it seem like finances are not even an issue. And perhaps they aren’t. But for us? They sure are. </p>

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<p>Oh, and I sure wish we know about this “getting gapped” before all this. I have to say her HS did a poor job of preparing parents - we did lots of reading, research, etc - but with the dance thing - there’s always a chance of talent awards - although it really depends on the pool. I’m sure they have people in line behind my DD who could probably just pay the tuition. :(</p>

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<p>Once you get the financials for each school, be sure to share those with the high school so that they can be more aware of this issue. Most schools are awful in this area, and families with bad pkgs need to show these folks that the money is often a problem.</p>

20

<p>As you say…the merit awards are based on the strength on the audition. In that regard, it does not matter what financial need is. </p>

<p>Mom2, this student applied to audition based dance programs. What happened to THIS student is not necessarily an indicator of what will happen to others. </p>

<p>And as mentioned before, many schools are NOT allowed to inquire about family finances.</p>

<p>With regards to the fine arts, it is NOT a secret that merit awards are based on audition strength.</p>